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Why Don't You Believe?

scitsofreaky

Active Member
This is along the lines of the earlier statement about telling lies. People have a natural instinct to survive, but even more than that, they want to have a high quality of life. This is why kids lie when they are young, they don't want to get punished, which would temporarily lower their quality of life.
Now, using the same logic, man wants there to be an afterlife of some sort because we want to survive and exist. It also is a cause for man to believe in a afterlife of a high quality, eg heaven and nirvana. I don't use this to disprove that there is an afterlife, that would be foolish of me to even attempt, but it does make me very suspicious of religiongs that teach an afterlife like a heaven.
 
NetDoc said:
You are a deluded person if you truly feel that you have digested ALL the evidence that exists.
I do not feel I have digested ALL (or even "MOST" :p ) the evidence that exists.

NetDoc said:
I would suggest that you have been exposed to less than %1 of the evidences out there. If fact, to live your life based only on the evidence (and all the evidence) would lead to the "paralysis of analysis". You would be spending ALL of your time in research and would spend NO TIME actually living your life.
1) One can both do research and live one's life
2) Accepting/rejecting claims based on evidence does not lead to "paralysis of analysis," it makes one's analysis realistic. I would rather make the realistic analysis "I don't know" (or at least qualify my analysis with words like "probably") than pretend to be omniscient. I'll research those topics important to me myself....as for the rest, I feel that some confidence in the peer-review process and the discoveries it makes is warranted, whether or not I see the evidence for these discoveries firsthand.

NetDoc said:
We all use paradigms to facilitate many areas of our lives. Social interactions, speech, faith, even driving a car. The only way to exclude their use is to understand EVERYTHING there is to understand and to have ALL THE EVIDENCE safely within your grasp.
Some paradigms are well-founded, and some are not. The paradigm "if you speed all the time, you're more likely to get into an accident" is well supported, for example. And now, back to the initial question....

Why don't you believe? Although I enjoyed and appreciated your response about paradigms, I was actually looking for an answer to this question, NetDoc. :)

I confess I expected most of the replies to say something about the complete lack of evidence to support the existence of an Invisible Pink Unicorn and Her vengeful manure-shoveling punishment. Could that have something to do with it? :rolleyes:
 

Saw11_2000

Well-Known Member
Atheists are evil evil people! What's wrong with you?

I don't believe because I just don't think that there is a God. I have never felt his "presence" or even wanted him to be watching me, etc. I believe science can explain more than any religion. I'm one of those people who needs proof to be on a side, and science has offered me enough proof to be an atheist.
 

jamaesi

To Save A Lamb
I don't believe because I can't. I see no proof.

When I finally admitted to myself I don't and can't believe in a G-d, I did not die, I was not struck down. The world did not end. I was happier with myself.

When I was religious, terribly so when I was younger, I now know I used it as a crutch because the idea of a loving G-d and kind Father Figure was something I clung to.


Right now I try to remain apathetic on the topic of religion. To each their own, I suppose, but I will bite if any religion is forced on myself.
 

Dr. Nosophoros

Active Member
To me, people that want an afterlife are in many ways forgetting this life. When you are dead you are dead, anything after that the corpses will tell- do we hear the corpses speak?
 

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
well Spinks, I don't believe in the IPU because there is no evidence for her, if that makes you feel any better. :p

But hey, my view of creator is more like Caral Sagan's than the Popes.
"we are all made of star stuff." :jiggy:

wa:do
 

Nimueway

New Member
Well, I believe in 'god', although I don't necessarily prescribe to it an anthropomorphized view of it like most of the world religions do. I wouldn't suppose to assign to it human qualities because of my own egoism. I believe, because I've had several occurances in my life where the event could not be explained and cannot be denied. Despite the best attempts at a logical explanation.

"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand arapt in awe, is as good as dead; his eyes are closed..." Albert Einstein
 

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
Ah Spinks,

The next time I answer, I will not elaborate. That way maybe you won't miss the simple answer (in blue).

I don't believe in the IPU since it does not fit into the paradigm that I have constructed according to the evidence I have seen to date. Additional evidence may strengthen or weaken this position depending on how it affects my paradigm.

YOU operate on your personal paradigm. Without it you could not make assumptions (there is no IPU), inferences (speed kills, ergo if I speed I might be killed), and extrapolations (the higher the speed, the more likely I am to be killed). Evidence by itself has no meaning. To interpret or use that evidence, you have to construct a paradigm that encompasses, sorts and assigns causality to it.
 

