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Why Does Michael Lead Angels?

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
And what does the Bible explicitly teach?
Since our Bible is a copy of Esword, with resource materials, thus it has all that stuff stated; if you need us to pinpoint data, please ask.

Edited the post btw, as it came across personally harsh, which wasn't my intent. :oops:

In my opinion.
:innocent:
 
Last edited:

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
matthew 13:41 uses the term son of man. that is a reference to a person; which is also an angel, or messenger of god, a prophet.

fyi it is forbidden to worship any created thing; including an angel, or a human.


Deuteronomy 4:19
And take heed, lest you lift your eyes to heaven, and when you see the sun, the moon, and the stars, all the host of heaven, you feel driven to worship them and serve them, which the Lord your God has given to all the peoples under the whole heaven as a heritage.


Deuteronomy 17:3
who has gone and served other gods and worshiped them, either the sun or moon or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded,




מֲלְאָךְ mălʼâk, mal-awk'; from an unused root meaning to despatch as a deputy; a messenger; specifically, of God, i.e. an angel (also a prophet, priest or teacher):—ambassador, angel, king, messenger.

Thank you for sharing that :)

So:

1. Who is Michael?
2. Who are his angels?
3. Why did he lead the war against Satan instead of Christ?
4. Are there two separate groups of loyal angels, one belonging to Christ and another to Michael?
 

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
Hmmmm. Must be a lot of Bible scholars on Peyote.

1. Jesus existed in heaven before he came to earth. Proverbs 8:22 / John 1:1,3, 14; 3:13; 8:23, 58; 17:5 / Colossians 1:15-17 / 1 John 2:13 / Revelation 3:14 all speak of Jesus’ existence before the world began, in fact before anything was created Jesus was created. Before Heaven, the heavens, the Earth, and of course, man. He is the firstborn of creation, the beginning of creation, he came from somewhere other than this world, he descended from heaven. There can be no doubt that he had a pre-human existence in heaven before he came to Earth as the man Jesus Christ.

2. Jesus’ position in heaven before he came to the earth must have been an important one, considering he was the first of Jehovah’s creation and all things were created through him and for him. (Proverbs 8:22 / John 1:3) That means not only the heavens and earth as we know them but the angels and heaven as well. Jesus is referred to as the "word of God," this means he is the spokesperson. (John 1:1) As the spokesperson for Jehovah God we can assume that when an angel performed some important task on earth, like guiding and protecting the early Israelites from Egypt or taking the physical form of men in performing an important task, it was likely Michael as he existed before he came to earth as Jesus.

3. The term archangel means chief of the angels. Arch means chief or principal. The term is only applied to one angel in the Bible. Michael. It is always used in the singular. There is only one archangel. The term archangel itself only appears twice throughout Scripture. At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 Paul writes of Jesus as having the voice of the archangel, and Jude 9 indicates Michael disputed with Satan over the body of Moses. So there is a connection with Jesus as well as an indication that Michael was connected in some way with the people of the exodus of Egypt.

4. Other than Jehovah God himself only two people in the Bible are said to be in charge of or over the angels. They are Michael and Jesus Christ. The name Michael appears only five times throughout Scripture. At Daniel 10:13, 21; 12:1 / Jude 9 and Revelation 12:7.

5. Are there any others who believe Michael and Jesus are the same? Yes, there are many. Joseph Benson, E. W. Hengstenberg, J. P. Lange, Butterworth, Cruden, Taylor, Guyse all wrote that Michael and Jesus were the same.

Clarke's Commentary (Adam Clarke) - "Let it be observed that the word archangel is never found in the plural number in the sacred writings. There can be properly only one archangel, one chief or head of all the angelic host .... Michael is this archangel, and head of all the angelic orders .... hence by this personage, in the Apocalypse, many understand the Lord Jesus."

W. E. Vine - the "voice of the archangel" (1 Thessalonians 4:16) is apparently "the voice of the Lord Jesus Christ" - An Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words, p. 64.

The 1599 Geneva Study Bible: Christ is the Prince of angels and head of the Church, who bears that iron rod."

The International Standard Bible Encyclopaedia: - "The earlier Protestant scholars usually identified Michael with the preincarnate Christ, finding support for their view, not only in the juxtaposition of the "child" and the archangel in Rev. 12, but also in the attributes ascribed to him in Daniel" – vol. 3, p. 2048, Eerdmans Publishing, 1984 printing.

John Calvin: "I embrace the opinion of those who refer this to the person of Christ, because it suits the subject best to represent him as standing forward for the defense of his elect people." - J. Calvin, Commentaries On The Book Of The Prophet Daniel, trans. T. Myers (Grand Rapids: Baker Book House, 1979), vol. 2 p. 369.

