Why are people of faith afraid of death?

[outhouse]

well thats not quite true.

Jesus promoted a resurrection...that means to bring a person back from death...to restore them to physical life. Jesus resurrected people to show that it is possible to be brought back to life in physical form.

John 6:38 because I have come down from heaven to do, not my will, but the will of him that sent me. 39 This is the will of him that sent me, that I should lose nothing out of all that he has given me but that I should resurrect it at the last day. 40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone that beholds the Son and exercises faith in him should have everlasting life, and I will resurrect him at the last day.

despite john 6;38 talking of ressurection, there is no description anywhere that descibes a normal living life once dead.

very little is ever said of heaven or hell, but more a long the lines of how to and how to not, get there.

 

[elmarna]

I hear people speak of fear of death as "instinctual".
I DISAGREE. We have a self preservation mode. There for combating danger.
DEATH IS THE UNKNOWN. to fear something you can not understand without stepping into that doorway is not a resource your mind can translate.
While some may sermize that "accountability" can have them have a hard time with this step in life. I say if the fear of death is to be how you operate--How about apreciateing "life" of which you all ready have!
I can not speak for most people. My N.D.E. has me with no consern or fear of death.

 

[Pegg]

despite john 6;38 talking of ressurection, there is no description anywhere that descibes a normal living life once dead.

very little is ever said of heaven or hell, but more a long the lines of how to and how to not, get there.

very little is said of it because it is not the place that God wants us to be

The hebrew scriptures are brimming with talk of the earthly paradise...the book of Job describes how the dead will be restored to life again. All the prophets of the hebrew scriptures spoke about the paradise to come.

we were made for the earth and we are staying on the earth.

 

[work in progress]

very little is said of it because it is not the place that God wants us to be

The hebrew scriptures are brimming with talk of the earthly paradise...the book of Job describes how the dead will be restored to life again. All the prophets of the hebrew scriptures spoke about the paradise to come.

we were made for the earth and we are staying on the earth.

Jehovah's Witnesses teach that everyone except for a select 144,000 who go to heaven, are bodily resurrected on Earth. The "earthly paradise" already has too many people now, to live sustainably into the indefinite future....as in forever....because many of the planet's non-renewable resources are getting scarce; renewable resources like fresh water are overused and in decline in most populated regions of the world; and the recycling and absorption capacity of the planet's oceans and atmosphere is also collapsing --- so, keeping all this in mind, how are all of the resurrected people going to live here too, when the total human footprint is already overshooting the Earth's ability to carry the existing human population by 25 to 50%?

After that question, I would ask the one that seemed ludicrous to me even before I learned about our environmental perils: how is the Earth supposed to be a permanent home, existing forever for all of the immortal resurrected people, when our Universe is not immortal in the first place? Our planet only has about another 500 million years - according to geologists who study the carbon cycle; the Sun will turn into a red giant and absorb all of the inner planets including the Earth, after exhausting all of its light elements; and even discounting all that - our Universe is expanding at an ever-accelerating rate of speed, and will either end as a cold, empty universe billions of years into the future, or according to multiverse theories - disintegrate so that new universes can be seeded and take its place. The end result is that there is nothing in our physical universe that is immortal, or has the capacity to be immortal.

 

[Me Myself]

Fear and faith are like water and oil. They don´t need each other, nor can they mix, even if they co-exist in the same human being.

That is why I think any "faith" that comes from fear, is not really faith, but a psychological selfdefense mechanism based on desperation rather than actual understanding.

 

[work in progress]

Fear and faith are like water and oil. They don´t need each other, nor can they mix, even if they co-exist in the same human being.

That is why I think any "faith" that comes from fear, is not really faith, but a psychological selfdefense mechanism based on desperation rather than actual understanding.

It seems to me that doubt rising up regarding a faith-based belief will cause fear. I would say that if someone has doubts about religious promises of escaping death, it's better to confront the problem of death straight on and live knowing that this life is for an unknown but limited amount of time, than to try to force believing in an escape route.

