Why Isn't God Visible?

[Scuba Pete]

Seeing people throw spilled salt over their shoulder doesn't prove that they'd have bad luck if they didn't, it just proves that people are superstitious.

Did Picasso really exist then? I think all these people who have his paintings are merely being superstitious.

 

[Nanda]

I see that you don't accept God in the form of the energy of life. God can be measured the same way as energy. Doctors do it every day. If you think God can't be measured than God must be dead itself.

I don't accept god in any form, I'm an atheist.

 

[Nanda]

Did Picasso really exist then? I think all these people who have his paintings are merely being superstitious.

If only it really worked that way. I hope that's not your most convinving arguement.

 

[Nanda]

Did Picasso really exist then? I think all these people who have his paintings are merely being superstitious.

I should be more clear. You mentioned temples and people praying as an indication that god exists - but all you're really seeing there are people's reactions to their own belief in a god; it doesn't prove that any god actually exists, just that there are people who believe he/she/it does. There are countless television shows dedicated to proving that the lochness monster exists, and every year, people journey to Scotland to see for themselves, and there are tourist centers they can visit, books they can buy, and people who claim to have seen the monster to talk to and ask questions; but none of this proves that the lochness monster is real, just that some people believe in it. That is not convincing enough evidence for a skeptic. Instead, the skeptic looks at the size of the loch, explores how diverse and plentiful the wildlife and plantlife around the loch is, and ultimately determines that no matter what people want to believe, there's just no way that Loch Ness could sustain one Pliosaur, nevermind the many, many Pliosaurs it would take for them to have lived in the loch undisturbed since the time of the dinosaurs. The physical evidence is just not convincing enough.

 

[Zeno]

I see that you don't accept God in the form of the energy of life. God can be measured the same way as energy. Doctors do it every day. If you think God can't be measured than God must be death itself.

How many joules of energy is God?

 

[Papersock]

Did Picasso really exist then? I think all these people who have his paintings are merely being superstitious.

We can use the same methods to determine if Picasso really existed that we can use for any human being. If there is various documented evidence that the person existed, that’s pretty good evidence, especially if the person himself wrote something or creating something to leave behind. A marked grave would be helpful.
Whether he existed or not, someone must have painted the paintings. We know this because we know how paintings are made. We’ve seen how paintings are made. Anyone can make a painting. We don’t know how plants or animals are made, but we know people can’t do it.
Proving that a specific person existed is different from proving that God exists. We already know for a fact that people can exist and do create things.

 

[PureX]

God is a personification of the unknown, and the unknowable. Thus, God can only be presumed, suspected, anticipated, and intuited.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

How many joules of energy is God?

All of them?

 

[Aasimar]

God is a personification of the unknown, and the unknowable.

So why can't we just call the unknown unknown, leave the unknowable since it can't be known, and move on? I can presume, suspect, anticipate, and intuit whatever I want, but it doesn't make it real.

 

[PureX]

So why can't we just call the unknown unknown, leave the unknowable since it can't be known, and move on?

Because we are afraid of it. As a life form, we survive and thrive by our intellect - our ability to "know" things. Therefor, the unknown represents a serious threat to us. And we are frightened by it.

We overcome this fear by tricking ourselves into pretending that we can control the unknown. And we do that by anthropomorphizing it. We give the unknown a human "personality" and a name, and then we can imagine that we can control this personality that we imposed on it. We call the personality our "God". And we imagine that by doing "what God wants" we can gain God's favor: that we can in effect control God. And to control God is to control the unknown. Because God is just a name and personality that we imposed on the unknown and unknowable.

I can presume, suspect, anticipate, and intuit whatever I want, but it doesn't make it real.

It makes it more real than you think. We humans have a very strong tendency to see what we expect to see, and to overlook what we did not look for. Ask any cop who takes statements after an auto accident, or a crime. Human beings don't have a very thorough perception of actual reality. Our actual physical senses are minimal, and weak. The idea of "reality" that we hold in our minds is far more thorough and elaborate, and it can very easily overwhelm what our senses are telling us about actual reality.

"Believers" believe. And reality seldom changes that.

 

[Scuba Pete]

1

I should be more clear. You mentioned temples and people praying as an indication that god exists - but all you're really seeing there are people's reactions to their own belief in a god; it doesn't prove that any god actually exists, just that there are people who believe he/she/it does.

There is plenty of evidence, but there are many ways to interpret the data. When you are closed minded, you can only see your way. It's always best to open your mind to the alternate interpretations. Perhaps this will enable you to empathize with theists.

 

[Willamena]

How many joules of energy is God?

Haha. I'm going to write that down...

 

[Nanda]

1There is plenty of evidence, but there are many ways to interpret the data. When you are closed minded, you can only see your way. It's always best to open your mind to the alternate interpretations. Perhaps this will enable you to empathize with theists.

Don't assume. I spent several years of my young life searching for god with an open mind and an open heart.

 

[Scuba Pete]

What did I assume?

If you look for something and can't find it, WE ASSUME that it is hopelessly lost, it doesn't exist or it wasn't important anyway.

Let's face there are many times I KNOW that my car keys don't exist even though I am sincerely looking for them. Myths of non-existence abound in our society. There is a whole group of people dedicated to showing that we never really landed on the moon. I challenge you to "prove" the moon landing to them.

 

[Zeno]

Myths of non-existence abound in our society.

And myths of existence do not?

Check out some statistics on people who believe intelligent aliens have visited this planet. Or how many people believe they've been abducted by aliens. Or believe in astrology, psychic powers, and ESP. How many people believe that prayers have physical healing properties?

 

[Willamena]

1There is plenty of evidence, but there are many ways to interpret the data. When you are closed minded, you can only see your way. It's always best to open your mind to the alternate interpretations. Perhaps this will enable you to empathize with theists.

You assumed a "best way." The really "best way" is for everyone to come to it in their own way.

 

[Hema]

God is in the material and the spiritual. However, God is not limited by anything material because whatever occupies space is limited by time and God is limitless. We can see God when we look at people, animals, nature etc.

 

[erasmo]

Well personally I have never seen God, but then according to some of you this does not disprove his existence. Yet, I have never seen unicorns or fairies either, by your logic this does not disprove them either, so why then are they in the Fiction section of the library.

 

[erasmo]

Well personally I have never seen God, but then according to some of you this does not disprove his existence. Yet, I have never seen unicorns or fairies either, by your logic this does not disprove them either, so why then are they in the Fiction section of the library.

 

[Scuba Pete]

You assumed a "best way." The really "best way" is for everyone to come to it in their own way.

No... I never said or intimated that one way was "best", only that we often put blinders on as a defense mechanism. Take the steenkeeng blinders off and try to see it from all perspectives. If you are "right" then you will enhance your understanding of why you are right. If you are wrong, you will be introduced to more possible paradigms that may or may not be true.