Why all the hubbub over the name?

[Katzpur]

Oh, I see, the LDS have their own DIR now. One way to keep the X-Mormons away.

I don't know what you're talking about, Ellen. We've always had our own DIR and you've always been able to post there.

 

[MJS]

Well, use your brain. Do you, for one minute, think that a major advertising campaign that was in effect for several years would not have been approved by the First Presidency? The First Presidency does not make a habit of informing the general Church membership of every decision they make, but how many thousands of members responded to the Church's invitation for us to submit a personal profile to the "I'm a Mormon" website? I know I did. Are we all guilty of contributing to a "victory for Satan?" Seriously? If I were to write a news article about the Church or were to speak about the Church to a group of people about the Church, I'd use its full, correct name. But in daily life, if I refer to the teachings of "Mormonism" rather than to the teachings of "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints," I will do so without any pangs of conscience.

You might want to work on your delivery then.

You do seem to be ignoring the key points of my argument, which is that President Nelson has declared that God gave him this specific direction. What do you make of that? Do you think that he is telling the truth?

 

[Katzpur]

You do seem to be ignoring the key points of my argument, which is that President Nelson has declared that God gave him this specific direction. What do you make of that? Do you think that he is telling the truth?

I'm sure he felt inspired to say what he did and is "telling the truth" as he sees it, and I have no argument with our using the full name of the Church. I've already said that two or three times. I just find it odd that God didn't make His offense made known much earlier -- like before the "I'm a Mormon" campaign was implemented or before the Church came out with the "Meet the Mormons" movie that showed in theaters all over the country. Surely He didn't just suddenly become "offended" overnight. Was President Monson guilty of scoring a victory for Satan when he apparently had no issues with the use of the word "Mormon"? You seem to be ignoring the plain common sense argument that I'm setting forward. Different Presidents of the Church have used the word "revelation" somewhat differently, and President Nelson seems to use it in a much broader context than have some of his predecessors.

By the way, for years and years, the Church's leadership stressed that while there is no such thing as "the Mormon Church" or "the Church of the Latter-day Saints," the word "Mormon," when used in a non-derogatory way, and especially to refer to well-known entities such as the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, is acceptable. Now, all of a sudden, it seems that this usage is some kind of major sin. We can continue hashing this back and forth for as long as you want to, but I'm not going to change my mind and I'm sure you're not either.

 

[Katzpur]

I could? I didn't know that. Thank you.

You're posting in the LDS DIR right now.

 

[MJS]

I'm sure he felt inspired to say what he did and is "telling the truth" as he sees it, and I have no argument with our using the full name of the Church. I've already said that two or three times. I just find it odd that God didn't make His offense made known much earlier -- like before the "I'm a Mormon" campaign was implemented or before the Church came out with the "Meet the Mormons" movie that showed in theaters all over the country. Surely He didn't just suddenly become "offended" overnight. Was President Monson guilty of scoring a victory for Satan when he apparently had no issues with the use of the word "Mormon"? You seem to be ignoring the plain common sense argument that I'm setting forward. Different Presidents of the Church have used the word "revelation" somewhat differently, and President Nelson seems to use it in a much broader context than have some of his predecessors.

By the way, for years and years, the Church's leadership stressed that while there is no such thing as "the Mormon Church" or "the Church of the Latter-day Saints," the word "Mormon," when used in a non-derogatory way, and especially to refer to well-known entities such as the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, is acceptable. Now, all of a sudden, it seems that this usage is some kind of major sin. We can continue hashing this back and forth for as long as you want to, but I'm not going to change my mind and I'm sure you're not either.

I absolutely agree that it does seem odd. But what I find more odd is the "I'm a Mormon" campaign, not the direction from President Nelson.

As to why this is happening now and did not happen before, I can't say. But this is a church of continuing revelation. In the early days of the church vicarious baptisms for the dead were performed in rivers, and then Joseph Smith received a revelation that from then on that ordinance would be preserved for the temple only. Why did Joseph Smith not receive that revelation before the saints started baptizing vicariously in the river? I'm not sure.

I think perhaps it is just the Lord teaching us that there is a higher and a better way, and revealing it now as an invitation to obey and to be a little better. Perhaps the Lord was not offended before, but now that He has given that direction He is, because that is turning away from His direction and the words of His prophet.

So yes, common sense perhaps does not apply here. But aren't members of the church supposed to be uncommon? A "peculiar people"? Not everything makes sense right away all the time.

Anyway, I deeply apologize if I have offended anyone. I am usually direct in the way I speak but also non-confrontational, but that sometimes does not translate well to written messages. If you had been speaking to me face to face I don't think you would have felt that I am accusing you, just trying to provide my perspective.

