Why do believers love God?

[Truthseeker]

With all due respect, that is just a faith-based belief, and it can never be proven.....
however, the evidence for that does not look good.

No, he's seen it with his eyes. All need a certain set of eyes. You don't have them now.

 

[Truthseeker]

There is more than enough proof for me Susan. Abdul'baha was living proof of Baha’u’llah and of God.

Regards Tony

Susan is dubious about 'Abdu'l-Baha. Wrong answer.

 

[Truthseeker]

There is no proof that there is anything to turn away from. It is a faith-based belief.

Proof is not in logic in this case, proof would be inside yourself.

 

[Trailblazer]

No, he's seen it with his eyes. All need a certain set of eyes. You don't have them now.

I assume you mean spiritual eyes. That means it is a faith-based belief.

 

[Trailblazer]

Proof is not in logic in this case, proof would be inside yourself.

What people imagine is not proof of anything.

 

[Aupmanyav]

"Why do believers love God?": For no reason. He creates all the problems. He left the garden with a ripe apple hanging down, and blamed Adam.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Why do believers love God?
Below are the multiple choices. You can pick one or more, or give me another reason I hadn't thought of.

(a) Because the scriptures of their religion tell them that God is good and they should love God
(b) Because they see objective evidence in the world that indicates to them that God is good and worthy of being loved
(c) Because they believe that God is good since God has been good to them in their lives
(d) None of the above because I don’t love God

The scriptures of my religion say that God created humans out of His love for us and that we are supposed to love God, because otherwise we cut ourselves off from God’s love.

3: O SON OF MAN! Veiled in My immemorial being and in the ancient eternity of My essence, I knew My love for thee; therefore I created thee, have engraved on thee Mine image and revealed to thee My beauty.

4: O SON OF MAN! I loved thy creation, hence I created thee. Wherefore, do thou love Me, that I may name thy name and fill thy soul with the spirit of life.”

5: O SON OF BEING! Love Me, that I may love thee. If thou lovest Me not, My love can in no wise reach thee. Know this, O servant.

The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 4

In all honesty I had to pick (d). Why can’t I love God?

First, I believe God created a world that is a storehouse of suffering where He knew people would suffer, often through no fault of their own. Not only that, the all-knowing God knew that some people would suffer much more than other people and I do not consider this fair and equitable.

Second, I believe that God determines fate for the most part, leaving very little room for any choices. Any free will that people have is circumscribed by many factors such as childhood upbringing, heredity, education, adult experiences, and present life circumstances, so many people cannot just make changes they would like to make. So many things are beyond our control, and it is God who determines much of our fate.

Third, on top of all of the above the Baha’i Writings say that God sends tests for our own perfection and we should be grateful for the tests. Because of the tests I have always endured, whether God is actually sending them or not, I keep looking over my shoulder waiting for another test.

Will the tests of this life ever end? Is God sending these tests on purpose or are they just part of life? If they are just part of life, why do some people get more tests than other people? I am supposed to believe I am favored by God because I am tested more than others so I will end up being stronger and more spiritual, but I cannot make myself believe that even if it is true, since there is no evidence that is or will be the case. All we have are scriptures that say that and I cannot believe based on scriptures when I see no objective evidence.

How can people love a God that is responsible for any or all of the above? It is my concerted opinion that the main reason people love God is because of (a) and (c) above but I cannot love God because scriptures tell me I should and I cannot love God based upon how good God has been to me, since I do not feel that has been the case, although I am willing to admit I might be wrong since my perceptions of my past and present life situation could be wrong.

I want to love God but I have to have a reason that makes sense to me, so I thought by starting this thread some people might give me some reasons that make sense to me.

Sincerely, Trailblazer.

For me, it is scriptures.
I do not know God, but scriptures define God with some names and attributes, such as the most Kind, the most generous, the Forgiving, the All-knowing, All-wise, self subsisting, the most powerful...

So, if that's what God is, that's what I love, because these are the most lovable attributes one can have.

As regards to tests and sufferings, these according to scriptures are temporary in this life, and have a purpose.
We are told in this life, things appear contrary to our wishes, but in spiritual worlds of God, we will see better things.

