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Why do Christians value the Bible more than science?

.Frame.

Title pending.
After all, if God created the world directly, with his own hand, which is infallible, but wrote the bible through men, who are fallible, surely science, which looks directly at God's creation, is a superior authority?

Why, then, do many (if not all, at least to some extent) Christians consider the Bible as a greater authority than science, and why do they consider it more valuable?
 

SageTree

Spiritual Friend
Premium Member
Fallible is Fallible no?
Meaning aren't fallible 'men' also orchestrating these experiments?
Dichotomy and generalizations don't seem to be a good starting point to finding real answers.



Maybe I misunderstand the question?

BUT......

not_sure_if_serious.jpg

In the first place.......
 

horizon_mj1

Well-Known Member
Fallible Humans are of course the ones creating new and innovative Sciences that helps find Knowledge; the thing to keep in mind is, the deep curiosity within the DNA of all Creation is dominate within Mankind; this being so, we are given the ability to find fundamental keys to the known Universe. One thing I find intriguing about Science is that while trying to prove one theory, at times another theory is found to be incorrect. I do not understand why Christians do not (for the most part) believe ins Science, but they are not alone. It seems to me that most Monotheist religions do not put much faith in Science, or even in each other when it comes right down to it. To me a religion is just one way of viewing a Personality or a part of a Personality of One/Ones in which are difficult to Know; Science helps to "fill in the blanks".;)
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
What verse does it say that?

here's a few.

romans 19:19 One of you will say to me: “Then why does God still blame us? For who is able to resist his will?” 20 But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? “Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, ‘Why did you make me like this?’”[h] 21 Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for special purposes and some for common use?

isaiah 55: 8 “For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways,”
declares the LORD.
9 “As the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways
and my thoughts than your thoughts.

that and the premise of having faith in the first place

Hebrews 11:6
6 And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.
 

SageTree

Spiritual Friend
Premium Member
Ok, cool, if that is how you see them I'm not one to argue.
Just wondered what you were using/referencing in your quest.
 

.Frame.

Title pending.
Well, in both cases human fallibility is a problem. But in the case of the Bible it is twice over (the writer and then the reader), whereas in the case of science it is only once over (the scientist).

So, surely that still means science is a greater authority?

I'm surprised that this question hasn't come up more in Christian theology and in relevant debates. I'd like to know more about the Christian response to it.

Why, by the way, is dichotomy not a good way to find real answers? Surely it's the foundation of all truth seeking questions. "Is this idea true or is it untrue", "which of these two ideas makes most sense", "how can these two ideas coexist", "how do they connect with one another", etc.

They're surely the first place any truth seeker should begin?

That's perhaps a little off point, but I thought it was worth mentioning so as to defend the validity of my question.
 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
After all, if God created the world directly, with his own hand, which is infallible, but wrote the bible through men, who are fallible, surely science, which looks directly at God's creation, is a superior authority?

Why, then, do many (if not all, at least to some extent) Christians consider the Bible as a greater authority than science, and why do they consider it more valuable?

Is Science is infallible?
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
Well, in both cases human fallibility is a problem. But in the case of the Bible it is twice over (the writer and then the reader), whereas in the case of science it is only once over (the scientist).

So, surely that still means science is a greater authority?


I'm surprised that this question hasn't come up more in Christian theology and in relevant debates. I'd like to know more about the Christian response to it.

Why, by the way, is dichotomy not a good way to find real answers? Surely it's the foundation of all truth seeking questions. "Is this idea true or is it untrue", "which of these two ideas makes most sense", "how can these two ideas coexist", "how do they connect with one another", etc.

They're surely the first place any truth seeker should begin?

That's perhaps a little off point, but I thought it was worth mentioning so as to defend the validity of my question.

great point!

the bible settles the "truth seekers" dilemma with this premise...
"how can one be a truth seeker it they are being deceived?"
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
Is Science is infallible?

science, in and of itself, is not fallible
"is a systematic enterprise that builds and organizes knowledge in the form of testable explanations and predictions about the world." -wiki

can you explain the scientific method?


skepticism is your friend.
 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
science, in and of itself, is not fallible
"is a systematic enterprise that builds and organizes knowledge in the form of testable explanations and predictions about the world." -wiki

can you explain the scientific method?


skepticism is your friend.

No it isn't; while I am no scientist, I have watched scientists ,,aking claims that they have had to withdraw at a later time, when proved to be erroneous.

We are being told daily about foodstuffs that we were previously told were good for us being declared as actually harmful. Scientists can only be as good as the level of knowledge and understanding in the world at the time.

An African who saw a plane for the first time thought it was magic - but the scientist knew it wasn't - because his level of understanding was higher.
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
No it isn't; while I am no scientist, I have watched scientists ,,aking claims that they have had to withdraw at a later time, when proved to be erroneous.
as they should being truth seekers...
instead of standing on an idea based on faith...is biased. something science tries to avoid through the scientific method...
can you explain what that is?

We are being told daily about foodstuffs that we were previously told were good for us being declared as actually harmful. Scientists can only be as good as the level of knowledge and understanding in the world at the time.
i see what you mean but this has nothing to do with the science of biology...
the standard of knowing the truth about how our body works...

what you are talking about is how science is being used as a $$ making enterprise. a friend of mine is an attorney who makes sure new drugs are tested accurately...the types of test are not set up within the scientific community rather it's set up by the federal gov't.
 

.Frame.

Title pending.
Is Science is infallible?

