Why are “some atheists” so intolerant of religious believers?

[Dan From Smithville]

Our atheists are also gluten & GMO free.

There is another reason, & it afflicts people of many different religious orientations.....
They get angry if people don't acknowledge them as having The Truth.
I experience that here from liberals, conservatives, believers, non-believers, etc.
Disagree with them, & they get vicious.
Tis best to mostly avoid them.

The theists are also gluten and GMO free. I am not sure about the agnostics.

 

[Revoltingest]

The theists are also gluten and GMO free. I am not sure about the agnostics.

Let's cook one to see.

 

[Trailblazer]

I wouldn't assume that their attitude toward you is their attitude to religious people in general.

No, I do not assume that. The negative attitude is mostly towards Baha'is.

I said "We are discriminated against because the forum owner has a vendetta against my religion. Christians and Jews are tolerated as long as they do not talk too much about God or their religious beliefs."

 

[Trailblazer]

Which freethinkers forum were you writing your posts, please?
No compulsion though.
Regards

Sorry, I cannot reveal the name here.

 

[Trailblazer]

There's no entrance requirements or even consistent belief system. Atheists can be intelligent or not, polite or not, blue eyed or not, left-handed or not.

The only atheist that speaks for me is me.

Having said that, web sites and forums have culture in the same way everything does. If you find yourself in a place with a poor prevailing culture and you can't be part of the solution, it's best to leave.

Likewise, believers can be intelligent or not, polite or not, blue eyed or not, left-handed or not.

The only believer who "should be" speaking for me is me, but "some of" these atheists speak for me as if they know my thoughts, feelings and motives, and they don't even understand why is wrong with that.

I should have known better than to try to fit into a culture where I don't fit in. I did it more than once but I think I am finally done now. It was just not meant to be, I am too disruptive to their non-beliefs, being the kind of believer that I am, not wishy-washy.

 

[Trailblazer]

Needling people about what they believe is terrible. Making false statements against them is the worst.

That's exactly it. One is mean, the other is unjust. Injustice is worse than meanness, Imo.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No, I do not assume that. The negative attitude is mostly towards Baha'is.

I said "We are discriminated against because the forum owner has a vendetta against my religion. Christians and Jews are tolerated as long as they do not talk too much about God or their religious beliefs."

Your thread title talked about "some atheists" and "religious believers." If you actually meant to ask about why one particular guy behaved this way to one particular religion, it would have been clearer.

 

[IBdaMann]

I understand that a lot of atheists are ex-believers who were hurt by Christianity but it is not fair to take that out on me.
...

I am interested in what the atheists on this forum have to say about this, but I am also open to hearing the opinions of believers.

I will give you the correct answer. Those atheists you mention simply were not atheists. Yes, they call themselves atheists, they INSIST they are atheists, but your first clue that they are fanatical theists is their very intolerance of your religion. Religions have been at war with each other since there have been religions. You can bet that you were attacked by someone with a different theism who merely claimed to be an atheist out of cowardice. Claiming to be an atheist renders one invulnerable because his faith can no longer be attacked.

What religion, you might ask, were these "atheists" then? Dollars to donuts they were either Marxist of some sort (e.g. communist, socialist, progressive, etc.) or Global Warming / Climate Change. These are all related fanatical religions of hatred and intolerance and Christianity is their primary rival/competitor.

Dollars to donuts that when you were told by those jerks that they were atheists, that you took those claims at face value ... and then you started begrudging actual atheists who never did anything to you.

Look, if I had wanted Hillary Clinton to win, I could have put a Hillary bumper sticker on my car *OR* I could have put a Trump/Pence sticker on my car and drove around the city like a mad man, cutting people off, flipping people the bird, pissing everyone off while getting them angry at Trump, not at Hillary. A Global Warming theist isn't going to be intellectually honest. He's going to tell you he's an atheist and then go after your faith.

So, the next time you encounter an "atheist" who is attacking your faith, you owe it to yourself to punch back by attacking Global Warming. Watch as he goes into a tizzy-fit because you aren't supposed to be riling his religious sensitivities ... he's supposed to be able to just attack you with impunity.

If you're not up for the task, PLEASE forward it on to me and let me snipe away.

Oh, and review the first post in this thread for future reference: Reference Manaual for the Global Warming Mythology |

 

[Trailblazer]

I think we should speak up when we feel offended or wronged because sometimes people do not even realize that what they are doing hurts us or offends us. That is why I always speak up, but I only talk about myself, I do not speak for others because I cannot know why they do what they do...

I guess I was searching for answers as to what this atheist might have done what he did, but now I realize that nobody can know that but him, and maybe he does not even know. What I do know is that I did not have the behavior or motives he implied, but I also know I cannot control what he thinks about me, all I can do is point out what I actually did and why.