 

[Truthseeker]

I assume you mean spiritual eyes. That means it is a faith-based belief.

Spiritual eyes exist. I have them now to some extent, not at all fully. It's not faith, it is reality. Can you trust that I have them?

How many time times have you told atheists that all evidence is not objective. It is inside you.

 

[Clara Tea]

I see it is because God is naught but Love.

The most sublime and perfect Love we can imagine or can experience in this life, still does not show us the immensity of that Love.

The pain and suffering we face in this world is all part of Love, Faith allows us to embrace all the good and the bad, in the knowledge that only Love results.

I guess it is what many call enlightenment, where we transcend self to be immersed in that Love.

No easy feat, it is a battle we all face in this life, Regards Tony

TransmutingSoul: "Pain....is part of Love"

Hmm....Jews in Nazi torture camps (God's love?????)

Suffering with cancer, getting no message or relief from God after praying (God's love?????)

Are you sure that you are not talking yourself into believing that God loves you (or anyone?)?

God allowed his own son to die a horrible death on the cross, after his son asked "why hath thou forsaken me?"

God flooded the world (Noah), killing many innocents.

God allows Satan and hell to exist.

God's message is "love me, or I'll condemn you to the fires of hell for all eternity."

Do you love your wife in the same way?

 

[Clara Tea]

For what it's worth, I think if God knew this would be the result, he would avoided the trial or even creating us all together. He wanted to test us who is best in works, but this is a disaster, of course, God knew it could happen but also knew it was improbable. The improbable, the almost impossible, has happened, humans and jinn hate their Lord, pass this generation to generation and will pay the price .

Did God know all (including the future?)?

Is God hapless....stumbling around without a clue of future consequences?

Is God powerless to prevent human suffering? Can God defeat Satan? Can God liberate hell?

 

[Clara Tea]

A, B, and C for me. A is obvious for Christians "God is love" being one of the most famous assertions of Christianity. B is due to the existence and preservation of things, the glorification of the Saints, and so on, and everything concerning the Lord Jesus, which all show that He wills good to all things. C is for all and anything particular to my life, including existing, being forgiven, learning about God, answers to prayers, and experiencing God Himself who immediately makes the soul love and praise Him, nothing else can be done in His presence.

Despite all of this I fall short all the time of loving God as one ought (which although it is never enough to do so requires that one unreservedly give their entire being to Him, at least that much is owed out of justice).

I find that studying nature, visiting the cemetery, prayer, mental prayer especially, studying the Scriptures/Saints/etc, and serving others increases love for God in oneself.

So far in my life evil and suffering whether to me or to others does not change my judgment concerning God, for I can see with my eyes and know with the eyes of my mind that all things are loved by God.

All of the above is my opinion.

Lain: "Glorification of saints."

That includes the recently sainted Father Junipero Serra, who used Native American slave labor to build California's missions. He beat them, killed them, and instilled fear of eternal burning in hell if they didn't obey him (and Him (God)).

 

[Truthseeker]

There is no satisfactory answer for me either but I believe I will know more in the next life.

Good, I didn't see that before I answered you earlier.

 

[Trailblazer]

Please don't use that tack. You've already seen her response. When will you all learn to stop lecturing her?

I do not see that as a lecture, it is just a belief that Tony holds:
"I see satan is my choice to turn away from God's Love, from the light towards the darkness."

The problem is, the more people try to force me to love God and believe that God is loving the more I want to wash my hands with the whole thing and the more I want to become an atheist, so it has the reverse effect. All psychologists know that.

This thing about God's Love is blown way out of proportion. It is a Christian belief that some Baha'is have tried to commandeer but it is not the primary focus of the Revelation of Baha'u'llah.

1.O Son of Spirit!
My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, that thine may be a sovereignty ancient, imperishable and everlasting.

