"Without God, Life Has No Purpose . . . . . . ."

[Quintessence]

At any rate, I'd basically translate the quote something like this:

God is very important to me and helps establish my purpose in life. Without God, my life would feel purposeless. Without purpose, my life would feel meaningless, insignificant, and hopeless.
​

I don't take issue with the general sentiment. There's no point to being a theist if your theism isn't going to establish or inform life's meaningfulness to you. So much so that I don't think I'd call someone whose theism is completely disconnected from meaningfulness a theist at all.

That said, I think there's some element of hyperbole in the sentiment. I'm not sure I've met anyone for whom theism is the sole source of life's meaningfulness. For the devout it is an important fixture to be certain, the absence of which would leave quite the void. In that context, a little hyperbole is perhaps warranted. It is akin to the deep romantic who sings that their lives would be empty without their significant other. It tells us that person has a strong bond and relationship to something.

 

[Skwim]

If "God is love" then I would agree with his statement.​

Yeah, I don't think many people will be agreeing with that either.

.

 

[Rival]

Solomon, in Ecclesiates, said the purpose of life is to enjoy an good meal and the wife of your youth. Eat and reproduce is our only purpose.

You completely missed the point of Ecclesiastes. At the end he says the point is to fear G-d and keep His commandments. Ecclesiastes 12:13-14

The end of the matter; all has been heard. Fear God, and keep his commandments; for that is the whole duty of everyone. For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every secret thing, whether good or evil.

 

[InChrist]

I think that if God created people for the purpose of being in an eternal, loving relationship with Himself then there would be no permanent purpose to life if someone missed out on it, rejected the purpose for which they were created, or continually attempted to find purpose in other things.

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

I happened upon the quote below while searching for information on replacing a toilet---don't ask. In any case, it appears to be just the
kind of religious chatter that would appeal to RF Christians. So, look it over and tell us what you think.

Just as a note of information: Richard Duane "Rick" Warren (born January 28, 1954) is an American evangelical Christian pastor and author.
He is the founder and senior pastor of Saddleback Church, an evangelical megachurch in Lake Forest, California, the eighth-largest church in the United States

​

Is it pretty much right on or is it just so much Sunday morning blather?

I suggest asking yourself:

Why would life necessarily have no purpose without god ? (Not quite sure what is meant by "without god.")

Why would life necessarily have no meaning if it has no purpose?

Why would would life necessarily lack significance or hope if it had no meaning?

.​

Triple threat nonsequitur. Nice.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

You completely missed the point of Ecclesiastes. At the end he says the point is to fear G-d and keep His commandments. Ecclesiastes 12:13-14

The end of the matter; all has been heard. Fear God, and keep his commandments; for that is the whole duty of everyone. For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every secret thing, whether good or evil.

And I thought it was all vanity and vexation off the spirit.

 

[QuestioningMind]

You completely missed the point of Ecclesiastes. At the end he says the point is to fear G-d and keep His commandments. Ecclesiastes 12:13-14

The end of the matter; all has been heard. Fear God, and keep his commandments; for that is the whole duty of everyone. For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every secret thing, whether good or evil.

Fear is the polar opposite of love. Any god that needs to be feared is not a god worthy of my worship.

 

[Frater Sisyphus]

It does? Could you clarify what you mean by "theistic God?" Why do you put the qualifier "theistic" in front of "God?" Isn't that kind of redundant?

A deity?

I mean in the traditional sense of a deity laying out laws and morals for it's creation, that's all. I don't see how a deity could automatically give life a meaning, I would still see meaning as being a personal thing inherently subjective; even if I believed in a deity.

 

[osgart]

Suppose their is righteous universal infinite justice and truth, and God's spirit is the essence of it, and to be in line with that spirit is ultimate freedom, joy, and peace. Suppose that God is all knowing, and supremely compassionate. Then anything contrary to God ought to fear him. But fear isn't the ultimate goal of god, it's a first step toward repentance, than trust, than love, and relationship with the eternal master of life and true justice.

Than suppose God is out to save all of mankind from themselves, but people reject God whole heartedly. Then they can't enter into his justice, and should be afraid if god so exists. Why? Because evil wants to destroy justice, and set up it's own rebellious power that has no justice.