How difficult it is to know all our own motives given that 95% of our thoughts are unconscious, so how much LESS can someone else know our motives.

One thing I do know is that I am sincere and I do not lie, so for someone to say my motives are not what I think they are is to imply I am either lying or I am unaware of myself. But I am pretty self-aware because I spent many, many years in counseling and 12 step programs working on myself and I am very introspective, analyzing myself constantly.

I know for example that I gravitate towards atheists rather than believers. It is like I have always preferred the company of people who are different from me, and in certain ways I am more like an atheist and in other ways I am more like a believer. Maybe that is because my father was an atheist and my mother retained her Christian beliefs, even though she never talked about them and none of the three children ever saw a Bible or the inside of a church.

So I was brought up essentially as a nonbeliever and then at age 17 I suddenly became a Baha'i. But at that time I never had any feelings towards God and I still struggle to have any feelings towards this God I am supposed to love. That puts me at odds with all the other Baha'is and I feel kind of ashamed to associate with them, yet I have no doubt the God exists, so I am definitely a believer.

I feel kind of like a woman without a country, and maybe be that is why I gravitated towards that forum I just left for so long, as many of the people there are kind of different. It is kind of like a little club, with only a few regular posters and I guess I wanted to belong because I never fit in anywhere as a child. But I did not fit in on that forum because they assumed I was just like all the other believers and most of them were atheists who did not respect believers very much. So here I am. Maybe I will fit in here.

 

[Revoltingest]

I will give you the correct answer. Those atheists you mention simply were not atheists. Yes, they call themselves atheists, they INSIST they are atheists, but your first clue that they are fanatical theists is their very intolerance of your religion. Religions have been at war with each other since there have been religions. You can bet that you were attacked by someone with a different theism who merely claimed to be an atheist out of cowardice. Claiming to be an atheist renders one invulnerable because his faith can no longer be attacked.

What religion, you might ask, were these "atheists" then? Dollars to donuts they were either Marxist of some sort (e.g. communist, socialist, progressive, etc.) or Global Warming / Climate Change. These are all related fanatical religions of hatred and intolerance and Christianity is their primary rival/competitor.

Dollars to donuts that when you were told by those jerks that they were atheists, that you took those claims at face value ... and then you started begrudging actual atheists who never did anything to you.

Look, if I had wanted Hillary Clinton to win, I could have put a Hillary bumper sticker on my car *OR* I could have put a Trump/Pence sticker on my car and drove around the city like a mad man, cutting people off, flipping people the bird, pissing everyone off while getting them angry at Trump, not at Hillary. A Global Warming theist isn't going to be intellectually honest. He's going to tell you he's an atheist and then go after your faith.

So, the next time you encounter an "atheist" who is attacking your faith, you owe it to yourself to punch back by attacking Global Warming. Watch as he goes into a tizzy-fit because you aren't supposed to be riling his religious sensitivities ... he's supposed to be able to just attack you with impunity.

If you're not up for the task, PLEASE forward it on to me and let me snipe away.

Oh, and review the first post in this thread for future reference: Reference Manaual for the Global Warming Mythology |

I'm fairly sure that some of the nastiest heathens
I've known are not playing Poe when they misbehave.

 

[Trailblazer]

Your thread title talked about "some atheists" and "religious believers." If you actually meant to ask about why one particular guy behaved this way to one particular religion, it would have been clearer.

Sorry that was unclear. When I said "some atheists" I was actually thinking of a particular atheist, and I clarified that in what I wrote. However, there were other atheists on that forum who are even more intolerant of believers so it is more than just this one atheist. However it is the atheist forum owner who is specifically intolerant of my religion.

 

[Trailblazer]

I will give you the correct answer. Those atheists you mention simply were not atheists. Yes, they call themselves atheists, they INSIST they are atheists, but your first clue that they are fanatical theists is their very intolerance of your religion. Religions have been at war with each other since there have been religions. You can bet that you were attacked by someone with a different theism who merely claimed to be an atheist out of cowardice. Claiming to be an atheist renders one invulnerable because his faith can no longer be attacked.

What religion, you might ask, were these "atheists" then? Dollars to donuts they were either Marxist of some sort (e.g. communist, socialist, progressive, etc.) or Global Warming / Climate Change. These are all related fanatical religions of hatred and intolerance and Christianity is their primary rival/competitor.

Dollars to donuts that when you were told by those jerks that they were atheists, that you took those claims at face value ... and then you started begrudging actual atheists who never did anything to you.

Look, if I had wanted Hillary Clinton to win, I could have put a Hillary bumper sticker on my car *OR* I could have put a Trump/Pence sticker on my car and drove around the city like a mad man, cutting people off, flipping people the bird, pissing everyone off while getting them angry at Trump, not at Hillary. A Global Warming theist isn't going to be intellectually honest. He's going to tell you he's an atheist and then go after your faith.