Well, science is just the process of testing the material world and drawing conclusions from that. The tests and the conclusions can be flawed (which comes down to the error of the scientists) but the results cannot be flawed. The thing that is tested, being part of a rational universe, will do exactly what that thing does when placed under those conditions and nothing else (either that or we live in a completely random universe where discussing beliefs would be irrelevant anyway). This information, therefore, can be said to be directly from God, so to speak.

So yes, science, in principle at least, is infallible.
 

outhouse

Atheistically
Why, then, do many (if not all, at least to some extent) Christians consider the Bible as a greater authority than science, and why do they consider it more valuable?

ignorance for the most part
 

Acim

Revelation all the time
Well, science is just the process of testing the material world and drawing conclusions from that. The tests and the conclusions can be flawed (which comes down to the error of the scientists) but the results cannot be flawed.

If the conclusions can be flawed, then human interpretations of scientific method, and results of those methods can be flawed. I can't think of a step of the method in which human fallibility doesn't come into play. Though, fallibility doesn't equal not credible. More like degrees of reliability at work.

The thing that is tested, being part of a rational universe, will do exactly what that thing does when placed under those conditions and nothing else (either that or we live in a completely random universe where discussing beliefs would be irrelevant anyway). This information, therefore, can be said to be directly from God, so to speak.

"Being part of a rational universe" is an axiom that I imagine some / many would find challenging to substantiate. Not to mention the implications (interpretations) that are derived from that assumption. I believe the universe is rational and that scientific research is further determining this. My interpretation of science in general, is that we are aspects / examples of intelligent design at work in the universe. We are part in parcel evidence of that claim. Scientific method, in my understanding of things, is evidence of I.D.

So yes, science, in principle at least, is infallible.

Still debatable, I would say. Having everything to do with accepted assumptions and axioms. Remind me to start a thread here of "what is science" for that inquiry and the inevitable diverse responses among groups of many humans are something I find very fascinating. If such a thread exists, I shall like to review it, sooner than later.

Science as infallible is akin to saying knowledge is infallible. Also, I would argue akin to claim that spirituality is infallible. Or if that is too much of a stretch, then I'd go with philosophy instead.

Back to OP inquiry. I do believe at least some Christians would argue in vein of "Christian science" is infallible. Basing this on certain axioms and, as said previously in this thread, "The being that is tested, being part of a Christian universe, will do exactly what that being does when placed under those conditions and nothing else."

"Those conditions" is where other huge part of interpretation is coming into play. But is whole, enormous other aspect of the larger argument that I don't care to get into right now.
 

Adonis65

Active Member
After all, if God created the world directly, with his own hand, which is infallible, but wrote the bible through men, who are fallible, surely science, which looks directly at God's creation, is a superior authority?

Why, then, do many (if not all, at least to some extent) Christians consider the Bible as a greater authority than science, and why do they consider it more valuable?

It's a question of faith. God is not interested in one's scientific research if it jeopardizes his spiritual welfare. First, become grounded in Jesus Christ, then let science help strengthen your testimony of Him.
 

idav

Being
Premium Member
If the conclusions can be flawed, then human interpretations of scientific method, and results of those methods can be flawed. I can't think of a step of the method in which human fallibility doesn't come into play. Though, fallibility doesn't equal not credible. More like degrees of reliability at work.
The facts are what are not flawed and if they are flawed science can usually determine a degree of certainty.


"Being part of a rational universe" is an axiom that I imagine some / many would find challenging to substantiate. Not to mention the implications (interpretations) that are derived from that assumption. I believe the universe is rational and that scientific research is further determining this. My interpretation of science in general, is that we are aspects / examples of intelligent design at work in the universe. We are part in parcel evidence of that claim. Scientific method, in my understanding of things, is evidence of I.D.
What are flawed are assumptions and science doesn't use an assumption except in trying to determine if it is true or false which makes science highly reliable. There is nothing in nature that we have found that indicates the work of a designer just as we have a hard time figuring if we are actually able to be seperate from the chain of cause and effect.


Still debatable, I would say. Having everything to do with accepted assumptions and axioms. Remind me to start a thread here of "what is science" for that inquiry and the inevitable diverse responses among groups of many humans are something I find very fascinating. If such a thread exists, I shall like to review it, sooner than later.
One thing science, with math as a tool, is able to do is predict within a certain level of certainty which can be seen as assuming but it is not. We accept certain facts and paint the picture from there. A good example is how einstein was able to predict so many things without ever having seen them.

Science as infallible is akin to saying knowledge is infallible. Also, I would argue akin to claim that spirituality is infallible. Or if that is too much of a stretch, then I'd go with philosophy instead.
Knowledge should be infallible or else it really isn't knowledge. Philosophy isn't really something that can be debunked unless we are assuming facts that end up not being true. For the most part philosophy is merely a way of assuming in a logical fashion and since it's logical it is solid until whatever assumptions were made are debunked.
Back to OP inquiry. I do believe at least some Christians would argue in vein of "Christian science" is infallible. Basing this on certain axioms and, as said previously in this thread, "The being that is tested, being part of a Christian universe, will do exactly what that being does when placed under those conditions and nothing else."
Christian science already have something to prove. Science is not in the nature of drawing a conclusion without having the facts first.
"Those conditions" is where other huge part of interpretation is coming into play. But is whole, enormous other aspect of the larger argument that I don't care to get into right now.
With a god that can do anything imaginable, you can assume just about anything in those conditions and reality doesn't even have to match.
 
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