Why the bible may NOT the Inspired Word of God

[sojourner]

Of course you're selling something. You selling salvation for a problem you created.

Funny...I wasn't aware that salvation came with a price tag. Silly me! All this time I was going on the assumption that grace is a gift, that has no price! DAMMIT! I wish these people in Distribution would keep me informed of changes in Standard Operating Procedures!

A problem we created? What about a problem all of humanity created?

"Get right with my god and save your immortal soul.

Hmmn. I don't recall ever having said this during my ministerial tenure. And If I had, I would have said, "Your God," and not "my God."

The collection plate will be passed shortly. Do remember our soul saving work is supported only by your free will gifts and offerings.

Our work doesn't save souls. Only God's work saves souls. Our work spreads the news that God's kingdom has come near.

Stewardship has very little to do with salvation. But it has a lot to do with giving thanks.

Non-profit??? That is even funnier.

That must be why the government recognizes us as a 5013c non-profit corporation...

The 700 Club admits to an income of over a million a year.

Wonder what their outlay is?
I guess the fact that the 700 Club isn't a church has no bearing on your diatribe.

You run a CON. Pure and simple.

That's mean, nasty, and uncalled for, sir.

You convince the gullible and ignorant they have a soul.

I haven't convinced anyone of any such thing.

That they need to save it.

Actually, I try to convince them that they are already "saved," (although that's not the terminology I use. I believe God has reconciled us to God's Self).

That you know how and for a small fee you'll save them.

I know no such thing. Plus, I have no power to save anyone. And if I did, I wouldn't charge for it.

And the ignorant fools anti up.

Actually, every single ignorant fool who's ever darkened our door is asked to ante up...But I guess that's too complicated for a literary aficionado such as yourself to understand.
But I specifically don't keep track of who gives and who does not. It taints the spiritual relationship.

And you laugh all the way to the bank.

Actually, I don't go to the bank. The Administrative Assistant goes to the bank. But she rarely laughs. She's fairly droll.

You really need to get a grip here, before you wind up choking on all those feet you've crammed into your mouth. That's quite a feat! You've managed to point the finger at no one, while at the same time making yourself look like a complete idiot, and thoroughly trashing any respect or weight your opinions might have carried here.

I've seen some self-destruction on a pretty grand scale, but this one tops them!

I usually don't laugh at others' expense, but this was humor of slapstick proportion. Thanks for the gut-buster!
Maybe you could get a gig with Jeff Dunham as "Omar, the Self-Deprecating Pundit."

 

[OmarKhayyam]

Careful there. You are going to injury your shoulder patting yourself on the back.

I stand by everything I said. That you PERSONALLY may (or may not???) have your hand out is immaterial. :shout

Religion is a con and makes millions from the fear it creates in the ignorant and gullible. And no, the fact that the 700 Club is not church does NOT matter. It sells the same crap from the same source. The exact legal status is again - immaterial.


(And this time I was more careful editing. No Chianti on hand anymore:sad4:. And to replace it I would, thanks to your fellow believers have to drive 80 miles. Maybe next week.)

 

[Azakel]

Childish ignorance about religion. Not Surprising.

 

[sojourner]

I stand by everything I said. That you PERSONALLY may (or may not???) have your hand out is immaterial.

But you're responding to me. Therefore, what I personally do is not immaterial.

Religion is a con and makes millions from the fear it creates in the ignorant and gullible.

I think you've got the wrong manufacturing house. Madison Avenue creates fear in the ignorant and gullible by selling them cheap cologne that they say will make men irresistible. The Church builds courage and self-assurance.

And no, the fact that the 700 Club is not church does NOT matter.

It does matter, because It's probably not a non-profit. Therefore, it's a business and it does sell stuff in order to stay in business.
well...it does sell crap...

It sells the same crap from the same source.

 

[OmarKhayyam]

"
Quote:
I stand by everything I said. That you PERSONALLY may (or may not???) have your hand out is immaterial.
But you're responding to me. Therefore, what I personally do is not immaterial."

My! I thought you said WE were egocentric.

I am responding to an argument. You happen to be the proponent. Your PERSONAL situation is of no moment.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

I don't recall ever having thumped a Bible. I've done a lot of things to a Bible -- but I've never thumped one.
Is that how you determine whether the Bible is ripe?

Don't flatter yourself......

I NEVER mentioned names....especially not yours.....:sarcastic

You read my post and I did say respect for your (the collective you) faith should be something we all adhere to.......but the book you and others believe in needs some serious corrections....that, my friend is fact.....

Now..I could sit here and nit-pick problems in that book all day long but I felt as though my statement...of (it needing MAJOR) corrections should have been enough.

I judge the bible on how accurate the information it gives....more often then not....we find it to be inaccurate in various areas....

 

[sojourner]

Don't flatter yourself......

I NEVER mentioned names....especially not yours.....:sarcastic

You read my post and I did say respect for your (the collective you) faith should be something we all adhere to.......but the book you and others believe in needs some serious corrections....that, my friend is fact.....

Now..I could sit here and nit-pick problems in that book all day long but I felt as though my statement...of (it needing MAJOR) corrections should have been enough.

I judge the bible on how accurate the information it gives....more often then not....we find it to be inaccurate in various areas....

