Why Religion Fails

[The Sum of Awe]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence. Most religions fall under that mistake.

Our walks of life are to lead us somewhere, some place we strive for that is different for all of us. If the practice isn't for the practitioner, the practice will not be practice. This doesn't mean all practices are meant to directly benefit the practitioner, an example where it wouldn't is sacrificing oneself for humanity, which indirectly benefits the one sacrificing themselves because it is their goal.

Working for God (non-pantheistically speaking) gets us nowhere. God's already greater than humanity, and perhaps even perfect according to some beliefs. Humans serving God is absurd because God is already served.

It becomes even more absurd when you are serving a God that you have nothing but faith in. If God isn't evident, then God clearly isn't essential to your life. Atheists are living proof that life can be lived without focusing on God. What is the point in wasting any energy on something we can never be sure of during this lifetime? That's like paying electric bills for a light that MIGHT be on, but it's not certain.

I think the only religion worth practicing is one that favors the universe and that which is evident. Easy for me to say since I believe the universe is literally divine and alive. I expect a lot of bats to the head for this thread but bring it on. -flinches-

 

[psychoslice]

No bats to the head from me, I totally agree, and nicely said.

 

[Ouroboros]

I wish I could click "like" several times.

 

[VitoOFMCap]

Accepting first philosophy (of being) and not metaphysics isn't a new thing. Not sure why you would expect get bashed for it. But I'm not sure how you get back to the divinity of the universe, unless your literal definition of "divine" removes the nouminal aspect.

Maybe I'm just dumb (been told that before! ) and I'm not following: Religion as "worship and act" fails? Religion as "faith in the unverifiable" fails? Religion fails because of its absurdity? Perhaps you can elaborate.

 

[Thana]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence. Most religions fall under that mistake.

Our walks of life are to lead us somewhere, some place we strive for that is different for all of us. If the practice isn't for the practitioner, the practice will not be practice. This doesn't mean all practices are meant to directly benefit the practitioner, an example where it wouldn't is sacrificing oneself for humanity, which indirectly benefits the one sacrificing themselves because it is their goal.

Working for God (non-pantheistically speaking) gets us nowhere. God's already greater than humanity, and perhaps even perfect according to some beliefs. Humans serving God is absurd because God is already served.

It becomes even more absurd when you are serving a God that you have nothing but faith in. If God isn't evident, then God clearly isn't essential to your life. Atheists are living proof that life can be lived without focusing on God. What is the point in wasting any energy on something we can never be sure of during this lifetime? That's like paying electric bills for a light that MIGHT be on, but it's not certain.

I think the only religion worth practicing is one that favors the universe and that which is evident. Easy for me to say since I believe the universe is literally divine and alive. I expect a lot of bats to the head for this thread but bring it on. -flinches-

What's absurd to me is worship of the inanimate, temporary and indifferent, But I digress.

Doesn't the concept of free will kind of make everything you've said null? If God gave us choice, Then Atheists are evidence of the ability to choose.
Maybe I'm overlooking something, But the rebuttal seems pretty obvious.

 

[DawudTalut]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence. Most religions fall under that mistake.

Our walks of life are to lead us somewhere, some place we strive for that is different for all of us. If the practice isn't for the practitioner, the practice will not be practice. This doesn't mean all practices are meant to directly benefit the practitioner, an example where it wouldn't is sacrificing oneself for humanity, which indirectly benefits the one sacrificing themselves because it is their goal.

Working for God (non-pantheistically speaking) gets us nowhere. God's already greater than humanity, and perhaps even perfect according to some beliefs. Humans serving God is absurd because God is already served.

It becomes even more absurd when you are serving a God that you have nothing but faith in. If God isn't evident, then God clearly isn't essential to your life. Atheists are living proof that life can be lived without focusing on God. What is the point in wasting any energy on something we can never be sure of during this lifetime? That's like paying electric bills for a light that MIGHT be on, but it's not certain.

