openyourmind
Active Member
Why don't we all just get along? God made dirt and dirt don't hurt! We all agree that we came from the dirt and it was good for human life! Can't we just fix the space in between?
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Why Sceince Vs Religion
- Thread starter openyourmind
- Start date
Would you please ask a question or make a statement that indicates what you want to talk about?
I will be happy to respond. Give us more.
tumbleweed41
Resident Liberal Hippie
If we can all accept that religion should deal with only the spiritual needs of man, if those needs exist, and science should deal with natural reality, then there is no conflict.
It is only when religion defies natural reality, such as promoting YEC or ID in defiance of empirical evidence to the contrary, that there is real conflict.
Conversely, science should not delve into the untestable, unverifiable, and unfalsifiable realm of supernatural belief.
Herman Tripleton
Member
I love how all the fanatical scientists say that the religionists are on attack mode and yet the above thread clearly demonstrates the opposite.
Religion needs to give up its idolatry and return to its message and the poor old atheists need to wake up and realize that all things are created by some other thing and that no thing can create itself. Once both sides accepts reality they can return to the happy place they both sprang from.
Religion needs to give up its idolatry and return to its message and the poor old atheists need to wake up and realize that all things are created by some other thing and that no thing can create itself. Once both sides accepts reality they can return to the happy place they both sprang from.
Skwim
Veteran Member
tumbleweed41 is a fanatical scientist? Is he aware of this?
And you're dragging atheists into the discussion because, what, all scientists are atheists? Or is it just fanatical scientists?
outhouse
Atheistically
isnt your reality based on some invisible magic man that says "poof there it is" ???
when science see's clearly how everything started.
No, it doesn't. There are still tons of questions and holes to fill about the current theories. The Big Bang isn't a sure thing: it's just the best we've got based on what we currently know and can observe. (And, despite the fact that many aspects of the theory don't make any sense to me, I accept that it's currently the most likely scenario.)
Science is about the search for truth, not stating the truth.
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tumbleweed41
Resident Liberal Hippie
This has nothing to do with "atheists", and the common misuse of the word "atheist' when discussing science and religion only serves to confuse the issue.
Nor is it necessary that "all things are created by some other thing".
It can be shown than on both the quantum level, and at the original singularity that "cause" is not a necessity.
tumbleweed41
Resident Liberal Hippie
Don't get to far ahead of yourself.
Making claims of absolutes when uncertainty and speculation still exists is as damaging to the scientific method as Creationist dogma.
openyourmind
Active Member
So we came from water? I'd like you to prove this. I'll give you as much distilled water as you want. But, you have to create life from just that. Can you do it?
tumbleweed41
Resident Liberal Hippie
In his over-zealousness, Outhouse did not mention the other elements necessary for abiogenesis, however, it is quite clear we did not arise from the dust of the earth.
The above thread does not clearly demonstrate the opposite (if you referring to the OP)...The OP states categorically that God made dirt, which presumably negates any need for mankind to look into whether this is true or otherwise or what exactly is dirt at all. Indeed why bother to teach science in school at all, just tell our children that God did everything. There are many religious countries around the world where this is done and in the USA and UK it is attempting to be done. There is nothing fanatical about trying to keep science and religion separate but given the historical
attitude to anything that might bring a religious worldview into question I can see why scientists are keen to do so. Don't know what any of this has to do with atheists
openyourmind
Active Member
No not dust per say, but the elements brought with it. With out it we do no exist and without water we do no exist. I was merely starring a commonality in belief. The "earth" was needed for us to exist. I guess I should have worded it different. We all came from the earth!
tumbleweed41
Resident Liberal Hippie
That is a general understanding of the abiogenesis hypothesis.
However, like I told Outhouse,
Making claims of absolutes when uncertainty and speculation still exists is as damaging to the scientific method as Creationist dogma.
Abiogenesis is not supported, as of yet, by overwhelming objective and empirical evidence like biological evolution is.
It is, however, the most likely natural explanation as to the origin of life.
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Primordial Annihilator
Well-Known Member
tumbleweed41
Resident Liberal Hippie
Shameless plug of very old thread...http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/evolution-vs-creationism/83192-devil-details.html:run:The devil is in the detail...
openyourmind
Active Member
But, it's right! When you're read a story that sounds like a person is evil, by the details given, then told he is the hero. Your heart won't let the mind accept it. The bible portrays god as a crazy "god" that only cares about his plan and doesn't care who gets hurt. He will make his presence known by causing pain and suffering. Then you say he is the hero?Wait, What about just having faith? Forgiveness? Compassion? Love? He is the giver of all knowledge right? Did all your answers about life and him come from that book?
BruceDLimber
Well-Known Member
"Science vs. religion" is a false dichotomy!
The Baha'i Faith stresses that BOTH science and religion are valid, important, and that properly viewed, they dovetail very nicely!
I quote the Baha'i scriptures:
"[E]ven in Europe it is admitted that religion is the opponent of science, and that science is the destroyer of the foundations of religion. While the religion of God is the promoter of truth, the founder of science and knowledge, it is full of goodwill for learned men; it is the civilizer of mankind, the discoverer of the secrets of nature, and the enlightener of the horizons of the world. Consequently, how can it be said to oppose knowledge? God forbid! Nay, for God, knowledge is the most glorious gift of man and the most noble of human perfections. To oppose knowledge is ignorant, and he who detests knowledge and science is not a man, but rather an animal without intelligence. For knowledge is light, life, felicity, perfection, beauty and the means of approaching the Threshold of Unity. It is the honor and glory of the world of humanity, and the greatest bounty of God. Knowledge is identical with guidance, and ignorance is real error.
"Happy are those who spend their days in gaining knowledge, in discovering the secrets of nature, and in penetrating the subtleties of pure truth! Woe to those who are contented with ignorance, whose hearts are gladdened by thoughtless imitation, who have fallen into the lowest depths of ignorance and foolishness, and who have wasted their lives!"
­Some Answered Questions, p. 137
Best!
Bruce
The Baha'i Faith stresses that BOTH science and religion are valid, important, and that properly viewed, they dovetail very nicely!
I quote the Baha'i scriptures:
"[E]ven in Europe it is admitted that religion is the opponent of science, and that science is the destroyer of the foundations of religion. While the religion of God is the promoter of truth, the founder of science and knowledge, it is full of goodwill for learned men; it is the civilizer of mankind, the discoverer of the secrets of nature, and the enlightener of the horizons of the world. Consequently, how can it be said to oppose knowledge? God forbid! Nay, for God, knowledge is the most glorious gift of man and the most noble of human perfections. To oppose knowledge is ignorant, and he who detests knowledge and science is not a man, but rather an animal without intelligence. For knowledge is light, life, felicity, perfection, beauty and the means of approaching the Threshold of Unity. It is the honor and glory of the world of humanity, and the greatest bounty of God. Knowledge is identical with guidance, and ignorance is real error.
"Happy are those who spend their days in gaining knowledge, in discovering the secrets of nature, and in penetrating the subtleties of pure truth! Woe to those who are contented with ignorance, whose hearts are gladdened by thoughtless imitation, who have fallen into the lowest depths of ignorance and foolishness, and who have wasted their lives!"
­Some Answered Questions, p. 137
Best!
Bruce
openyourmind
Active Member
And, the early Christian church kill people for "magic" called them crazy. If you knew astronomy, chemistry or could see that what they said wasn't true you were murdered. So my question is why did original church, that was law at the time, kill people with knowledge? What were they covering up?