First of all, it's our book, so you don't really get to have a say in
1) whether or not it's correct
2) how it is used
3) what kind of book it "ought" to be.
Second, have you ever thought that you might not be reading for the information it was designed to provide? maybe the problem isn't with the book, but with the reader.

I find it odd that you think we should go to a non-believer for the "corrections" we need to make to our book.

Personally, I think the Bible is fine as-is. In fact, if it has a fault, it's that we treat the texts in too fixed a manner. They were originally fluid. They still ought to be.

Don't flatter yourself.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

First of all, it's our book,

No it's not......It doesn't belong to any particular religious group. If that were the case then you'd hear the same remarks coming from the Jewish or Muslim community. It's not like christianity has a copyright on it.

so you don't really get to have a say in
1) whether or not it's correct

Yes I do. There are certainly some truths in the book but I have the right to point out where it is incorrect.

2) how it is used

Sure I do. If is conflicts with my way of life then what use is it to me? If believers want to use it to control others then I have every right to protest it.

3) what kind of book it "ought" to be.

Who says I was trying to make the book into something....????.....If it is inaccurate then it needs to be corrected. This is obviously true or there wouldn't be so many versions...with people of various denominations adding or removing information.

Second, have you ever thought that you might not be reading for the information it was designed to provide? maybe the problem isn't with the book, but with the reader.

So it's designed for people who shouldn't question it and should just believe everything in it is accurate...? If that is how you see it then to each his own.

I find it odd that you think we should go to a non-believer for the "corrections" we need to make to our book.

You know...this is exactly what I'm talking about.....You need to do a little better at quoting people because nowhere did I ever say you should go to a non-believer for corrections........but if it helps then maybe you should go to some one who is unbiased in their assessment of the book.

Personally, I think the Bible is fine as-is. In fact,

Ok...but that's your "opinion"......but the "FACT".....is there are undeniable inaccuracies in the bible. A heck of a lot of science....(some very basic)....are flat out wrong.....

if it has a fault, it's that we treat the texts in too fixed a manner. They were originally fluid. They still ought to be.

Wrong is wrong......Just because the unlearned writers (men) wrote it does not mean we have to except and believe it.

Don't flatter yourself.

:faint:

 

[sojourner]

No it's not......It doesn't belong to any particular religious group. If that were the case then you'd hear the same remarks coming from the Jewish or Muslim community. It's not like christianity has a copyright on it.

Since the texts are part of the Tradition of the religions that created them, I'd say that establishes ownership -- at least for purposes of determining the worth of the texts. We created them for our use and our purposes. If they suit those uses and purposes, what's it to an outsider?

Yes I do. There are certainly some truths in the book but I have the right to point out where it is incorrect.

But you don't have the right to expect that any of us will take you seriously, unless you 1) know what you're talking about with regard to the theology presented, 2) are fully versed in cultural anthropology, Biblical archaeology, apologetics and exegesis, and 3) are fully familiar with the history and Tradition of the religion to which you're appealing, as well as fully familiar with the impetus behind its treatment and regard of and for the text in question. I doubt you are.

Sure I do. If is conflicts with my way of life then what use is it to me? If believers want to use it to control others then I have every right to protest it.

First, it's not designed to be "of any use" to you. Second, If someone tries to use it to control others, I'll stand right next to you and fight.

Who says I was trying to make the book into something....????.....If it is inaccurate then it needs to be corrected. This is obviously true or there wouldn't be so many versions...with people of various denominations adding or removing information.

This only proves your inadequacy to meet the criteria for #1. In what way is it "inaccurate?" Scientifically? It's not a science text. Historically? It's not a history text. Sociologically? It's not an etiquette guide. Theologically? You'll have to prove it.

It's not so "obviously true." The texts were never meant to be as fixed as you seem to want them to be. Information was added and removed all the time, until the canon was set. Even then, certain groups added or subtracted, such as during the Protestant Reformation. I don't see the problem, as long as the texts work for the group...

So it's designed for people who shouldn't question it and should just believe everything in it is accurate...? If that is how you see it then to each his own.

I think we question it all the time -- at least those who are responsible readers question it.
Those responsible readers don't believe everything in it is accurate.

You know...this is exactly what I'm talking about.....You need to do a little better at quoting people because nowhere did I ever say you should go to a non-believer for corrections........but if it helps then maybe you should go to some one who is unbiased in their assessment of the book.

I can't recall the specifics of the post I responded to here. Could you refresh me?
I go to unbiased people all the time -- at least as unbiased as there are. Many reputable Biblical scholars are not "believers."

Ok...but that's your "opinion"......but the "FACT".....is there are undeniable inaccuracies in the bible. A heck of a lot of science....(some very basic)....are flat out wrong.....

If this were a science text, I'd agree with you. Since it's not -- since it makes great use of allegory and metaphor and poetry to construct theological arguments and to remind us of our theological story, I'd say that the scientific inaccuracies (while they are there) don't matter a whole lot to the theological truth that's presented.

Wrong is wrong......Just because the unlearned writers (men) wrote it does not mean we have to except and believe it.

You don't even have to accept it, if you don't want to. But to say that "wrong is wrong" is a little too rigid and modernistic. We have to remember that we're dealing with ancient texts written from ancient perspectives. The texts don't stack up to modern impeti, but then, we don't expect them to.