Why I believe God Created Life.

[George-ananda]

How many times does it take repeating the same blatantly false claim and being shown how it is blatantly false before making the same blatantly false claim is a bold faced lie?

What the heck are you even talking about. Rusra's first sentence was:

Evolution claims life arose from a series of chance events.


Replace 'evolution' with 'abiogenesis' and I don't see a blatantly false claim.

 

[McBell]

What the heck are you even talking about. Rusra's first sentence was:

Evolution claims life arose from a series of chance events.


Replace 'evolution' with 'abiogenesis' and I don't see a blatantly false claim.

You do realize that this is not the only thread he has ever been in, right?

 

[Skwim]

Evolution claims life arose from a series of chance events . . . .

. . . . .That is just the beginning of the complexity encountered in so-called simple cells.

Don't you have anything else? . . . Anything?

This old broken record you insist on playing has grown tiresome.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I find it amusing how so many people think it's less likely for simple cellular life to slowly form through molecular evolution in a chemical soup rich in organic compounds, than it is for an infinitely complex super-being to spontaneously exist from nothing.

 

[Father Heathen]

Evolution and abiogenesis are two separate theories.

Evolution and theism are not mutually exclusive.

But considering you've been informed of these facts innumerable times before, Rusra, you've already knew this.

 

[nazz]

Evolution claims life arose from a series of chance events.

Wrong right out of the starting gate

 

[Runewolf1973]

I find it amusing how so many people think it's less likely for simple cellular life to slowly form through molecular evolution in a chemical soup rich in organic compounds, than it is for an infinitely complex super-being to spontaneously exist from nothing.

It really blows my mind the fact that in this modern day and age of science, technology, and reason there are actually people who think like this. Like c'mon seriously....infinite super-beings? Some folks need a reality check away from religion.

 

[nazz]

It really blows my mind the fact that in this modern day and age of science, technology, and reason there are actually people who think like this. Like c'mon seriously....infinite super-beings? Some folks need a reality check away from religion.

says the guy who believes in shamanic healing

 

[Runewolf1973]

says the guy who believes in shamanic healing

Yes. I also practice what I believe in. A form of shamanic healing which utilizes and directs the natural energy and forces which are present in our bodies, not by "supernatural powers". It is actually somewhat similar to acupuncture, except I don't use pins and needles.

 

[rusra02]

No it doesn't.

Kinda hard to take your OP seriously when the very first sentence is so blatantly false.

Whether you call it abiogenesis or evolution, they are two peas in the same pod, IMO. I think it is dishonest of evolutionists to try to call evolution's claimed beginning by some other name.
But so as not to get sidetracked by evolutionary nitpicking, a BBC film available in Youtube explains some of the workings in a cell. If you can ignore the evolution propaganda scattered through the presentation, it describes through animation some of the inner workings and structure of a cell. The astounding complexity of the cell with its molecular machinery certainly convinces me that this was designed, as it also convinces biologists and other scientists.
The film describes the cell as a city. I think the cell is far more complex and wonderful. But even the comparison to a city begs the question: what city ever existed without a maker or founder?
True science has discovered the wonderful complex world in the cell, and IMO has confirmed the fact that only a supremely intelligent Person could have fashioned the cell. As Psalm 104:24 affirms: "How many your works are, O Jehovah! You have made all of them in wisdom."

 

[rusra02]

Joe....come on man. Many people use the term evolution to include abiogenesis and, if not technically correct, we know what they mean. It was not dishonest.

Thank you. I believe evolutionists dishonestly divorce life's beginnings from their theory. You can surmise their motives as well as I.

 

[Windwalker]

Whether you call it abiogenesis or evolution, they are two peas in the same pod, IMO. I think it is dishonest of evolutionists to try to call evolution's claimed beginning by some other name.

But so as not to get sidetracked by evolutionary nitpicking, a BBC film available in Youtube explains some of the workings in a cell. If you can ignore the evolution propaganda scattered through the presentation, it describes through animation some of the inner workings and structure of a cell. The astounding complexity of the cell with its molecular machinery certainly convinces me that this was designed, as it also convinces biologists and other scientists.
The film describes the cell as a city. I think the cell is far more complex and wonderful. But even the comparison to a city begs the question: what city ever existed without a maker or founder?
True science has discovered the wonderful complex world in the cell, and IMO has confirmed the fact that only a supremely intelligent Person could have fashioned the cell. As Psalm 104:24 affirms: "How many your works are, O Jehovah! You have made all of them in wisdom."

So then you don't deny evolution. God created the world through the process of evolution to create that city. Right? No more need to kick against the pricks, protecting your ideas instead of seeing what God actually did. Right?

