That's in your power, we all have our choices to make for better or worse. There are many things I'd probably never believe myself.
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Why do religious people beleive the author of the scripts but ?
- Thread starter TheBrokenSoul
- Start date
That's in your power, we all have our choices to make for better or worse. There are many things I'd probably never believe myself.
I see this is telling us how to determine a true Messenger. It is also what Baha'u'llah offered as His proof his person and life and then the fruits of his teachings can be read.
In turn we can be seen as a beleiver by our ability to partake of those fruits.
Regards Tony
If you believe in the scientific method of evidence evaluation and testing, may I ask: Why are you religious?
I don't see the evidence, and the Catholics have historically been anti-evidence, anti-questioning, anti-testing and, basically, anti-heresy.
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I think you've got this whole thing backwards.
Atheism isn't based on evidence. It's based on lack of evidence. It's the non-atheists who have the burden of proof.
Noöne was indoctrinated into atheism. Atheism is the epistemic default. We're born non-believers. It's Religion that's learned.
CG Didymus
Veteran Member
Hey Tony, What do think about my apples and oranges comparison? Like let's say a Born-Again Christian knows the prophesies, as interpreted by other Christians, that Christian is expecting certain things to happen and for Jesus to be the coming back. So that's why I think that "Christian" fruit tree can be like an apple tree. And the fruit they are expecting is an apple. With Muhammad or Baha'u'llah, no matter how good they were and how good their followers are, isn't an apple. No matter how good your fruit is, it is still the wrong kind.
And... as you know the differences between the religions becomes the main focus, not the things that are good and that they have in common.
I'm not seeing the same goal. Some religions teach of an abode after death, but descriptions vary. Some teach of a spiritual evolution and eventual apotheosis. Others see dissolution, and still others expect union with reality.
TheBrokenSoul
Active Member
There is a scientific view of life after death that I am personally an expert on .
I see that is not using that prophecy as meant.
We judge the Messenger by His fruit. They are the tree that produce the fruits, not mankind.
We are here to choose the fruit from those trees.
No the beleivers, not what they think, but the Messenger, his person, his life and his Message is what we can judge as fruit.
It is only when we eat of their fruit, if we can know if it is good or not good.
Regards Tony
You must have had a radically different experience of the Church than me in general for you to hold that conclusion. I became religious via these things, testing ideas, and direct experience.
The Quran says when he replaces one sign/proof/guidance with another, he brings up the same level or better. Never is it less. And to me this is reasonable, that God only augments proof light and guidance.
From what I understand of Quran and Ahlulbayt (a), there is no comparing that guidance, with what new claiming Messengers/Prophets bring.
One Ahlulbayt is to be replaced by another, and to me, the holy books claimed by fake Prophets don't compare to the Quran nor do they tend to bring an Ahlulbayt and Twelve luminaries representing the founder. This Quran has shown has been the case in all times, and so newly claiming Prophets for example the Bab and Baha'allah, couldn't convince their offspring to go with the lie. And so they have no chosen offspring and this one of the signs that a Prophet is fake per Quran as it's a sign that aside from the (spiritual) brother of the founder, there is always an offspring, so bring 10 structures like Hassan to al-Hassan if they are truthful and wish to forge a structure like what God has revealed of his light and reminder. And let them bring a saying like the Quran. They cannot.
Bahaism for example epically fails to mimic and the sons and offspring of Baha'allah all turned back to Islam. They could not bring the Twelve Successors mimic, and so it fails by their own criteria of twelve Imams in Quran and Sunnah.
Either the lie goes on and on and exceeds Twelve Successors or the lie falls short and doesn't reach that number. This is God's words "let them bring ten structures like it (the reminder) forging them if they are truthful", and the Surah talks about offspring of Ibrahim and Sarah, and the good news of Isaac and Yaqoub in the past and that blessed Ahlulbayt in the past. Here the 10 is because it's referring to the living reminders and particularly means Hassan to Al-Hassan...and it says say you make the last one disappear and go to ghayba to complete the number twelve and say you have a "brother" with you, can you bring offspring one after another inheriting the leadership. Surely, you cannot. You will either exceed or fall short. Everywhere the Quran is referred it means bring one chapter like it or saying like it, but here it says to bring 10 because it has to do with the topic of an Ahlulbayt and chosen offspring as the Surah emphasizes on.
And their scriptures are no where in comparison to the Quran. No where.
There is no comparison at all. The Quran is of an exalted high nature and has many features proving it from God.
This is God's words:
"By the name of God, the Compassionate, the Compassionate, indeed we gave you the Abundance. So connect to your Lord and sacrifice. For indeed it's your enemy will be cut off."
A fake Prophet will be cut off one point if he tries to forge and mimic the concept of a reminder with a divine family. His offspring will not continue on the lie and end on twelve Successors or if they all in on the lie, they will keep going beyond twelve.
In this way it's his enemies who forge lies that are cut off, while, Allah (swt) through Fatima (a) has connected his successors to him and he is not without offspring connected to him in guidance.
The Surah was revealed when people mocked him for not having a son saying to tolerate him for soon he will be cut off without offspring that continue in what they accused of his lie and false divine authority.