 

[Madhuri]

Fear of the unknown is characterised by not knowing. If there is no actual knowledge of truth within faith then how can fear be truly conquered? That is why so many people of 'faith' become petrified on their death bed. Knowledge is superior to faith alone. Such 'faith', without knowledge, is a mere illusion.

 

[Me Myself]

It seems to me that doubt rising up regarding a faith-based belief will cause fear. I would say that if someone has doubts about religious promises of escaping death, it's better to confront the problem of death straight on and live knowing that this life is for an unknown but limited amount of time, than to try to force believing in an escape route.

I agree with most of what you say. The only part I would call diferent is that I beleive faith and doubt don´t tend to co-exist. If someone "doubts" it´s faith is not doubting faith but the shape it made it take.

For me faith is like water, where we need the substance but confuse it with the shape, and the shape we give faith is that of the beleifs we use on it´s behalf. Faith can adapt to the shape of the beliefs one says to have faith on, but when the shape colapses one can see that the shape was never really solid or reliable, yet the faith swirls around looking for a new place to be.

I agree, "forcing" things have no sense with faith and if you feel yo are forcing yourself a belief, just accept your doubts and confront them.

 

[pwfaith]

Is it that they are not quite sure of their faith for that do they not know what their faith tells them?

Not sure which "people of faith" you are referring to but speaking as a Christian, I'm not "afraid to die" but I admit I don't want to die a painful death or suffer a long time or think of the sadness that will be felt by my family and friends once I am gone (probably more so if I end up dying tragically or from a long-term disease or something like that). Death itself, I am not afraid of, but my human nature can fear, at times, the type of death I might have to endure.

 

[pwfaith]

When I was a believer, I was very much afraid of hell. That's an extra reason to be afraid to die.

Why would a believer fear hell?

 

[work in progress]

I agree with most of what you say. The only part I would call diferent is that I beleive faith and doubt don´t tend to co-exist. If someone "doubts" it´s faith is not doubting faith but the shape it made it take.

For me faith is like water, where we need the substance but confuse it with the shape, and the shape we give faith is that of the beleifs we use on it´s behalf. Faith can adapt to the shape of the beliefs one says to have faith on, but when the shape colapses one can see that the shape was never really solid or reliable, yet the faith swirls around looking for a new place to be.

I agree, "forcing" things have no sense with faith and if you feel yo are forcing yourself a belief, just accept your doubts and confront them.

I suspect that faith depends on an intuitive sense of knowing that is not based on reasoning or empirical knowledge, so attempting to prove faith-based beliefs, as fundamentalists are often fond of, is a sign of lack of faith, or may even cause them to question or lose faith. I'm thinking especially of the ones who are at war with science, and allow their religious authorities to screen out any challenging science and pick the ones that might support their claims.

Many years ago, I came across a book by Soren Kierkegaard in the local library: "Fear and Trembling", which was Kierkegaard's deconstruction of the dilemma Abraham faced when God tested his faith by telling him to go up on the mountain and sacrifice his son Isaac. In the church I grew up in, it was just a simple little parable, cut and dried - Abraham obeyed God, and God sent an angel to stop him from killing his son at the last second etc. But, Kierkegaard ponders what would be going through Abraham's mind about God, about the basic rules of ethics, and whether to use his reasoning or suspend everything he thought was right and act on faith alone. Kierkegaard accidentally spawned the existentialist movement in philosophy with his paradox of having to choose between acting on faith or reason.

Most rational people use a blend of intuitive or faith-based knowing, and reason - some going more on faith, others using reason wherever possible, and modern examples of people hearing voices telling them to do something they consider ahorent or illogical are not celebrated as great testaments of faith -- they are the acts of the deranged lunatic -- so relying too greatly on faith may lead some in dangerous directions.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Is it that they are not quite sure of their faith for that do they not know what their faith tells them?

It's not that I'm afraid of death I'm just not done with what I'm doing here yet.

