Why did the Jews reject their Messiah when he DID come?

[Desert Snake]

Be more specific about the question.

You're entitled to your views, regarding idolatry, and sin, however consider that there is a subjectivity, to that, and also,

As I noted
Mark 11:11

Hardly a testament against the Solomonic church.

[So, as with other things, varying opinions, because the christians had different opinions?

 

[PruePhillip]

You're entitled to your views, regarding idolatry, and sin, however consider that there is a subjectivity, to that, and also,

As I noted
Mark 11:11

Hardly a testament against the Solomonic church.

[So, as with other things, varying opinions, because the christians had different opinions?

I think it's Daniel which says that the Messiah will "come to His temple."
But, having arrived, He condemned it. It was never going to be any different
for the temple would be destroyed, and sadly, so too were many of those
who "did not know the time of their visitation."
Jesus said that God does not dwell in temples made with hands. God
permitted the tabernacle - but the Jews wanted a temple and a king.

 

[Spartan]

You're entitled to your views, regarding idolatry, and sin, however consider that there is a subjectivity, to that, and also,

As I noted
Mark 11:11

Hardly a testament against the Solomonic church.

[So, as with other things, varying opinions, because the christians had different opinions?

Still no specific question on your part. Please elaborate. You're too cryptic.

 

[Desert Snake]

Still no specific question on your part. Please elaborate. You're too cryptic.

That's because I'm not sure if you are saying that Jesus was a priestly sacrifice, or not. I don't believe that type of theology, and if anything, Jesus seems to favor the Solomonic church, not another version.

 

[susanblange]

You neglected to identify this individual.
I have had a similar conversation on another forum, and I am wondering if you are referring to the Rebbe, of whom no significant number of Jews believe was the Messiah.
Please, clarify.

The Jews will not accept their Messiah until he comes with power. Psalm 110:3. He is waiting for the supernatural power from God to throw a lightning bolt. Isaiah 14:29, Isaiah 30:30. He will set his enemies on fire on VWD Day, he will set the wicked on fire on Judgment Day, and he will set idolaters on fire on the Day of Decision. I believe I am the Messiah and I have already ended the Cold War, the war in Ireland between the Protestants and Catholics, I restored pride to the US Military, and in 1988 I began to get the Jews out of Russia. All of these things are Messianic prophecies but the Jews are spiritually deaf and blind. Isaiah 6:9-10. Proverbs 1:30.

 

[paarsurrey]

Basically, you don't punish people for innocent mistakes. Got it???

1. We have made no mistake about Jesus. He was a nice observant Jewish man. He wanted to be the messiah and failed. Nice try. That's it. Fin.

2. Even if we had made a mistake about Jesus, no "fault" can be assigned, as it is not something that is chosen. People are either convinced or they are not convinced. They don't choose to be convinced nor do they choose not to be convinced. So there is no moral responsibility in it.

3. Assigning moral responsibility where there is none is abusive.

"People are either convinced or they are not convinced"

It is not simply a question of difference of opinion or freedom of opinion. That is something everybody is entitled to whether a Jew or a non-Jew.
But the Jews did not have a right to put him on the Cross with a purpose to kill him.
Jesus did not do anything to justify that action on the part of Judaism people.This must be condemned. Right, please?

Regards

 

[susanblange]

"People are either convinced or they are not convinced"

It is not simply a question of difference of opinion or freedom of opinion. That is something everybody is entitled to whether a Jew or a non-Jew.
But the Jews did not have a right to put him on the Cross with a purpose to kill him.
Jesus did not do anything to justify that action on the part of Judaism people.This must be condemned. Right, please?

Regards

The Jews did not have Jesus crucified. It was the multitudes that followed him that had him crucified, Jesus wanted to be crucified because he thought it would fulfill scripture. It didn't. Jesus told his followers to take up their cross and follow him. If the Jews had their way, he would've been stoned to death as a false prophet.

 

[Spartan]

Jesus wanted to be crucified because he thought it would fulfill scripture.

Supporting evidence for that?

It didn't. Jesus told his followers to take up their cross and follow him. If the Jews had their way, he would've been stoned to death as a false prophet.

The Jews killed their own prophets, claiming they were false prophets. They were wrong then, and also with Jesus.

If you think Jesus was a false prophet then please cite an example and include the scripture #(s).

 

[metis]

The Jews did not have Jesus crucified. It was the multitudes that followed him that had him crucified,

Actually it was the Romans as crucifixion is not a Jewish form of capital punishment.

 

[paarsurrey]

Actually it was the Romans as crucifixion is not a Jewish form of capital punishment.