So then everlasting life has qualities of character, every good virtue. God's goal is for everyone to have the same character as god, although God will always remain unmatched in power and wisdom, and knowledge. Then suppose God created you, and the only thing God wants for you is right relation, and God's deserved honor, and glory. Now suppose God deserves to be god, and no other does.

That's a lot of supposing, but this is the logic of the believer in God.

The world to the believer exists outside the justice of god, and every human a sinner waxing worse and worse.

Somehow God is preserving each individual and must judge each individual according to God's justice. And so everyone has an appointed time to live and choose what side they are on, and the eternal choice lies within each person.

God's purpose for humans is that they become trustworthy, of sound mind and judgment, full of compassion, benevolence, and charity, and to be people of deserve.

So to give life as deserved is the purpose of life. God being the ultimate giver. And life is not merely existing, life is defined as innocent compassion towards each other as is rightfully deserved. To have mercy where mercy is required, to have love where love is deserved.

This is what sincere believers in God practice. I personally see no evidence that this exists, or that this viewpoint matches reality. I grew up in a Christian environment, and I tried to see the good of it, even though it doesn't match with what I find in reality.

 

[Brickjectivity]

At any rate, I'd basically translate the quote something like this:

God is very important to me and helps establish my purpose in life. Without God, my life would feel purposeless. Without purpose, my life would feel meaningless, insignificant, and hopeless.
​

I don't take issue with the general sentiment. There's no point to being a theist if your theism isn't going to establish or inform life's meaningfulness to you. So much so that I don't think I'd call someone whose theism is completely disconnected from meaningfulness a theist at all.

That said, I think there's some element of hyperbole in the sentiment. I'm not sure I've met anyone for whom theism is the sole source of life's meaningfulness. For the devout it is an important fixture to be certain, the absence of which would leave quite the void. In that context, a little hyperbole is perhaps warranted. It is akin to the deep romantic who sings that their lives would be empty without their significant other. It tells us that person has a strong bond and relationship to something.

I have attended a sermon by Rick Warren and by Miles Munroe. Miles Munroe a popular traveling minister based in the Bahamas writes a popular serious of books on purpose which sell well, and Rick Warren who is in contact with the same churches then writes similar books publishing about 10 years later. They are not copied word for word but are re-writes. The reason that 'Purpose' is so popular, is that many churches are teaching young people that they need to wait for God to direct them in their careers and relationships. It often does not work out. This confuses many people, and so they become hungry for manuscripts about purpose. They want to know how they find out God's purpose for themselves, specifically.

I think its horrible and not really a theology topic at all.

 

[InChrist]

Fear is the polar opposite of love. Any god that needs to be feared is not a god worthy of my worship.

I don't think fear is always the opposite of love. I love the ocean, but also fear or respect the inherent dangers it poses. I love having a fire, in the fireplace, but understand that there are dangers associated with fire. I love horses, but realize they are powerful animals and one must be careful around them.

 

[InChrist]

I have attended a sermon by Rick Warren and by Miles Munroe. Miles Munroe a popular traveling minister based in the Bahamas writes a popular serious of books on purpose which sell well, and Rick Warren who is in contact with the same churches then writes similar books publishing about 10 years later. They are not copied word for word but are re-writes. The reason that 'Purpose' is so popular, is that many churches are teaching young people that they need to wait for God to direct them in their careers and relationships. It often does not work out. This confuses many people, and so they become hungry for manuscripts about purpose. They want to know how they find out God's purpose for themselves, specifically.

I think its horrible and not really a theology topic at all.

I don't personally like the views of Rick Warren.

 

[InChrist]

This is what sincere believers in God practice. I personally see no evidence that this exists, or that this viewpoint matches reality. I grew up in a Christian environment, and I tried to see the good of it, even though it doesn't match with what I find in reality.

Your post was very thoughtful and I appreciated reading it. I an interested in understanding why or in what ways you don't think it matches up with reality, if you care to elaborate.