 

[BruceDLimber]

>Why are people of faith afraid of death?

some of us--perhaps many of us--aren't!

Bruce

 

[rsd]

Is it that they are not quite sure of their faith for that do they not know what their faith tells them?

I think it is because death represents both a concept and reality all in one and however you slice it, death is going to be one hell of a ride. Even if you pay to ride a huge roller coaster, both faith and fear are right there as everyone waits for the cars to start moving. Death is kind of like that but multiply things by a factor of 1,000. Faith tells us we will make it through OK. But fear is there, naturally. And I think that because you have to die alone, this is also a magnifier. Yeah, you might be surrounded by friends but they're all just fine. YOU'RE the one "who is setting to sail" and you don't really have anyone to keep you company. All I can say is that your relationship with God is everything. That mystical union you have with Him IS everything. Nothing is more important. And the atheists here just crack me up.

 

[`mud]

hey Kevin
Fear of the loss of cognitian arouses a fear of the loss of cognitian.
You won't know it's gone, when it's gone.

~
`mud

 

[Madhuri]

Why would a believer fear hell?

For many, fear is a driving force into 'believing' and for many, the idea that hell exists is a cause of paranoia of failure to please God.

 

[Willamena]

Is it that they are not quite sure of their faith for that do they not know what their faith tells them?

In many cases, it's just a case of putting faith in the wrong thing. In words.

 

[pwfaith]

For many, fear is a driving force into 'believing' and for many, the idea that hell exists is a cause of paranoia of failure to please God.

I guess the many you know are very different from the many I know. I agree for some fear may be a driving force into believing but certainly not the only force. Although I don't personally see fear as a bad thing. I think some fear can be healthy. My point was once one IS a believer, what is to fear then? Once one has accepted Christ and been brought into the family of God, that fear should cease to exist b/c hell for that individual is out of the picture, you are promised the blessing of heaven. That is what I was confused about.

Failure to please God will not send one to hell once they are a child of His. The paranoia is unnecessary. It is based on human understandings and false teachings, not Scripture or truth. People too often follow religious narratives, instead of Scripture and Jesus' narratives. In having a personal relationship with God we have have Freedom & Peace - In Galatians 5:1it says "do not be burdened again". We are free to fail when we have a relationship with God. When you are free to fail with God you tend to allow others to be free to fail. When you fail, you have the peace in knowing you are also forgiven by God, in turn you are also more forgiving of others when they fail. Religious narratives teach it is never enough. There is always worry about failing or about it not being enough and you tend to look at others that way.

We MUST rely on Scripture and Jesus above any teachings of the church or religion. When we do we don't have these unnecessary fears and misunderstandings. The whole "angry God" narrative is another one. It is a false narrative. Jesus ALWAYS describes God as altogether good and who is always out for our good, even if we cannot understand it. Jesus was asked about this "angry God" narrative on 2 occasions - Luke 13:1-5 & John 9:2-3. In the first Jesus unequivocally says no, people do not suffer b/c they are sinners. In the second, Jesus steps outside the typically Jewish narrative that said the blind man must have done something bad in a previous life in order to have been born blind. Jesus denies this notion.

Jesus clearly did not hold to the idea that we "get what we deserve." Scripture says "he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the righteous and on the unrighteous." (Matt 5:45) Jesus is basically saying: just as the sunshine and rain are given equally to believers and unbelievers with no distinction, so God gives blessings to all without regard to their behavior. A believer though has absolutely NO reason to fear hell though. Once they have accepted Jesus as their Lord & Savior they are saved, period. There is no going back!

 

[work in progress]

My point was once one IS a believer, what is to fear then? Once one has accepted Christ and been brought into the family of God, that fear should cease to exist b/c hell for that individual is out of the picture, you are promised the blessing of heaven. That is what I was confused about.