So, the next time you encounter an "atheist" who is attacking your faith, you owe it to yourself to punch back by attacking Global Warming. Watch as he goes into a tizzy-fit because you aren't supposed to be riling his religious sensitivities ... he's supposed to be able to just attack you with impunity.

If you're not up for the task, PLEASE forward it on to me and let me snipe away.

Oh, and review the first post in this thread for future reference: Reference Manaual for the Global Warming Mythology |

You said: "Claiming to be an atheist renders one invulnerable because his faith can no longer be attacked."

So I guess you are saying that they were just believers hiding under atheist clothing? Sure, they have an ideology but that could be attacked just like a religion can be attacked.

You said: "... and then you started begrudging actual atheists who never did anything to you."

No, I think I made it very clear that I do not begrudge atheists, I only dislike certain behaviors of certain atheists, ones who falsely accuse me of certain behaviors or speak falsely of my intent. I also dislike certain behaviors of certain Christians, ones who falsely accuse me of certain behaviors or misrepresent my beliefs.

If they were REALLY atheists who did not believe in God, my religion would not bother them at all because I would not be a threat. So I think the only reason they might consider me a threat is because there might actually be something to my religion even if they are not consciously aware of this. The dead giveaway is that they are not threatened by Christianity because it is easier to attack since they know more about it and it is vulnerable to being called unscientific.

 

[ManSinha]

I understand that intolerance is to be found within all different groups of people, but I was just wondering why you think those atheists would act out that way unless they were afraid of what I have to say. Do you think there is NO reason, that they are just intolerant for no reason? That seems rather odd to me because there has to be a reason people think as they do and a motivation for their actions.

However, I do not believe we can ever know the reasons or motivations for what other people think or do unless they reveal them to us, and most people are not about to do that, either because they don't know them or because they don't want us to know.

As has been said many times there are three sides to every story - his side her side and the truth

You are an involved party - giving us your version of what happened. May be we need another person's perspective - that saw the exchanges but was not a party to the conflict

 

[ManSinha]

I could have put a Trump/Pence sticker on my car and drove around the city like a mad man, cutting people off, flipping people the bird, pissing everyone off while getting them angry at Trump,

You actually think people that are that naive?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Likewise, believers can be intelligent or not, polite or not, blue eyed or not, left-handed or not.

The only believer who "should be" speaking for me is me, but "some of" these atheists speak for me as if they know my thoughts, feelings and motives, and they don't even understand why is wrong with that.

Respectfully, there's a difference. Or, rather, there can be. If I'm a Catholic, for example, then both the Pope and the Bible are things which speak for me to a degree.
This isn't limited to religious groups...an active member of a political party is in much the same boat.

An atheist who belongs to a certain group (let's say American Atheists) is in a similar position.

I should have known better than to try to fit into a culture where I don't fit in. I did it more than once but I think I am finally done now. It was just not meant to be, I am too disruptive to their non-beliefs, being the kind of believer that I am, not wishy-washy.

There can be value in being in those situations, but if it becomes unproductive it can be worth moving on and spending the time more productively.

 

[ManSinha]

I think we should speak up when we feel offended or wronged because sometimes people do not even realize that what they are doing hurts us or offends us. That is why I always speak up, but I only talk about myself, I do not speak for others because I cannot know why they do what they do...

I guess I was searching for answers as to what this atheist might have done what he did, but now I realize that nobody can know that but him, and maybe he does not even know. What I do know is that I did not have the behavior or motives he implied, but I also know I cannot control what he thinks about me, all I can do is point out what I actually did and why.

How difficult it is to know all our own motives given that 95% of our thoughts are unconscious, so how much LESS can someone else know our motives.

One thing I do know is that I am sincere and I do not lie, so for someone to say my motives are not what I think they are is to imply I am either lying or I am unaware of myself. But I am pretty self-aware because I spent many, many years in counseling and 12 step programs working on myself and I am very introspective, analyzing myself constantly.

I know for example that I gravitate towards atheists rather than believers. It is like I have always preferred the company of people who are different from me, and in certain ways I am more like an atheist and in other ways I am more like a believer. Maybe that is because my father was an atheist and my mother retained her Christian beliefs, even though she never talked about them and none of the three children ever saw a Bible or the inside of a church.

So I was brought up essentially as a nonbeliever and then at age 17 I suddenly became a Baha'i. But at that time I never had any feelings towards God and I still struggle to have any feelings towards this God I am supposed to love. That puts me at odds with all the other Baha'is and I feel kind of ashamed to associate with them, yet I have no doubt the God exists, so I am definitely a believer.

I feel kind of like a woman without a country, and maybe be that is why I gravitated towards that forum I just left for so long, as many of the people there are kind of different. It is kind of like a little club, with only a few regular posters and I guess I wanted to belong because I never fit in anywhere as a child. But I did not fit in on that forum because they assumed I was just like all the other believers and most of them were atheists who did not respect believers very much. So here I am. Maybe I will fit in here.