I think the only religion worth practicing is one that favors the universe and that which is evident. Easy for me to say since I believe the universe is literally divine and alive. I expect a lot of bats to the head for this thread but bring it on. -flinches-

Peace be on you.
In true Islamic sense, worship or working for God mean whole range of rights to be paid:

Holy Quran (alislam.org/quran)
[4:37] And worship Allah and associate naught with Him, and show kindness to parents, and to kindred, and orphans, and the needy, and to the neighbour that is a kinsman and the neighbour that is a stranger, and the companion by your side, and the wayfarer, and those whom your right hands possess. Surely, Allah loves not the proud and the boastful,

[14:24] And those who believe and do good works will be admitted into Gardens through which rivers flow, wherein they will abide by the command of their Lord. Their greeting therein will be ‘Peace’.

 

[DawudTalut]

@
The Sum of Awe

I think the only religion worth practicing is one that favors the universe and that which is evident.

Holy Quran [1:2] All praise belongs to Allah, Lord of all the worlds,

Lord of all worlds means Lord of all people too.

No nation or special people are favoured.

[49:14] O mankind, We have created you from a male and a female; and We have made you into tribes and sub-tribes that you may recognize one another. Verily, the most honourable among you, in the sight of Allah, is he who is the most righteous among you. Surely, Allah is All-knowing, All-Aware.

 

[Skwim]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence.

What are you talking about? Are you saying that philosophy fails when it starts considering things greater than existence? If so, give us an example please.

Most religions fall under that mistake.

When they start considering things greater than existence? If so, how about another example, because I'm not quite following.

Our walks of life are to lead us somewhere, some place we strive for that is different for all of us.

Why would one's occupation/profession (walk of life) necessarily lead one to strive for something different from everyone else's?

It becomes even more absurd when you are serving a God that you have nothing but faith in. If God isn't evident, then God clearly isn't essential to your life.

So, for a god to be essential to one's life it has to be evident. Evident as in self evident or evident to others as well?

I think the only religion worth practicing is one that favors the universe and that which is evident.

And what worthiness would one derive from such a religion?

 

[StarryNightshade]

I'm going to be honest, I don't exactly know what you are trying to say. Many philosophies go beyond than just our existence and they don't "fail" in the slightest bit. If anything, philosophies that go beyond the question of our existence is what attracts many people to them. Also, the Pantheistic God isn't "superior" to others by being more "evident". If anything, it too is just another silly concept to those who are non-theistic. How is it evident that the universe is "alive and divine"?

Not too be entirely rude, but the OP is just a bunch of smoke blown out of a rear end.

 

[Madhuri]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence. Most religions fall under that mistake.

Define existence? If God exists, he/she/it is also part of existence. How can anyone think there is something greater than everything?

Working for God (non-pantheistically speaking) gets us nowhere. God's already greater than humanity, and perhaps even perfect according to some beliefs. Humans serving God is absurd because God is already served.

I wont argue here I suppose, as I consider God and humanity to be part and parcel. But I do also understand the idea that even dualistic perspectives see the worship of God as beneficial to the practitioner, not to God.

It becomes even more absurd when you are serving a God that you have nothing but faith in.

I agree with this in the sense that it seems absurd to devote yourself to something you have no reason to believe in other than that you've been told by others that it is real. However, for many it really isn't as simple as that.

If God isn't evident, then God clearly isn't essential to your life.

How can you know that? Plenty of things have not and probably still are not evident to us that is essential to our life. Just because we are ignorant of something doesn't mean it isn't important.

This is like saying "if you can't see it, it isn't there". I'm not sure what logical fallacy it is. Anyone?

Atheists are living proof that life can be lived without focusing on God.

I don't think anyone believes you can't continue living if you don't believe in God...

What is the point in wasting any energy on something we can never be sure of during this lifetime? That's like paying electric bills for a light that MIGHT be on, but it's not certain.

Who is really sure of anything in life? The only thing we know for sure is that we exist. Should we simply stop everything because we're not 100% sure of anything?

I don't think that being spiritual or religious can be adequately compared with paying the electricity bill. First you have to determine a person's experiences, values and motivation for being religious before you can make a valid comparison.

I think the only religion worth practicing is one that favors the universe and that which is evident. Easy for me to say since I believe the universe is literally divine and alive. I expect a lot of bats to the head for this thread but bring it on. -flinches-

But your perspective is based on the sum total of your knowledge and experience, which is extremely limited, as is everyone's. As you go through life that perceptive is likely to change is some way, over and over until you die.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence. Most religions fall under that mistake.

So there!

 

[Willamena]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence.