Failure to please God will not send one to hell once they are a child of His. The paranoia is unnecessary. It is based on human understandings and false teachings, not Scripture or truth. People too often follow religious narratives, instead of Scripture and Jesus' narratives. In having a personal relationship with God we have have Freedom & Peace - In Galatians 5:1it says "do not be burdened again". We are free to fail when we have a relationship with God. When you are free to fail with God you tend to allow others to be free to fail. When you fail, you have the peace in knowing you are also forgiven by God, in turn you are also more forgiving of others when they fail. Religious narratives teach it is never enough. There is always worry about failing or about it not being enough and you tend to look at others that way.................
Once they have accepted Jesus as their Lord & Savior they are saved, period. There is no going back!

I just want to point out that you are speaking from the "once saved, always saved" contingent of salvation doctrine. The doctrine began with the teachings of John Calvin -- but he also believed in strong predestination, so the flipside would be once damned, always damned I suppose. The hardline Calvinists seem to have no qualms about sending many or most people to hell, for what it's worth.

There is not universal agreement on this issue -- especially keeping in mind that the Catholic Church and early Protestant churches never accepted it -- Perseverance Of The Saints, and it is more than dealing with "sin" of the believer; the real dilemma is about what to do about those who refuse the salvation doctrine, or those who left the faith. The only way to rationalize it is to say that someone like me, who does know this sort of religion from an early age and then stopped believing and left - never was saved to begin with...we were just faking it I suppose. But, those who act on reason rather than faith are damned, while the born again mass murderer gets to go to heaven!

 

[pwfaith]

I just want to point out that you are speaking from the "once saved, always saved" contingent of salvation doctrine. The doctrine began with the teachings of John Calvin -- but he also believed in strong predestination, so the flipside would be once damned, always damned I suppose. The hardline Calvinists seem to have no qualms about sending many or most people to hell, for what it's worth.

There is not universal agreement on this issue -- especially keeping in mind that the Catholic Church and early Protestant churches never accepted it -- Perseverance Of The Saints, and it is more than dealing with "sin" of the believer; the real dilemma is about what to do about those who refuse the salvation doctrine, or those who left the faith. The only way to rationalize it is to say that someone like me, who does know this sort of religion from an early age and then stopped believing and left - never was saved to begin with...we were just faking it I suppose. But, those who act on reason rather than faith are damned, while the born again mass murderer gets to go to heaven!

Actually I do not hold to the "once saved, always saved" doctrine I do not believe we can just simply one day mess up and be unsaved one day. As I said in another thread, when we accept Christ we are adopted into God's family. If you adopt a child into your family and they do something you don't like, do you sudden disown them? I doubt it. I don't know any parent that would. I don't believe God operates that way. I do believe there is an unforgivable sin - blaspheme of the Holy Spirit. I don't think this is something that just accidentally happens. It's not a slip up or something like that. It's a deliberate ongoing rejection and rebellion that continually resists, rejects and insults the Holy Spirit. I honestly do not know if a Christian can commit this sin or not. I think it would be MAJOR if they did and there would be no coming back. I do not see any evidence in Scripture that a Christian can - after having received the Holy Spirit, but I am also not willing to say for certain they cannot. Whether or not they were a Christian to begin with is ultimately between them and God.

My points remain above, about how once we have accepted Christ we don't need to fear. People too often fear that if they slip up, they lose their salvation. I don't agree with that. Not b/c of some "once saved, always saved" doctrine but b/c God promises to forgive and nothing in Scripture supports that kind of "lose fear". IMO it goes against God's character and nature. I think if a person is worried, that is a good thing b/c it shows the Holy Spirit is speaking to their heart so really they have no need to b/c the Holy Spirit would not be there to convict their hearts if they were not saved anymore. Typically the one who commits blaspheme of the Holy Spirit and is not saved (either if they were previously or not) will not fear and have that conviction. I still hold that it is unnecessary to fear hell as a believer, unless you (general) are actively, intentionally rebelling, in a stubborn way, continually resisting, rejecting and insulting the Holy Spirit's work in your heart.