Why Does God Permit Evil?

[Cacotopia]

“No man is an island”

They certainly can be, while you may be a creature of the social world I most happily am not, I am perfectly fine in my wheelhouse of solitude.

 

[Cacotopia]

Therein lies a rather large issue, perhaps you want community, it works for you and you want to share that sense of community with others, only not everyone out there including me needs community. I have no problems socializing with others I simply choose not to. I am no stranger to social events and can easily hold my own in them, even make great connections. I simply prefer not spend my time making fleeting temporary connections with other people.

Now I would say my environment is a large contributor to my omniverted personality. Why I choose an introspective lifestyle as opposed to one that includes many people. I live in a tourist hub, 95% of the people you see that day, provided you go out and interact, you will never see again. You may make plans for later, but most often they do not keep those arrangements. Maybe you share information or facebook or whatsapp, but they are likely to never contact you again. They are also busy meeting new people, going scuba diving, riding elephants, hiking up dormant volcanoes at 3am, basking in hot water springs, running hash runs, or getting plastered at night. Like when you last met them they were on their way to getting drunk, or they just got into town and are only spending a week in your area. I don't get upset that they don't "call back" they are too busy being tourists. That's fine by me, if my short conversation with them made their trip better then I suppose it was worth it.

But I see no point in going out of my way, especially here, to meet people one time. It's not worth my time, and besides I am quite happy being alone making art for a majority of my day. And Yak-yakkity-yakin' to you yahoos on RF.(not meant to be offensive) I'm fine being alone, don't try to force your ideal lifestyle on others, some may take to it, others will be annoyed, some will get pissed off and some don't care.

 

[outlawState]

Many say that evil was created by God. Is this what you are saying? Could you briefly explain?
Does God want people to suffer then, and did he create the suffering in order to make people better?

God brings or permits or allows evil, through and by his agents, but does not himself do evil in bringing it - that is what he teaches about himself.

He does this both for punishment, and to teach faith.

This scripture seem to be speaking of the suffering of the Christ, and those who would follow in his footsteps - not to the suffering of all humanity, including those not believing in Christ.

True but Paul says,
Col 1:24
whereof I Paul am made a minister, who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

 

[Hawkins]

What does the Bible have to say on this subject?

Some say if God existed, he would put an end to the suffering we see in the world.
Others say that there is evidence God exists, and there is a reason why God permits suffering.
I want to get some input on the Biblical view on why the God of the Bible would allow evil and suffering.
Please try to provide scripture to support what you say, since this is supposed to present what the Bible says on the topic.

Jesus already said. If humans so tend to refuse to believe what happened on earth (deeds of God), how can they believe in heavenly things.

Earth is a place for all the evil to show up and to be destroyed once and for all. The Bible is basically for humans to get to the salvation message, instead of the heavenly information.

 

[Etritonakin]

What does the Bible have to say on this subject?

Some say if God existed, he would put an end to the suffering we see in the world.
Others say that there is evidence God exists, and there is a reason why God permits suffering.
I want to get some input on the Biblical view on why the God of the Bible would allow evil and suffering.
Please try to provide scripture to support what you say, since this is supposed to present what the Bible says on the topic.

God is able to not do evil. God knows both good and evil, but is able to do only good.

Then God made billions of newbies who are not yet able to do only good -so he "purposed" evil so they would actually experience it as little as possible while still learning the necessary lessons.

"If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is contrary to you, but you must rule over it.”

 

[stvdv]

God did create the universe, and he is bigger than you and I, bu he did also create life, so that makes him our father.
What child doesn't ask their father questions, and what kind of father doesn't give his children reasonable answers, rather than, "Shut up! I'm the boss here! How dare you ask me a question like that?"
That's frightening.
As a child, wouldn't you run away?
I probably would.

Sure that's a good point. I would run also.

But this is not what I implied in my reply. I only said "I leave judgment to God". So I don't ask a human this question. Also do I not interpret from the Bible "why does God permit evil" neither do I believe what a priest tells me about this. Because so easy to misinterpret. Proof is hundreds of Christians with all different views.

Of course I asked God myself and God gave me an answer I can live with. That's what I meant, I only want an answer from God.

And I agree with you ... Ask God is our right, because He is our Father.
I hope this takes confusion and misunderstanding away.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

For example, would you allow a beloved relative to go through a painful operation if you though it would save their life?

It would depend on the consequences. I prefer quality over presence of life.

If a close friend is bitten by a venomous snake, would you act quickly, and use your knife though discomforting, and painful to your friend, to extract as much of the poison as possible?

If you want them to die, sure. Do that.
Snakebites: First aid

Don't you think the scriptures give us God's view on suffering; why it exists; why he permits it; and if it will ever end?