May be you would consider continuing your explorations of other belief systems. If only to convince your self that your decisions are validated in hindsight.

 

[Trailblazer]

As has been said many times there are three sides to every story - his side her side and the truth

You are an involved party - giving us your version of what happened. May be we need another person's perspective - that saw the exchanges but was not a party to the conflict

Only God knows the complete Truth because God knows everything...
Unfortunately, God is not talking....

The important thing is that I know my own intent and nobody else does, except God...
I do not like bad feelings so I reached out to him and tried to resolve the bad feelings... Now the ball is in his court.

 

[Trailblazer]

There can be value in being in those situations, but if it becomes unproductive it can be worth moving on and spending the time more productively.

Yeah, I finally figured that out, and maybe it took the nudging on the part of that forum owner for me to realize it.
There might have been a better way to do it than to insult me on a pubic forum though. Whether he realized it was an insult I will never know. He is kind of private most of the time; not like me who reveals all.

 

[Trailblazer]

May be you would consider continuing your explorations of other belief systems. If only to convince your self that your decisions are validated in hindsight.

I am sure of my beliefs, after looking at them for over 48 years, but I do not always know where I fit in socially since I have always been very isolated.

 

[74x12]

In December 2017, I left a forum I had been posting on for about four years to come here because of a falling out with the atheist forum owner. I was here for about a year and then that atheist forum owner saw me posting on another forum in that forum group and invited me back to his forum. I went back in December 2018, reticently, and since then I have only been posting here on RF on a limited basis, because I do not have time for both forums. I am now very sorry I ever went back there and I hope I never make the same mistake again.

That forum pretends to be a forum for believers, ex-believers and nonbelievers but it is inhospitable for believers of any kind, particularly for believers of the Baha’i Faith. That is putting it mildly. We are discriminated against because the forum owner has a vendetta against my religion. Christians and Jews are tolerated as long as they do not talk too much about God or their religious beliefs. Mostly what they talk about on that forum are politics and social issues. So they really should not call themselves a “religious forum.”

My most recent academic background is in psychology, so I wonder why people think and do what they think and do. It seems rather obvious to me that if the atheists on that forum are hostile towards me it is because they are threatened in some way. Of course, they would never admit that. It is not as if I am a bit pushy about what I believe, and in fact I only discussed my beliefs if someone else posted to me about my beliefs. Then I responded and I got blamed for proselytizing. This is wholly unjust.

This last falling out was precipitated by the forum owner having a hissy fit for what he considered me mentioning my religion too much and then he put me on moderation. I sent him a private message that I will not post on his forum while on moderation because that is unjust, since I broke no forum rules, and I told him I was leaving his forum. Of course most of the atheists are glad I am gone. I am also glad I am gone because now I am back here and the atheists on this forum have been so different. They are mature adults, not little children acting out.

There is no reason why those atheists would act out that way unless they were afraid of what I have to say. They do not react to the other believers on that forum that way because they do not dare talk much about God or their religion, because they are too afraid of being insulted. But I never cared about being insulted; I stood right up to them, but I was always polite. And I never told them that they should believe in God, as I am very well aware of the reasons atheists do not believe in God and I respect those reasons. Why can’t we all just get along? Is that too much to ask?

Imagine that! I dare to talk about God and my religion on a “religious forum.”

The forum owner just wants to control everything I post, it is so obvious. Why can’t other people see this? It is psych 101 stuff. I know atheists are intelligent, but the atheists on that forum seem to wear blinders regarding the reasons for their fearless leader’s behaviors.

Finally, they call that forum a “free thinkers” forum and I find the very ironic, because nobody has changed the way they think since I went there five years ago. They are not free to think anything that contradicts their atheism and they don’t want to hear about it. Then they rank on believers and say we are not free to think because we have a religion. They say we are just “brainwashed believers.” It is comical that they cannot understand their own behavior, but it is also rather sad.

I understand that a lot of atheists are ex-believers who were hurt by Christianity but it is not fair to take that out on me. I did not do anything to them except try to be their friend. But they cannot be friends with a believer, all they can do is tell me I am wrong about what I believe. They say there is no God, no soul and no afterlife but they have no proof of that. I readily admit believers have no proof either, but there is evidence. By contrast, atheists have no evidence that there is no God, no soul and no afterlife, so they should just admit that, instead of insisting they know. I guess it makes them uncomfortable to have to think about these things, but if they are so sure they do not exist they would be able to just blow me off instead of getting antagonistic. This is psych 101 stuff.

I am interested in what the atheists on this forum have to say about this, but I am also open to hearing the opinions of believers.

Yeah, they don't want an even playing field. It's foolish. Just stupid. I would avoid that forum.