Is truth greater than existence, if existence is true?

 

[Quintessence]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence. Most religions fall under that mistake.

I'm not following here. What do you feel is the goal of philosophy, and how could one go about failing it? Why do you feel philosophy fails when there is something considered greater existence? Wouldn't that in of itself be a philosophy? I don't understand, and by extension, I don't understand how some religions are falling under this "mistake."

Working for God (non-pantheistically speaking) gets us nowhere. God's already greater than humanity, and perhaps even perfect according to some beliefs. Humans serving God is absurd because God is already served.

I'm not following here either. What do you feel it means to serve something? What is the role between the servant and the thing served?

To illuminate how I see this, I'm going to use a metaphor. Most of us work for employers that have hundreds, perhaps thousands of employees along with complex infrastructure that serves a purpose. Our places of work are greater than we are, in essence. Does this mean we have nothing to contribute to our employers, and that it is absurd to serve them? Do our employers gain no benefit from our services?

It becomes even more absurd when you are serving a God that you have nothing but faith in. If God isn't evident, then God clearly isn't essential to your life. Atheists are living proof that life can be lived without focusing on God. What is the point in wasting any energy on something we can never be sure of during this lifetime? That's like paying electric bills for a light that MIGHT be on, but it's not certain.

Here, I would recommend keeping in mind that serving the gods isn't just about the gods (or God, if one prefers). It is also about acting in accord with your values, and if that is wrapped up in language about service to the gods, so what? That doesn't make it a waste. I also have a hard time saying to the one-god believers "hey, it's totally a waste of your time to help out that food pantry in service to your God."

 

[Ouroboros]

Is truth greater than existence, if existence is true?

I think what he means is that philosophy tends to be deductive in nature, and many times, even in philosophy, there are no clear answer to the questions made. In philosophy, we had some 15-20 topics we went through where the debate is still going on (euthanasia, death penalty, abortion, war/terrorism, and much more). Our teacher said, "just because we can't find a clear and single answer doesn't mean that we don't have answers." Meaning, there are many different answers, and we can come to something that gives us a clearer picture, but it's not necessarily some end result of one specific truth value that puts an end to the debate.

Philosophy is great, I personally love philosophy but have no time for it, but it's not the only way to reach all answers and understandings of reality. Philosophy always depend on what we know. Each debate is based on the facts, numbers, research, data, etc from science, politics, economy, and so on, and can only make its proper deductions from that. (I found the debate of death penalty for instance to use research that I found rather incomplete, but still made arguments one way or another.)

Anyway, not saying that you're wrong, but I'm just trying to see if I can explain what I think Sum meant to say. (He can of course correct me if I'm wrong. )

 

[Azihayya]

I foremost consider religion to be a firmly held belief, and not so much the mainstream definition which has also pigeon-holed the meaning of theism to mean precisely one thing which doesn't necessarily even relate to its origins (theos), that being ancient Greece. Theism as an idea was essentially created and popularized by a person named Ralph Cudworth who lived from 1617–88 -- who can tell what all of the people responsible for the genesis of such words truly thought about what they were saying; the very nature of these definitions are so ambiguous that it's very easy to abstract them in many ways, although I generally find that we, as a society, don't ordinarily engage in the practice of straying away from any given intended meaning of such words that we've only had the pleasure of a life-time to consider. A deity could just as easily be an entity, as far as I'm concerned, and am open to considering because the universe is such a vast and intangible place where as far as I know, a vast untold amount of incredible things have taken place.

I say all of this only as a pretense to my honest point of interest in this thread, which is that I feel as though the sentiment that 'Why Religion fails' is aggressive and offensive by nature. If you could honestly say that you know what everyone who has ever affiliated with what is in essence and idea has ever thought and could reconcile all of their thoughts into a singularly consistent response, which turned out to be that 'religion fails', then this sentiment would come across as fair, but rather, to me at least, it comes across as nothing but an unfair thing to say. Beyond what is relayed in mainstream media, there are countless numbers of real people out there with various unknowable beliefs, and I think they should be respected, even if their tendency to affiliate with a common idea happens to coincide with a notion that you personally disagree with.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Philosophy fails when it there is something considered greater than existence. Most religions fall under that mistake.

Okay, you say "Most religions...." Which ones don't, by your estimation???