2.O Son of Spirit!
The best beloved of all things in My sight is Justice; turn not away therefrom if thou desirest Me, and neglect it not that I may confide in thee. By its aid thou shalt see with thine own eyes and not through the eyes of others, and shalt know of thine own knowledge and not through the knowledge of thy neighbor. Ponder this in thy heart; how it behooveth thee to be. Verily justice is My gift to thee and the sign of My loving-kindness. Set it then before thine eyes.
The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

I do not need to feel loved by God in order to serve God, not anymore than I need to feel loved by Lewis in order to stay with him and care for him.

What is love, is it a feeling or a behavior? Maybe I do love God and I don't even know it?

48.O Son of Man!
For everything there is a sign. The sign of love is fortitude under My decree and patience under My trials.
The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

 

[InvestigateTruth]

I fully agree. It is those people who demonstrated love, but believers want to say it was God. Why does God get the credit for what people do, that is what I do not understand.

It is said in scriptures, we are all like Mirrors, that reflect attributes of God. Depending on how pure and clean is the mirror of soul, God's attributes are more reflected. All was shown from those lovely people are thus, attributes of God, just as a mirror showing light and image of Sun. Thus, all that is seen as good in this world is, God's attributes, and all evil is seen, is lack of good, because the mirrors are not reflecting the light of God.

 

[Trailblazer]

Spiritual eyes exist. I have them now to some extent, not at all fully. It's not faith, it is reality. Can you trust that I have them?

I think you have them and I also have them and my questioning does not mean I don't have them.

How many time times have you told atheists that all evidence is not objective. It is inside you.

I have told them that but I also tell them that evidence is not proof.

 

[Truthseeker]

What people imagine is not proof of anything.

I'm not talking about imagination.

The problem is, the more people try to force me to love God and believe that God is loving the more I want to wash my hands with the whole thing and the more I want to become an atheist, so it has the reverse effect. All psychologists know that.

You should not have started this thread, then. Did you start this thread in ignorance of that people would try to force you to love God? I doubt it.

 

[Trailblazer]

Are you sure that you are not talking yourself into believing that God loves you (or anyone?)?

Most believers believe what they want to believe but I want to believe what is true.

 

[Trailblazer]

You should not have started this thread, then. Did you start this thread in ignorance of that people would try to force you to love God? I doubt it.

I had no idea what would happen when I started this thread because I am not God so I don't have foreknowledge.

It does not bother me whatever people say, I just want to know the truth.

People who try to force me to love God only do so because they are insecure about God's love. Of course they don't know that because it is subconscious.

 

[Truthseeker]

This thing about God's Love is blown way out of proportion. It is a Christian belief that some Baha'is have tried to commandeer but it is not the primary focus of the Revelation of Baha'u'llah.

The reason they keep talking about the love of God is partly because you keep asking the question.

1.O Son of Spirit!
My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, that thine may be a sovereignty ancient, imperishable and everlasting.

2.O Son of Spirit!
The best beloved of all things in My sight is Justice; turn not away therefrom if thou desirest Me, and neglect it not that I may confide in thee. By its aid thou shalt see with thine own eyes and not through the eyes of others, and shalt know of thine own knowledge and not through the knowledge of thy neighbor. Ponder this in thy heart; how it behooveth thee to be. Verily justice is My gift to thee and the sign of My loving-kindness. Set it then before thine eyes.
The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

There is also Hidden Words number 3 and 4. There is a balance.

I do not need to feel loved by God in order to serve God, not anymore than I need to feel loved by Lewis in order to stay with him and care for him.

What is love, is it a feeling or a behavior? Maybe I do love God and I don't even know it?

48.O Son of Man!
For everything there is a sign. The sign of love is fortitude under My decree and patience under My trials.
The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah

That's seems like a good answer to me. I think I'll quit this tread now and get to my other alerts.

 

[Lain]

So what is the act of suicide? Maybe some people just want to get to heaven sooner but others just don't want to exist anymore.

Trying to escape pain usually, at least in my experience. Can also be to send a message to someone and a myriad of other things.

I had no idea what would happen when I started this thread because I am not God so I don't have foreknowledge.

It does not bother me whatever people say, I just want to know the truth.

People who try to force me to love God only do so because they are insecure about God's love. Of course they don't know that because it is subconscious.

Who has tried to force you to love God in this thread?