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74x12
Well-Known Member
Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. (1 John 4:1)
74x12
Well-Known Member
Joel 2:28 is the answer. You need the same Spirit they had back then. The prophets had the holy Spirit and now it's for everyone who seeks for it. This is how you can know true messengers from fake ones.
rational experiences
Veteran Member
My mother spirit taught me the modern female life lesson. Don't let any male in pretence. Father claim superiority.
As you gain the same exact adult life. He is just a guide.
Reason brother and sister first human life partnership.
Father mother only in presence baby human life born.
Men's psyche misquoted all relationships said father to son only.
So his conscious spirit advice ignored his equal inheritance. Proves he always has.
What I learnt from every single sister life ever abused. Females memories.
As you gain the same exact adult life. He is just a guide.
Reason brother and sister first human life partnership.
Father mother only in presence baby human life born.
Men's psyche misquoted all relationships said father to son only.
So his conscious spirit advice ignored his equal inheritance. Proves he always has.
What I learnt from every single sister life ever abused. Females memories.
Not sure which religious people you are referencing.
Scripturally, we simple test the spirits (a biblical reference) to see if it is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. If it is prophecy, it says judge it.
(I speak as a follower of Christ)
TheBrokenSoul
Active Member
God foresee's the future because the light of proof is indistinguishable from the space God foresee's , only in ignorance does one ignore the truths that God presents before you , a thought is made of Gods light and that light is thought that can be spoken only if you believe in me .
rational experiences
Veteran Member
The science teachings said only one God. No prophets before god.
After one God came man's prophetic life sacrificed as he chose it.
Heavens the same equal balanced heavens state as the heavens.
Man consciousness took CH spirit gas advice converted the stone God into its release.
Was the teaching. Methane in atmosphere kills bio life.
Why the teaching was anti Christ's heavens gas. As the immaculate owned it's presence. Heavens only.
A teaching.
Now in the past did man prophecise Moses ark attack the attack destroyed life caused non stop flooding forty days and life mutated in Egypt to 40 year life span?
No says anyone owning common sense.
The ark story told after the fact. Meaning factoring caused it. When the factor never owned it. Mass heavens changed. So man said God did it. Maths never did.
Forgets to advise himself science owned built machines reacting.
Maths is just maths for new science. I don't include old machines or reactions lies. As he did the same today.
New science is one science he says is old science. I want new science but ancient older science. Completely ignored is already dust converting to nearly nothing.
Kind of like an earths black mass.
As maths the factor was space zero plus mass. Mass owning space zero to be present as mass.
So God owned the mass.
God never owned numbers theist said numbers came out of the wilderness. As Egyptians teachings after the fact.
Looking back theorising again. Storytelling.
So modern man says Moses is a theory let's copy how to do it again. As maths was imposed.
Why science was banned. As no scientist told any truth in reality human. The bible was shut. They never used to preach fake science from the pulpit.
The building healing where they meditated...prayed ...sang songs played music. Oils rubbed in. Incense.
Incense perfumed smoke in holy water sprinkled was for healing resonance.
Was the past building .....science buildings were toppled.
After one God came man's prophetic life sacrificed as he chose it.
Heavens the same equal balanced heavens state as the heavens.
Man consciousness took CH spirit gas advice converted the stone God into its release.
Was the teaching. Methane in atmosphere kills bio life.
Why the teaching was anti Christ's heavens gas. As the immaculate owned it's presence. Heavens only.
A teaching.
Now in the past did man prophecise Moses ark attack the attack destroyed life caused non stop flooding forty days and life mutated in Egypt to 40 year life span?
No says anyone owning common sense.
The ark story told after the fact. Meaning factoring caused it. When the factor never owned it. Mass heavens changed. So man said God did it. Maths never did.
Forgets to advise himself science owned built machines reacting.
Maths is just maths for new science. I don't include old machines or reactions lies. As he did the same today.
New science is one science he says is old science. I want new science but ancient older science. Completely ignored is already dust converting to nearly nothing.
Kind of like an earths black mass.
As maths the factor was space zero plus mass. Mass owning space zero to be present as mass.
So God owned the mass.
God never owned numbers theist said numbers came out of the wilderness. As Egyptians teachings after the fact.
Looking back theorising again. Storytelling.
So modern man says Moses is a theory let's copy how to do it again. As maths was imposed.
Why science was banned. As no scientist told any truth in reality human. The bible was shut. They never used to preach fake science from the pulpit.
The building healing where they meditated...prayed ...sang songs played music. Oils rubbed in. Incense.
Incense perfumed smoke in holy water sprinkled was for healing resonance.
Was the past building .....science buildings were toppled.
TheBrokenSoul
Active Member
Lifes lessons teaches that maths isn't required to jump off the ground .
Attachment to tradition and customs brought up in. People likely to accept a new messenger are those who are open minded to new ways.
firedragon
Veteran Member
So who said "Atheism is based on evidence"?
Read before responding to save your religious dogma. Understand what is said.
firedragon
Veteran Member
Lol. The scientific method was a philosophy championed by a "religious guy" mate. In fact, he was a religious scholar.