We were made in God's image and God is someone who will kill people for the pettiest of reasons. And we're shocked when He values something bad.

Sacrifices were designed to court a god's favor. That means the favor isn't the default setting. It means gods didn't care unless bribed.

 

[columbus]

I am quite happy being alone making art for a majority of my day. And Yak-yakkity-yakin' to you yahoos on RF.(not meant to be offensive) I'm fine being alone,

You're making me a bit envious.
Tom

 

[columbus]

father.
What child doesn't ask their father questions, and what kind of father doesn't give his children reasonable answers, rather than, "Shut up! I'm the boss here! How dare you ask me a question like that?"
That's frightening.
As a child, wouldn't you

Here's the problem with this.
A child, let's call him Tom, asks an important question. He has to do so through a closed door, one that has never been opened as far as he knows.
He gets no answer through the door.
But his siblings* start talking a lot!

They have a huge array of answers, many of which are mutually exclusive. They all claim to know our father better than I do, usually better than anyone else does. But Our Father never gives me an answer as clear as the ones that my siblings claim He gave them.

And it all starts sounding pretty darned self serving. From my oldest brother to my baby sister, everyone wants to convince me that they actually know what our father is like and wants me to do, and it nearly always revolves around doing what they think I ought to do.
Including accept them as the authority on Dad.

And when I find them extremely lacking in credibility, they tell me that when Dad finally does come out of that room He's going to lock me in the basement forever and ever!
Because I didn't trust them to tell me about Him, and have Faith in them when they claim to speak for Him.

God did create the universe, and he is bigger than you and I, bu he did also create life, so that makes him our father.

Every now and then I consider starting a thread about the logical conflicts between Almighty God and the father figure images commonly used by Abrahamic apologists to plaster over the logical inconsistencies of the core teachings of their religions.
You seem like a reasonable person. Wanna play?
Tom


ETA *The "siblings" in this story are the prophets and holy folks and Scripture authors and such from Abrahamic religions. Most other religionists aren't like that.

 

[BilliardsBall]

What does the Bible have to say on this subject?

Some say if God existed, he would put an end to the suffering we see in the world.
Others say that there is evidence God exists, and there is a reason why God permits suffering.
I want to get some input on the Biblical view on why the God of the Bible would allow evil and suffering.
Please try to provide scripture to support what you say, since this is supposed to present what the Bible says on the topic.

To paraphrase scripture, the problem with the "evil is a problem argument" can be defined as "God didn't do evil/good my way, so God must be wrong."

I have heard 50 people complain about the evil in the world for every person who blesses God for all the good in this (fallen) world.

 

[nPeace]

God brings or permits or allows evil, through and by his agents, but does not himself do evil in bringing it - that is what he teaches about himself.

He does this both for punishment, and to teach faith.


True but Paul says,
Col 1:24
whereof I Paul am made a minister, who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

I agree that followers of Christ will be persecuted and suffer in Christ, but not the whole world. Thanks

 

[nPeace]

Jesus already said. If humans so tend to refuse to believe what happened on earth (deeds of God), how can they believe in heavenly things.

Earth is a place for all the evil to show up and to be destroyed once and for all. The Bible is basically for humans to get to the salvation message, instead of the heavenly information.

Appreciate your posting.
Do you have a scripture or two to show that

Earth is a place for all the evil to show up and to be destroyed once and for all. The Bible is basically for humans to get to the salvation message, instead of the heavenly information

 

[nPeace]

God is able to not do evil. God knows both good and evil, but is able to do only good.

Then God made billions of newbies who are not yet able to do only good -so he "purposed" evil so they would actually experience it as little as possible while still learning the necessary lessons.

"If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is contrary to you, but you must rule over it.”

Thanks. That interesting. When you say God

"purposed" evil

what do you mean exactly?

 

[nPeace]

Sure that's a good point. I would run also.

But this is not what I implied in my reply. I only said "I leave judgment to God". So I don't ask a human this question. Also do I not interpret from the Bible "why does God permit evil" neither do I believe what a priest tells me about this. Because so easy to misinterpret. Proof is hundreds of Christians with all different views.

Of course I asked God myself and God gave me an answer I can live with. That's what I meant, I only want an answer from God.

And I agree with you ... Ask God is our right, because He is our Father.
I hope this takes confusion and misunderstanding away.

Got it. Thank you for clarifying.
You couldn't ask a better person, than God himself.
I'm curious to know how you get your answer, but if you prefer not to mention, that's cool. It's not relevant to this discussion.
You just got me curious, that's all.

 

[Kenny]

I understand that you are saying that man's actions resulted in his being vulnerable to evil and suffering perpetuated by Satan, but this doesn't explain why God allows it.
I appreciate that bit of info though.