Brown's Dictionary of the Bible - on 'Michael' and 'Angel,' both these words do sometimes refer to Christ; and also affirms that Christ is the Archangel.

The NIV Study Bible - "The Angel of the LORD .... Traditional Christian interpretation has held that this 'angel' was a preincarnate manifestation of Christ as God's Messenger-Servant. It may be ..., the angel could speak on behalf of the One who sent him." - footnote for Gen. 16:7. Zondervan Publishing, 1985

Smith's Bible Dictionary (says of Michael) - "Angel of the Lord. ... Christ's visible form before the incarnation. p. 40"

Today's Dictionary of the Bible - "Angel of the Lord [angel of Jehovah] - occurs many times in the Old Testament, where in almost every instance it means a supernatural personage to be distinguished from Jehovah .... Some feel the pre-incarnate Christ is meant." Bethany House Publ., 1982, p. 39.


How refreshing it is to be in the company of another who loves the truth so very, very much! :D
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
Michael is a metaphor for the One like EL
H4317
מִיכָאֵל
mı̂ykâ'êl
me-kaw-ale'
From H4310 and (the prefixed derivation from) H3588 and H410; who (is) like God?; Mikael, the name of an archangel and of nine Israelites: - Michael.
Total KJV occurrences: 13
Yehoshua means Lord Saves
H3091
יְהוֹשֻׁעַ יְהוֹשׁוּעַ
yehôshûa‛ yehôshûa‛
yeh-ho-shoo'-ah, yeh-ho-shoo'-ah
From H3068 and H3467; Jehovah-saved; Jehoshua (that is, Joshua), the Jewish leader: - Jehoshua, Jehoshuah, Joshua. Compare H1954, H3442.
Total KJV occurrences: 218
Yahavah means Lord of Creation.
H3068
יְהֹוָה
yehôvâh
yeh-ho-vaw'
From H1961; (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God: - Jehovah, the Lord. Compare H3050, H3069.
Total KJV occurrences: 6521

These are Strongs from Esword.

Lord (Yah) is its own independent word.

H3050
יָהּ
yâhh
yaw
Contracted for H3068, and meaning the same; Jah, the sacred name: - Jah, the Lord, most vehement. Cp. names in “-iah,” “-jah.”
Total KJV occurrences: 49

In Esword's & my opinion. :innocent:
 

Faithofchristian

Well-Known Member
At Revelation 12:7 we learn that "Michael and his angels" fight a vital war that results in the ousting of Satan the Devil and his wicked angels from heaven.

Revelation, likewise, describes Jesus as the Leader of an army of faithful angels. (Revelation 19:14-16) And the apostle Paul specifically mentions “the Lord Jesus” and “his powerful angels.” (2 Thessalonians 1:7; Matthew 16:27; 24:31; 1 Peter 3:22)

So the Bible speaks of both Michael and “his angels” and Jesus and “his angels.” (Matthew 13:41)

5c81d717a88033693fb847bb344f6810d1ca19330b7196e0f2612e3bb64928bb.jpg


These facts leave us with a series of fascinating questions:

1. Who is Michael?
2. Who are his angels?
3. Why did he lead the war against Satan instead of Christ?
4. Are there two separate groups of loyal angels, one belonging to Christ and another to Michael?


Because Michael being a Arch Angel leads the angels..
Like a General leads his army.

Jesus doesn't come with angels, But Jesus sends his Angels into battle.

No more than a king or President sends their General into battle with their army
 

Baroodi

Active Member
Hmmmm. Must be a lot of Bible scholars on Peyote.

1. Jesus existed in heaven before he came to earth. Proverbs 8:22 / John 1:1,3, 14; 3:13; 8:23, 58; 17:5 / Colossians 1:15-17 / 1 John 2:13 / Revelation 3:14 all speak of Jesus’ existence before the world began, in fact before anything was created Jesus was created. Before Heaven, the heavens, the Earth, and of course, man. He is the firstborn of creation, the beginning of creation, he came from somewhere other than this world, he descended from heaven. There can be no doubt that he had a pre-human existence in heaven before he came to Earth as the man Jesus Christ.

2. Jesus’ position in heaven before he came to the earth must have been an important one, considering he was the first of Jehovah’s creation and all things were created through him and for him. (Proverbs 8:22 / John 1:3) That means not only the heavens and earth as we know them but the angels and heaven as well. Jesus is referred to as the "word of God," this means he is the spokesperson. (John 1:1) As the spokesperson for Jehovah God we can assume that when an angel performed some important task on earth, like guiding and protecting the early Israelites from Egypt or taking the physical form of men in performing an important task, it was likely Michael as he existed before he came to earth as Jesus.