 

[osgart]

Your post was very thoughtful and I appreciated reading it. I an interested in understanding why or in what ways you don't think it matches up with reality, if you care to elaborate.

Well for one, the historicity of the bible.

The coherency of the bible.

The literal believability of the stories in the bible.

And the natural world I feel tells a different story.

The complexity of trying to verify the bible as truly the word of God.

Not sensing the presence of god.

 

[InChrist]

Well for one, the historicity of the bible.

The coherency of the bible.

The literal believability of the stories in the bible.

And the natural world I feel tells a different story.

The complexity of trying to verify the bible as truly the word of God.

Not sensing the presence of god.

Okay, thanks.

 

[osgart]

Okay, thanks.

Why did you accept the bible? If I may ask

 

[dianaiad]

What would the purpose of existence be, to those who don't believe in a deity?

Not being snarky; just asking. If all life is an accident and determined by the exigencies of survival/procreation (and lets face it, evolution is driven by these two things), then what's the point?

Specifically, what would be the point of sacrificing one's own choices, preferences, time...or life...to help anybody, especially someone who doesn't directly influence one's own life and ability to procreate?

Serious question.

Life is hard. Sometimes it's really hard, and staying alive is sometimes difficult, painful, stressful...and ultimately it will be unsuccessful. Ask any cancer survivor. Better still, ask cancer patients who know they won't survive but who fight anyway. What's the point?

Before you figure that I'm sunk in the pits of despair and angst, be easy; I'm not. Well, I AM a theist and that does help.

I figure that people NEED meaning and purpose. Those who don't have it are simply not happy.
If God exists, well, He provides that meaning and purpose.
If He does not, we have two choices; we either make one up so that we can provide our own by pretending there's a God to provide such meaning and purpose, or....
We BECOME God and give ourselves our own purpose. Just because we aren't given one doesn't mean we can't decide to find one ourselves. Humanism, in fact, is all about doing exactly that: exploring the capabilities, goals and characters of human beings to make them 'the best' they can be, however one defines 'best,' and doing that instead of worshiping a deity and obeying instructions handed down by one.

Me? I don't have to go through all that figuring; I believe in a God already. However, if I didn't, I'd go full on humanist.

 

[Skwim]

What would the purpose of existence be, to those who don't believe in a deity?

There is no purpose.

Not being snarky; just asking. If all life is an accident and determined by the exigencies of survival/procreation (and lets face it, evolution is driven by these two things), then what's the point?
Specifically, what would be the point of sacrificing one's own choices, preferences, time...or life...to help anybody, especially someone who doesn't directly influence one's own life and ability to procreate?

The point would be self satisfaction. Perhaps it would be gratifying to help someone less fortunate than oneself. Or

Life is hard. Sometimes it's really hard, and staying alive is sometimes difficult, painful, stressful...and ultimately it will be unsuccessful. Ask any cancer survivor. Better still, ask cancer patients who know they won't survive but who fight anyway. What's the point?

That has to be determined by the individual. Gotta ask her .

Before you figure that I'm sunk in the pits of despair and angst, be easy; I'm not. Well, I AM a theist and that does help.

I have no doubt that it helps. It's one of the reasons people cling to their religious faith: Security and comfort.

I figure that people NEED meaning and purpose. Those who don't have it are simply not happy.

Then you'd be wrong. Might want to stop projecting your needs onto others and ask such people if they're happy.

If God exists, well, He provides that meaning and purpose.
If He does not, we have two choices; we either make one up so that we can provide our own by pretending there's a God to provide such meaning and purpose, or....

Yup.

We BECOME God and give ourselves our own purpose.

Whoa there. Let's not go over the edge. Might want to take a closer look at your definition of god.

.

 

[dianaiad]

Whoa there. Let's not go over the edge. Might want to take a closer look at your definition of god.

.

I know what my definition of 'god' is. What do you think it is, that you can decide that I'm not abiding by it?

 

[robocop (actually)]

Why would life necessarily have no purpose without god ? (Not quite sure what is meant by "without god.")

Why would life necessarily have no meaning if it has no purpose?

Why would would life necessarily lack significance or hope if it had no meaning?

No reason! Good job Skwim.