Yerda

Veteran Member
NetDoc said:
I don't believe in the IPU since it does not fit into the paradigm that I have constructed according to the evidence I have seen to date. Additional evidence may strengthen or weaken this position depending on how it affects my paradigm.

YOU operate on your personal paradigm. Without it you could not make assumptions (there is no IPU), inferences (speed kills, ergo if I speed I might be killed), and extrapolations (the higher the speed, the more likely I am to be killed). Evidence by itself has no meaning. To interpret or use that evidence, you have to construct a paradigm that encompasses, sorts and assigns causality to it.
And your paradigm includes the likelyhood of a God? Why not god(esse)s then?
 
NetDoc said:
Ah Spinks,

The next time I answer, I will not elaborate. That way maybe you won't miss the simple answer (in blue).

I don't believe in the IPU since it does not fit into the paradigm that I have constructed according to the evidence I have seen to date. Additional evidence may strengthen or weaken this position depending on how it affects my paradigm.
At first, I thought "Whoah! How did I miss that?" Then I went back and checked your last few posts, and found I hadn't missed it....it just wasn't there. But that is neither here nor there. ;) Did you say evidence? Now we're getting somewhere! :)

NetDoc said:
YOU operate on your personal paradigm. Without it you could not make assumptions (there is no IPU), inferences (speed kills, ergo if I speed I might be killed), and extrapolations (the higher the speed, the more likely I am to be killed). Evidence by itself has no meaning. To interpret or use that evidence, you have to construct a paradigm that encompasses, sorts and assigns causality to it.
I completely agree, and would add that some paradigms correspond accurately to reality, and others do not. Some evidence is reliable, and some evidence is not very reliable.

I've started a new thread to continue this discussion here: http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?p=127634#post127634
 
M

Majikthise

Guest
Saw11_2000 said:
Atheists are evil evil people! What's wrong with you?

I don't believe because I just don't think that there is a God. I have never felt his "presence" or even wanted him to be watching me, etc. I believe science can explain more than any religion. I'm one of those people who needs proof to be on a side, and science has offered me enough proof to be an atheist.
SAW, you mean you've never known any religion?:confused: Just curious.
 

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
Yeah I did Spinks... like I said, I just have to make it plain and simple! :D I'll keep the subtleties and nuances to a minimum from now on! :biglaugh:
 

Green Man

Member
Mr_Spinkles said:
"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours." ~Stephen Roberts


We all disbelieve in some things. Whether you believe strongly that something is false, or doubt it, or simply defer belief in it for when and if good evidence is found to substantiate the claim, there must be some things in which you lack faith. The following is one possible example of such a thing:

The Invisible Pink Unicorn is a supernatural being (who can, of course, manifest Herself in physical form if She wants). From another thread:
"The Invisible Pink Unicorn wants us to brush her long, flowing mane and tail. But she wants us to brush her hair because we want to, not because we've been forced to. Her holiness the Invisible Pink Unicorn let's us choose whether we want to live in bliss brushing her hair or suffer eternal damnation shoveling her manure in the afterlife. It's up to us to choose. People who choose not to believe in the existence of the Invisible Pink Unicorn have made their choice, and with a heavy heart, she will respect their decision."

The above is, in my opinion, a bunch of horse dung. ;) I have little doubt that most of you feel the same way.

But why do you not believe in it? Why don't you believe in a million other stories, myths, legends, and gods, for that matter? What causes a person to doubt--or at least defer acceptance of--a claim?

I would argue that two main factors cause people to not believe in a claim:
1) The claim is not psychologically/emotionally attractive in some way. Here, "attractive" means the claim promises rewards for belief and/or punishment for disbelief, or that a person has already decided the claim is true and the psychological phenomenon known as "confirmation bias" keeps them from genuinely considering the possibility that it is false.
2) The claim does not fit with or is not/cannot be supported by observation (only imagination).

I would argue that only #2 is a valid reason for rejecting/deferring belief in a claim, in terms of how likely it is that the resulting disbelief corresponds to reality.

Think of some things you don't believe in (like the IPU, for exmaple). Why don't you beleive? Don't you have enough faith? Do you WANT to shovel manure for eternity?! :D


Why don't I believe?Why should I believe?I don't buy into the "You've got to have faith" nonsense either.Faith tells you to believe when common sense tells you not to.
 

3.14

Well-Known Member
this is religion

65305-8=god
43590690\6+6=god
2845-485*5=god

this is sience

4594+8=4602
4653247506-546\45=still unanswered
3654092+56 =3654148

though sience can't answer all the qeustions it atleast trys to answer them
 
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