It seem wrong:

Deuteronomy 21:23
Cursed is Anyone Hung on a Tree
22 If a man has committed a sin worthy of death, and he is executed, and you hang his body on a tree,
23 you must not leave the body on the tree overnight, but you must be sure to bury him that day, because anyone who is hung on a tree is under God’s curse. You must not defile the land the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance.
Berean Study Bible · Download
Deuteronomy 21:23 you must not leave the body on the tree overnight, but you must be sure to bury him that day, because anyone who is hung on a tree is under God's curse. You must not defile the land that the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance.
Right, please?
Regards

 

[rosends]

One is simply wrong here:

Deuteronomy 21:23
Cursed is Anyone Hung on a Tree
22 If a man has committed a sin worthy of death, and he is executed, and you hang his body on a tree,
23 you must not leave the body on the tree overnight, but you must be sure to bury him that day, because anyone who is hung on a tree is under God’s curse. You must not defile the land the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance.
Berean Study Bible · Download
Deuteronomy 21:23 you must not leave the body on the tree overnight, but you must be sure to bury him that day, because anyone who is hung on a tree is under God's curse. You must not defile the land that the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance.
Right, please?
Regards

You should reread verse 22. The criminal is killed first, THEN put on a tree (different understandings are either impaled or hanged, neither is crucifixion). So the putting on the tree is not the method of capital punishment.

 

[Desert Snake]

I think it's Daniel which says that the Messiah will "come to His temple."
But, having arrived, He condemned it. It was never going to be any different
for the temple would be destroyed, and sadly, so too were many of those
who "did not know the time of their visitation."
Jesus said that God does not dwell in temples made with hands. God
permitted the tabernacle - but the Jews wanted a temple and a king.

Wouldn't that be "herods Temple"?

That is why I am asking for correlation to 'Solomons Temple', like as noted in Acts of the Apostles.

'herods Temple', isn't mentioned.

• the Messiah came to "herods Temple"?

 

[PruePhillip]

Yes, as contradicted by much of christianity, which claims a 'structure', must be adhered to, in order for the 'workings of their deity', to be fully employed.

•
However, as far as structures go, there are methodology by which "holy or worship structures", may be employed for the worship of g-d.

So, the 'logical parallel', as some direct thing relating to structures, doesn't really make sense.

There are problems here
1 - you are Jewish and have the temple as a legitimate part of service (but where is it?)
2 - you might confuse mainstream Christianity with Jesus teachings - they are not the same
3 - I can't work out what you are saying

 

[PruePhillip]

Wouldn't that be "herods Temple"?

That is why I am asking for correlation to 'Solomons Temple', like as noted in Acts of the Apostles.

'herods Temple', isn't mentioned.

• the Messiah came to "herods Temple"?

Who's temple it is isn't the issue. The Temple in Jerusalem is the point
Whether it's Solomon's or Hezekiah's or Herod's isn't the point.
Herod extended the platform - he didn't touch the actual temple.

 

[PruePhillip]

Actually it was the Romans as crucifixion is not a Jewish form of capital punishment.

T.E.C.H.N.I.C.A.L.L.Y. correct.
But the Jews wanted Jesus crucified - not stone or jailed.
And the Romans didn't want Him crucified.

 

[Desert Snake]

So, christians teach that, 'Solomons Temple was bad, because, you aren't supposed to build a structure',

Even though, as noted in the Old Testament, the Messiah goes to his Temple, and Jesus

Mark 11:11

Doesn't seem to condemn the Holy Temple, in Spiritual equation.

No mention of 'herod', just a 'structure is bad', idea,

[Yeah, makes a lot of sense.

 

[Desert Snake]

Who's temple it is isn't the issue. The Temple in Jerusalem is the point
Whether it's Solomon's or Hezekiah's or Herod's isn't the point.
Herod extended the platform - he didn't touch the actual temple.

Yeah, that's the logical problem, with what you are saying.

 

[Desert Snake]

There are problems here
1 - you are Jewish and have the temple as a legitimate part of service (but where is it?)
2 - you might confuse mainstream Christianity with Jesus teachings - they are not the same
3 - I can't work out what you are saying

No, you don't need a main temple for worship. One can worship without any structure, or use a [ideally, specially designed structure, which isn't like a main temple, at all.

• then perhaps Jesus is contradicting Himself, when He drives the moneylenders out of the temple? Or, Mark 11:11?

 

[susanblange]

Actually it was the Romans as crucifixion is not a Jewish form of capital punishment.

The Romans carried out the decree of the majority of the people who were followers of Jesus. He died "the deaths of the uncircumcised". Ezekiel 28:8-10. Jesus claimed to be equal to God. Ezekiel 28:2, Isaiah 14:12-17. He has been kicked out of Heaven and reincarnated. This time he will die by bursting into flames. Ezekiel 28:18-19.

 

[susanblange]

Supporting evidence for that?



The Jews killed their own prophets, claiming they were false prophets. They were wrong then, and also with Jesus.

If you think Jesus was a false prophet then please cite an example and include the scripture #(s).

There are multiple verses in the Gospels where Jesus says the second coming will occur within a generation of his death, which is forty years. He said some of his followers would live to see the second coming. He referred to Daniel 7:13 where "the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven...". Matthew 16:28.