Honestly, I see this persecution of "evolutionists", as you call them no different than Saul of Tarsus thinking he was protecting a 'correct belief' in God by going after Christians who saw a bigger picture than he did. Why can't God be responsible for creation through evolution? Why must you try to say how God does things? Are you too married to your biases? How are you any different than Saul prior to his enlightenment experience on the road to Damascus?

 

[rusra02]

Why didn't God create us perfect then?

Why the high placement of the larynx?

Why are so many vital organs unprotected?

Why do our organs wear out in the first place?

Why do we age when exposed to solar radiation?

Those are good questions. The answers are found only in one place that I know of. The Bible tells us God did create us perfect. (Genesis 1:27,28) Imperfection and death began when our first parents rebelled against God. Then, "through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because they had all sinned." (Romans 5:12) Uniquely I believe, the Bible is the only book that promises God will undo the effects of sin, and return us to the state of perfection Adam and Eve enjoyed before their rebellion against God. (Romans 8:20,21)

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

Cities evolved, so to speak, to be that way. It started with small communities of a particular tribe. Later on, we see villages, then small towns, then after that, bigger cities. Even from a sociological standpoint, evolution at work.

As far a humans being created perfect, then evil coming in, according to the Bible, imperfection and evil were both conceived in god's mind, regardless of anything else. This suggests to me that 1. if a god exists, it's far from perfect, and 2. god intended for evil and imperfection to be part of creation, which puts serious doubt about what it wants. Thankfully, I don't believe in such a being; not only is it confusing to try to explain it and it's existence, much less it's characteristics, it's even more confusing to try to explain it's motives.

EDIT: and it is dishonest to try to equate abiogenesis and evolution; you might as well try to equate evolution with astrophysics. While all science is ultimately connected, they're completely different studies. Evolution is a study within biology, abiogenesis, with chemistry.

 

[rusra02]

So then you don't deny evolution. God created the world through the process of evolution to create that city. Right? No more need to kick against the pricks, protecting your ideas instead of seeing what God actually did. Right?

Honestly, I see this persecution of "evolutionists", as you call them no different than Saul of Tarsus thinking he was protecting a 'correct belief' in God by going after Christians who saw a bigger picture than he did. Why can't God be responsible for creation through evolution? Why must you try to say how God does things? Are you too married to your biases? How are you any different than Saul prior to his enlightenment experience on the road to Damascus?

Of course I deny evolution, especially the theory that all life sprang from a single celled organism. And God did not create the cell through a process of evolution, nor did I say or imply he did. I think your comparison of evolutionists being "persecuted" to early Christians persecution is divorced from reality, to say the least. Just read some of the posts by evolutionists to see who does the defaming and ridicule.
I do not say how God does things. God describes how he created life in Genesis chapters 1 and 2. For example, Genesis 1:21 says: "And God created the great sea creatures and all living creatures that move and swarm in the waters according to their kinds and every winged flying creature according to its kind. And God saw that it was good." Thus, one kind of sea life or flying creature did not evolve, but were created according to their kinds. As to the first man, God affirms he was a special creation, not something evolved. (Genesis 2:7)
I reject evolution because the evidence supports design. This includes the wonderful structures in cells, which IMO could not possibly arise by chance or so-called "natural selection".

 

[rusra02]

Cities evolved, so to speak, to be that way. It started with small communities of a particular tribe. Later on, we see villages, then small towns, then after that, bigger cities. Even from a sociological standpoint, evolution at work.

As far a humans being created perfect, then evil coming in, according to the Bible, imperfection and evil were both conceived in god's mind, regardless of anything else. This suggests to me that 1. if a god exists, it's far from perfect, and 2. god intended for evil and imperfection to be part of creation, which puts serious doubt about what it wants. Thankfully, I don't believe in such a being; not only is it confusing to try to explain it and it's existence, much less it's characteristics, it's even more confusing to try to explain it's motives.

EDIT: and it is dishonest to try to equate abiogenesis and evolution; you might as well try to equate evolution with astrophysics. While all science is ultimately connected, they're completely different studies. Evolution is a study within biology, abiogenesis, with chemistry.

I addressed your edit in another post. Yes, cities do develop, but not without intelligent agents acting to design and modify these cities. That is ID, not evolution.
As to your statement about evil, evil does not originate with God. Deuteronomy 32:4,5 explains: "The Rock, perfect is his activity, For all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness who is never unjust; Righteous and upright is he. *They are the ones who have acted corruptly. They are not his children, the defect is their own. They are a crooked and twisted generation!"
God grants us the gift to choose the path we take. He warned Adam of the consequences of disobedience. (Genesis 2:16,17) Adam chose to disobey God. I believe the sin is his, just as a son who is raised by a loving father to be honest, turns to crime due to his own selfish desires. As the Bible says, "the defect is their own."