Of course, that is a theological question at it doesn't specifically say why. Here is my two cents worth...

1) Love must have a choice for one to be able to make a decision. On a very simplistic view... how can one say "I love pizza" if pizza is the only thing one has ever tasted? Thus, a choice was given to man. Tree of Life - love God, Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil - love another.
2) In as much as God gave dominion to man, to not be a liar, by His own decree gave the authority to man as to what happens. \ He allowed man to have self determination, to choose good or evil. In essence if He didn't allow it, we would basically be puppets on a string and He would also be a liar since He had already said that Mankind had the dominion.

At least that is my perspective at this time.

 

[nPeace]

It would depend on the consequences. I prefer quality over presence of life.

Good point. I do too - if your 'quality' is similar to what I had in mind.

If you want them to die, sure. Do that.
Snakebites: First aid

Bad example for our day, huh?
I guess I watched too many old time Western movies.

We were made in God's image and God is someone who will kill people for the pettiest of reasons. And we're shocked when He values something bad.

Sacrifices were designed to court a god's favor. That means the favor isn't the default setting. It means gods didn't care unless bribed.

Hmmm

pettiest of reasons

I think it is better that we don't judge a situation, in which we might not have all the facts.
In real life situations, we usually do this.
We see two persons talking, and looking in our direction, and we assume - they are gossiping about me.
Someone gets off lightly for something we think they should lose a hand or a foot for, and we cry foul.
In both cases, it may be simply we don't have all the facts - and we think we do.
According to scripture, God always judges fairly, and in righteousness, and I believe that - because it's in harmony with the qualities he manifests in his dealing, including his dealings with his wayward people.

Do you have any scriptures to share on what the Bible has to say on why God permits evil and suffering? I appreciate you sharing.

 

[trablano]

NPeace, I do not think God is above us and creates our reality. That would be predestination. Instead God is by our side and has his own experience of reality. When I pray and ask for something I usually do not get much or anything at all. But when I pray to communicate with the God who is besides me and who also wants to communicate, then things get in motion. Making God too big leads to disappointment. God is more like a little bird than a powerful giant. Of course that's just my perspective.

 

[nPeace]

Here's the problem with this.
A child, let's call him Tom, asks an important question. He has to do so through a closed door, one that has never been opened as far as he knows.
He gets no answer through the door.
But his siblings* start talking a lot!

They have a huge array of answers, many of which are mutually exclusive. They all claim to know our father better than I do, usually better than anyone else does. But Our Father never gives me an answer as clear as the ones that my siblings claim He gave them.

And it all starts sounding pretty darned self serving. From my oldest brother to my baby sister, everyone wants to convince me that they actually know what our father is like and wants me to do, and it nearly always revolves around doing what they think I ought to do.
Including accept them as the authority on Dad.

And when I find them extremely lacking in credibility, they tell me that when Dad finally does come out of that room He's going to lock me in the basement forever and ever!
Because I didn't trust them to tell me about Him, and have Faith in them when they claim to speak for Him.



Every now and then I consider starting a thread about the logical conflicts between Almighty God and the father figure images commonly used by Abrahamic apologists to plaster over the logical inconsistencies of the core teachings of their religions.
You seem like a reasonable person. Wanna play?
Tom


ETA *The "siblings" in this story are the prophets and holy folks and Scripture authors and such from Abrahamic religions. Most other religionists aren't like that.

Your 'daddy' has a serious favoritism problem, and should be put over someone's lap, and beaten.
I don't know about playing, but open the door, let me take a look at what's inside. As long as there are no snakes, I think I will venture in.

 

[nPeace]

To paraphrase scripture, the problem with the "evil is a problem argument" can be defined as "God didn't do evil/good my way, so God must be wrong."

I have heard 50 people complain about the evil in the world for every person who blesses God for all the good in this (fallen) world.

To paraphrase scripture, the problem with the "evil is a problem argument" can be defined as "God didn't do evil/good my way, so God must be wrong."

I have heard 50 people complain about the evil in the world for every person who blesses God for all the good in this (fallen) world.

Man. That is deep. Thanks for sharing.
I guess for the most part, we don't know how to be appropriative and thankful.
The sun shines - we bawl.
The rain falls - we bawl.
What?

To be fair though, I think out of those 50, about 20 are genuinely confused, simply because they have been lied to, and misled by the priest, that's just interested in taking their money, or being paid by the government.

 

[columbus]

Your 'daddy' has a serious favoritism problem, and should be put over someone's lap, and beaten.

Why are you blaming this on God?
I don't.

The Father in my story never even came out of the room. He never said anything. He certainly didn't express any favoritism.
The favoritism was entirely a (not too credible) claim from the siblings. Nothing to do with Father.
Tom