Who's infallible? Who's not?

[Katzpur]

This thread is open to everyone. However, due to the subject matter, it will be of interest primarily to Latter-day Saints and Roman Catholics.

This past summer I attended an LDS Apologetics Conference. One speaker made a statement which got a lot of laughs. I just thought I'd share it and see what you think of it:

"In Catholicism, the Pope’s infallible, but no one believes it. In Mormonism, the Prophet’s fallible, but no one believes it."

 

[StephenSmith]

In a galaxy Far, far away.....

Yoda is infallable :biglaugh:

 

[Nehustan]

I'm infallible, while all other humans are fallible, and this is fallacious.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I fully agree with the sentiment about ALL prophets being fallible. I would probably disagree with y'all about WHO is a prophet and who is not, but the Bible has no perfect people in it and states as such.

 

[Aqualung]

I don't think she means "perfect," but rather, when they start discussing doctrine or stuff like that, they're always right. (maybe that's what she means, anyway...)

 

[michel]

I'm infallible, while all other humans are fallible, and this is fallacious.

I agree; no human can be infallible; the only being who could be infallible would be God.

 

[Fluffy]

God could be infalliable if he wanted to. There is no reason why he would be unable to tell a lie.

 

[Solon]

This thread is open to everyone. However, due to the subject matter, it will be of interest primarily to Latter-day Saints and Roman Catholics.

This past summer I attended an LDS Apologetics Conference. One speaker made a statement which got a lot of laughs. I just thought I'd share it and see what you think of it:

"In Catholicism, the Pope’s infallible, but no one believes it. In Mormonism, the Prophet’s fallible, but no one believes it."

To which prophet do you refer, Young, Smith or Pratt, you LDS, you have to have a lot of blind faith methinks.

S

 

[SoyLeche]

To which prophet do you refer, Young, Smith or Pratt, you LDS, you have to have a lot of blind faith methinks.

S

I'm thinking that she is referring to Hinkley. Pratt was never "The Prophet" (i.e. President of the Church), so he's out.

 

[Bishka]

That is so true.

 

[Quiddity]

I think the thread title should change to "When did infallibility end? And who had it?" Because if pushed, Protestants won't deny that Paul was infallible. And he was human. He was certainly infallible when he penned the scriptures.

~Victor

 

[SoyLeche]

I think the thread title should change to "When did infallibility end? And who had it?" Because if pushed, Protestants won't deny that Paul was infallible. And he was human. He was certainly infallible when he penned the scriptures.

~Victor

I'd deny that Paul was infallible, and he would probably agree

 

[Quiddity]

I'd deny that Paul was infallible, and he would probably agree

I meant to say Inspired. Sorry about that.
Nonetheless, I'd be interested in reading your understanding of infallibility.

~Victor

 

[SoyLeche]

I meant to say Inspired. Sorry about that.
Nonetheless, I'd be interested in reading your understanding of infallibility.

~Victor

My understanding of what infallible means (and if I am wrong, please correct me) is "incapable of making a mistake/sinning". I would definately agreee that Paul was inspired.

 

[Quiddity]

SL, your understanding is incorrect. The Pope most certainly can sin.
Can the Pope make mistakes?
He can make mistakes in everything except when he is speaking to the “whole church” in relation to doctrinal matters. Otherwise known as ex-cathedra. He can make mistakes in the following areas:

Science
Disciplinary matters
Personal letters
Private conversations
His actions / sin

If you need more explanation go to:
Catholic Church has never changed Doctrine
post#59

 

[SoyLeche]

SL, your understanding is incorrect. The Pope most certainly can sin.
Can the Pope make mistakes?
He can make mistakes in everything except when he is speaking to the “whole church” in relation to doctrinal matters. Otherwise known as ex-cathedra. He can make mistakes in the following areas:

Science
Disciplinary matters
Personal letters
Private conversations
His actions / sin

If you need more explanation go to:
Catholic Church has never changed Doctrine
post#59

I was pretty sure that my thoughts were wrong, but I'm also fairly certain that there are a lot of people with the same idea.

 

[nutshell]

SL, your understanding is incorrect. The Pope most certainly can sin.
Can the Pope make mistakes?
He can make mistakes in everything except when he is speaking to the “whole church” in relation to doctrinal matters. Otherwise known as ex-cathedra. He can make mistakes in the following areas:

Science
Disciplinary matters
Personal letters
Private conversations
His actions / sin

If you need more explanation go to:
Catholic Church has never changed Doctrine
post#59

I would say your explanation is identical to how LDS view the Prophets. As men, they can make mistakes, but when speaking to the Church they are, in fact, infallible.

 

[michel]

I would say your explanation is identical to how LDS view the Prophets. As men, they can make mistakes, but when speaking to the Church they are, in fact, infallible.

Can anyone actually be infallible ? It seems a impossibility.

 

[Quiddity]

Can anyone actually be infallible ? It seems a impossibility.

In a similar way that St. Paul penned things without error. Do you believe in that?

~Victor

 

[Scuba Pete]

And he was human. He was certainly infallible when he penned the scriptures.

Where does this doctrine come from? Certainly not the Scriptures. Paul contended that he was THE MOST SINFUL PERSON on the face of the earth, and I cannot ever remember him saying that his writings would not contain error. Only Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit are perfect. EVERYTHING AND EVERYONE ELSE has "issues".