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

I addressed your edit in another post. Yes, cities do develop, but not without intelligent agents acting to design and modify these cities. That is ID, not evolution.
As to your statement about evil, evil does not originate with God. Deuteronomy 32:4,5 explains: "The Rock, perfect is his activity, For all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness who is never unjust; Righteous and upright is he. *They are the ones who have acted corruptly. They are not his children, the defect is their own. They are a crooked and twisted generation!"
God grants us the gift to choose the path we take. He warned Adam of the consequences of disobedience. (Genesis 2:16,17) Adam chose to disobey God. I believe the sin is his, just as a son who is raised by a loving father to be honest, turns to crime due to his own selfish desires. As the Bible says, "the defect is their own."

I won't address the evolution/abiogenesis part of your thread, it's become pointless. But I find it funny that people try, as hard as they can, to prove god did not create evil. He created all things, according to your theology, yet somehow man supposedly created the great antithesis to god. This would make man equal creators with god. And of course, this would mean that god did not create all things. And it goes around and around in circles, until the headache gets to be too much. No logic, no reason whatsoever.

 

[rusra02]

Here are some more interesting facts that make evolutionary theory an impossible one, IMO: "Imagine that you have been allowed past the “security guard” and are now inside the cell. The interior of a prokaryotic cell is filled with a watery fluid that is rich in nutrients, salts, and other substances. The cell uses these raw ingredients to manufacture the products it needs. But the process is not haphazard. Like an efficiently run factory, the cell organizes thousands of chemical reactions so that they take place in a specific order and according to a set timetable.

A cell spends a lot of its time making proteins. How does it do so? First, you would see the cell make about 20 different basic building blocks called amino acids. These building blocks are delivered to the ribosomes, which may be likened to automated machines that link the amino acids in a precise order to form a specific protein. Just as the operations of a factory might be governed by a central computer program, many of the functions of a cell are governed by a “computer program,” or code, known as DNA. From the DNA, the ribosome receives a copy of detailed instructions that tell it which protein to build and how to build it.

What happens as the protein is made is nothing short of amazing! Each one folds into a unique three-dimensional shape. It is this shape that determines the specialized job that the protein will do. Picture a production line where engine parts are being assembled. Each part needs to be precisely constructed if the engine is to work. Similarly, if a protein is not precisely constructed and folded to exactly the right shape, it will not be able to do its work properly and may even damage the cell.

How does the protein find its way from where it was made to where it is needed? Each protein the cell makes has a built-in “address tag” that ensures that the protein will be delivered to where it is needed. Although thousands of proteins are built and delivered each minute, each one arrives at the correct destination.

Why do these facts matter? The complex molecules in the simplest living thing cannot reproduce alone. Outside the cell, they break down. Inside the cell, they cannot reproduce without the help of other complex molecules. For example, enzymes are needed to produce a special energy molecule called adenosine triphosphate (ATP), but energy from ATP is needed to produce enzymes. Similarly, DNA is required to make enzymes, but enzymes are required to make DNA. Also, other proteins can be made only by a cell, but a cell can be made only with proteins.

Microbiologist Radu Popa does not agree with the Bible’s account of creation. Yet, in 2004 he asked: “How can nature make life if we failed with all the experimental conditions controlled?” He also stated: “The complexity of the mechanisms required for the functioning of a living cell is so large that a simultaneous emergence by chance seems impossible.”
(Origin of Life - Five questions Worth Asking)

 

[McBell]

Whether you call it abiogenesis or evolution, they are two peas in the same pod, IMO. I think it is dishonest of evolutionists to try to call evolution's claimed beginning by some other name.
But so as not to get sidetracked by evolutionary nitpicking, a BBC film available in Youtube explains some of the workings in a cell. If you can ignore the evolution propaganda scattered through the presentation, it describes through animation some of the inner workings and structure of a cell. The astounding complexity of the cell with its molecular machinery certainly convinces me that this was designed, as it also convinces biologists and other scientists.
The film describes the cell as a city. I think the cell is far more complex and wonderful. But even the comparison to a city begs the question: what city ever existed without a maker or founder?
True science has discovered the wonderful complex world in the cell, and IMO has confirmed the fact that only a supremely intelligent Person could have fashioned the cell. As Psalm 104:24 affirms: "How many your works are, O Jehovah! You have made all of them in wisdom."

"irreducible complexity" argument
Argument from incredulity
Appeal to divinity

Care to try something that is NOT a fallacy?

 

[McBell]

Thank you. I believe evolutionists dishonestly divorce life's beginnings from their theory. You can surmise their motives as well as I.

So what?
You back your beliefs with more beliefs, ignoring every effort to educate you.