3. The term archangel means chief of the angels. Arch means chief or principal. The term is only applied to one angel in the Bible. Michael. It is always used in the singular. There is only one archangel. The term archangel itself only appears twice throughout Scripture. At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 Paul writes of Jesus as having the voice of the archangel, and Jude 9 indicates Michael disputed with Satan over the body of Moses. So there is a connection with Jesus as well as an indication that Michael was connected in some way with the people of the exodus of Egypt.

4. Other than Jehovah God himself only two people in the Bible are said to be in charge of or over the angels. They are Michael and Jesus Christ. The name Michael appears only five times throughout Scripture. At Daniel 10:13, 21; 12:1 / Jude 9 and Revelation 12:7.

5. Are there any others who believe Michael and Jesus are the same? Yes, there are many. Joseph Benson, E. W. Hengstenberg, J. P. Lange, Butterworth, Cruden, Taylor, Guyse all wrote that Michael and Jesus were the same.

Clarke's Commentary (Adam Clarke) - "Let it be observed that the word archangel is never found in the plural number in the sacred writings. There can be properly only one archangel, one chief or head of all the angelic host .... Michael is this archangel, and head of all the angelic orders .... hence by this personage, in the Apocalypse, many understand the Lord Jesus."

W. E. Vine - the "voice of the archangel" (1 Thessalonians 4:16) is apparently "the voice of the Lord Jesus Christ" - An Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words, p. 64.

The 1599 Geneva Study Bible: Christ is the Prince of angels and head of the Church, who bears that iron rod."

The International Standard Bible Encyclopaedia: - "The earlier Protestant scholars usually identified Michael with the preincarnate Christ, finding support for their view, not only in the juxtaposition of the "child" and the archangel in Rev. 12, but also in the attributes ascribed to him in Daniel" – vol. 3, p. 2048, Eerdmans Publishing, 1984 printing.

John Calvin: "I embrace the opinion of those who refer this to the person of Christ, because it suits the subject best to represent him as standing forward for the defense of his elect people." - J. Calvin, Commentaries On The Book Of The Prophet Daniel, trans. T. Myers (Grand Rapids: Baker Book House, 1979), vol. 2 p. 369.

Brown's Dictionary of the Bible - on 'Michael' and 'Angel,' both these words do sometimes refer to Christ; and also affirms that Christ is the Archangel.

The NIV Study Bible - "The Angel of the LORD .... Traditional Christian interpretation has held that this 'angel' was a preincarnate manifestation of Christ as God's Messenger-Servant. It may be ..., the angel could speak on behalf of the One who sent him." - footnote for Gen. 16:7. Zondervan Publishing, 1985

Smith's Bible Dictionary (says of Michael) - "Angel of the Lord. ... Christ's visible form before the incarnation. p. 40"

Today's Dictionary of the Bible - "Angel of the Lord [angel of Jehovah] - occurs many times in the Old Testament, where in almost every instance it means a supernatural personage to be distinguished from Jehovah .... Some feel the pre-incarnate Christ is meant." Bethany House Publ., 1982, p. 39.

(before anything was created, Jesus was created in heaven)
Who was born by Mary, then? Looks to me like myth stories
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
Thank you for sharing that :)

So:

1. Who is Michael?

Object of 'el

2. Who are his angels?
he leads God's other angels.



3. Why did he lead the war against Satan instead of Christ?
because it is a spiritual = mental war between service to all(god) as self and service to self.


4. Are there two separate groups of loyal angels, one belonging to Christ and another to Michael?
Christ is all and in all. The 144000 are christs
 

Ellen Brown

Well-Known Member
I'm angry right now, so perhaps should not speak. However, some seem to use their beliefs as a weapon of destruction and torment, and I want no part of that. Shame on you, shame.

Our beliefs should draw us and be used by us to more fully understand and obey our Creator. We should use our beliefs in love and to comfort others full stop.
 

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
I'm angry right now, so perhaps should not speak. However, some seem to use their beliefs as a weapon of destruction and torment, and I want no part of that. Shame on you, shame.

Our beliefs should draw us and be used by us to more fully understand and obey our Creator. We should use our beliefs in love and to comfort others full stop.

Are you addressing me or is this directed at someone else?
 

lostwanderingsoul

Well-Known Member
I am still stuck on the idea of Jesus being created. If the Word was there with the Father at the beginning of all things, doesn't that imply that both the Word and The Father are both eternal beings with no beginning or end? Yes Jesus had a physical beginning when He was born of Mary but He existed as the Word from all eternity.
 

lostwanderingsoul

Well-Known Member
I am still unsure about the idea of Jesus being created. If the Word was with the Father at the beginning of all things doesn't that imply that both the Father and the Word are eternal beings with no beginning or end? Why does the Word need to be created?
 
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