 

[Truth_Faith13]

I'm sure he felt inspired to say what he did and is "telling the truth" as he sees it, and I have no argument with our using the full name of the Church. I've already said that two or three times. I just find it odd that God didn't make His offense made known much earlier -- like before the "I'm a Mormon" campaign was implemented or before the Church came out with the "Meet the Mormons" movie that showed in theaters all over the country. Surely He didn't just suddenly become "offended" overnight. Was President Monson guilty of scoring a victory for Satan when he apparently had no issues with the use of the word "Mormon"? You seem to be ignoring the plain common sense argument that I'm setting forward. Different Presidents of the Church have used the word "revelation" somewhat differently, and President Nelson seems to use it in a much broader context than have some of his predecessors.

By the way, for years and years, the Church's leadership stressed that while there is no such thing as "the Mormon Church" or "the Church of the Latter-day Saints," the word "Mormon," when used in a non-derogatory way, and especially to refer to well-known entities such as the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, is acceptable. Now, all of a sudden, it seems that this usage is some kind of major sin. We can continue hashing this back and forth for as long as you want to, but I'm not going to change my mind and I'm sure you're not either.

Hi Katz, long time no speak! Just decided to have a browse of these forums and came across this post.....

So do you do think that he wasn’t speaking as a prophet in revelation but more his own opinion?

 

[Katzpur]

Hi Katz, long time no speak! Just decided to have a browse of these forums and came across this post.....

Wow! So nice to see you! How've you been?

So do you do think that he wasn’t speaking as a prophet in revelation but more his own opinion?

There are revelations and there are revelations. I wouldn't say that it was just "his own opinion." The Church's leadership has asked for years and years that people not call the Church "the Mormon Church" or "the Church of the Latter-day Saints." After all, we're talking about an organization that we believe to have been established by "Jesus Christ." His name is obviously the most important part of the name of the Church. I do not doubt in the slightest that President Nelson felt inspired to remind us of that and to reiterate how important it is for us to remember who we are when we are representing the Church. I just felt that the words he used in conveying the message were unduly harsh. I work a couple of days a week down at the Salt Lake City Visitors Center, and am constantly directing people over to Temple Square. People will come in and say, "I understand that the Mormon Tabernacle Choir" is rehearsing tonight and that non-Mormons are welcome to attend. Is that right?" I'll simply answer their question and not correct them by saying, "Well, the correct name of the choir in question is the Tabernacle Choir at Temple Square, and if you are not a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints you are indeed welcome to attend." I believe that the essence of President Nelson's message was revealed to him but I don't believe the Lord told him what words to use or to imply that when we do not use the full name of the Church, it is a "victory for Satan."

 

[Truth_Faith13]

Wow! So nice to see you! How've you been?

There are revelations and there are revelations. I wouldn't say that it was just "his own opinion." The Church's leadership has asked for years and years that people not call the Church "the Mormon Church" or "the Church of the Latter-day Saints." After all, we're talking about an organization that we believe to have been established by "Jesus Christ." His name is obviously the most important part of the name of the Church. I do not doubt in the slightest that President Nelson felt inspired to remind us of that and to reiterate how important it is for us to remember who we are when we are representing the Church. I just felt that the words he used in conveying the message were unduly harsh. I work a couple of days a week down at the Salt Lake City Visitors Center, and am constantly directing people over to Temple Square. People will come in and say, "I understand that the Mormon Tabernacle Choir" is rehearsing tonight and that non-Mormons are welcome to attend. Is that right?" I'll simply answer their question and not correct them by saying, "Well, the correct name of the choir in question is the Tabernacle Choir at Temple Square, and if you are not a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints you are indeed welcome to attend." I believe that the essence of President Nelson's message was revealed to him but I don't believe the Lord told him what words to use or to imply that when we do not use the full name of the Church, it is a "victory for Satan."

I am good thanks! I don't know how many children I had the last time I was on these forums but I have 3 now. Same place, not really found a church home. Feel a little bit mormon, a little bit catholic and a little bit own brand! Hope you are keeping well?

 

[Katzpur]

I am good thanks! I don't know how many children I had the last time I was on these forums but I have 3 now. Same place, not really found a church home. Feel a little bit mormon, a little bit catholic and a little bit own brand! Hope you are keeping well?

Yes, you had three the last time you were here, but one was just a baby. We're doing well. Took a cruise to the Scandinavian Countries and Baltic States earlier this month. Had lots of fun.

As far as your spiritual path is concerned, I can't help but feel as if letting your conscience be your guide is your best bet.