Would An Intelligent Deity Seem Stupid To Us?

[Sunstone]

I see a different (non-petty) motive.

Regardless of how wise we become, we're all still fallible. If a wise person makes a mistake (large or small) that anyone can recognize as foolish, they have just been reminded of their own limits.

A little anti-hubris can go a long way.

While yours is both a legitimate view and also something the genuinely wise should keep in mind, I'll stick to mine this time, on the grounds that the passage is ascribing a petty motive to deity, rather than merely saying even the wise are fallible and should not become arrogant.

 

[Rejected]

Refer to Noah. Everybody thought he was crazy for following God's directions. Look what happened!

What about Abraham? Who among us would sacrifice his only son, just because God told him to? Shall I go on?

To aspire to know God's ways is the height of hubris. Ref. "The Tower of Babel." Why are we so obsessed with knowledge and proof, when faith is what's called for?

OK, first off you're avoiding the question and hiding behind mythological allegory. Stop it. Besides your comment had nothing to do with the question given. And the reason "we" are obsessed with proof is human nature. We are trying to figure out what is going on with this thing we call existence. The reason we require proof is because some of us refuse to shut our eyes and believe irrational concepts based on promises of suffering and torment if we don't.

In response to the original question, I'm going to throw in with Halycon. I don't believe that our limited brains would be able to recognize said divine intelligence, let alone uderstand its designs for us. Personally, I believe that *if* an infinitely superior intelligence exists that it wouldn't even concern itself with the petty squabbling of some over-evolved apes that can't seem to get along with each other long enough to make it off their rock and into the rest of the universe.

 

[mr.guy]

And the reason "we" are obsessed with proof is human nature.

"Human nature". What a fantastic bottom line.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

"Human nature". What a fantastic bottom line.

Some of us have better bottoms than others.

Don't hate the playa, baby. Hate the game.

 

[Rejected]

Well, what would you call it? Throughout human history we have searched for answers and explanations to natural phenomenon. To early humans the answers to questions that proved difficult or impossible to answer due to primitive technology and observation techniques were attributed to the supernatural - Zues throwing lightening bolts, demonic possesion to explain mental illness, etc.
We still don't have all the answers, but science is constantly making headway. Unfortunately some people are either too lazy to look obectively look for the truth, can't understand the explanations that scientific processes have shown, too proud to say "I don't know," or are afraid that their beliefs, which they hold around them like a security blanket, will be proven false and stripped away that they automatically dismiss possible explanations and take the easy route out and use the "god made it that way" explanation. That way they don't have to understand, just to believe.

 

[d.]

I wrote:


Divine answered:


Arguing from the Christian pov, we don't profess to know God. No one can know God. We profess to believe in God. Our foundation is faith, not knowledge. Can't comment on other religions...

to avoid derailing this thread, i'll start up a new thread for the discussion i see coming here.

 

[mr.guy]

Don't hate the playa, baby. Hate the game.

If i always hate the banker in "monopoly", which am i doing?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

If i always hate the banker in "monopoly", which am i doing?

Being a smarta$$. :slap:

:biglaugh: :biglaugh:

 

[sojourner]

OK, first off you're avoiding the question and hiding behind mythological allegory. Stop it. Besides your comment had nothing to do with the question given. And the reason "we" are obsessed with proof is human nature. We are trying to figure out what is going on with this thing we call existence. The reason we require proof is because some of us refuse to shut our eyes and believe irrational concepts based on promises of suffering and torment if we don't.

In response to the original question, I'm going to throw in with Halycon. I don't believe that our limited brains would be able to recognize said divine intelligence, let alone uderstand its designs for us. Personally, I believe that *if* an infinitely superior intelligence exists that it wouldn't even concern itself with the petty squabbling of some over-evolved apes that can't seem to get along with each other long enough to make it off their rock and into the rest of the universe.

Theologians are also trying to figure out this thing we call "existence." The reason they don't require proof, is because they know that scientific proof of human understanding cannot begin to touch God. Some of us refuse to open our eyes to any possibilities that lie beyond our ken and believe, irrationally, that, in order for God to exist, humans must be able to prove that existence. God's existence does not depend upon human capacity of proof...but our existence does depend upon God.

The whole point of my post is that it doesn't make any difference to God whether we think God is stupid or not. We can think anything we want, but it doesn't change God one iota. If we're going to talk about God, we use theology -- "God-talk." If we talk about rocks we use geology. If we talk about animals, we use zoology. How in the world can a theological pov be off-base, when we're talking about God? I'm not hiding behind anything!

Everybody thought Noah was stupid for building the ark. But Noah believed in God and trusted taht God knew best. Ditto Abraham. These faithful people did what seemed to make no sense, trusting that God knew best, even if they thought the request was nuts.

The point is that human understanding is not the absolute we need. God is the absolute.

 

[Comet]

Keeping that study in mind, let's assume there exists a deity who is infinitely intelligent. Would that deity appear to us infinitely stupid?

I think the problem would come from "the stupid" not being able to understand and thus reverting to "dumbing down" of said deity in their own minds...... not the deity's mind. So I guess it is yes and no....

If so, would we be under any obligation to worship that deity?

I think about half would feel obligated to worship it, out of lack of understanding and thus making the deity a God when perhaps it isn't. How would you look to a "caveman" if you went back in time with a lighter? Some probably would turn you into a fire-god for lack of understanding. But to answer, NO we would not be obligated to worship that deity just because it was more intelligent than humans.

Again, would it make any sense to follow any rules or directions that deity set out for us?

What would give it the right to set out rules and directions for us..... we are talking about something that is more intelligent, but not to say that it is our "parental guidance", creator, etc...... I guess some would follow out of the knowledge that it is more intelligent than us and probably therefore knows better than us.

Is there any way we could know that deity was infinitely smart, rather than infinitely stupid?[/

NO- because OUR "smarts" are limited......

 

[sophie]

Would an intelligent deity seem stupid to us?

Some years ago, I came across a study in which the researchers found that when someone is more than about 20 IQ points smarter than us, we tend to rank them as less intelligent than us. The researchers hypothesized that anyone who is much more than 20 IQ points smarter than us comes across as less smart than us because we simply don't understand them.

Keeping that study in mind, let's assume there exists a deity who is infinitely intelligent. Would that deity appear to us infinitely stupid?

If so, would we be under any obligation to worship that deity?

Again, would it make any sense to follow any rules or directions that deity set out for us?

Is there any way we could know that deity was infinitely smart, rather than infinitely stupid?

Depends on what your definition of deity is. I think the concept of God is unknowable and I observe no evidence of human behavioral traits. So the concept of intelligence is moot to me. Humans are an intelligent species - besides language is our own social construct.

Now if you apply that concept to people, I totally agree, some people's ego's just can't handle feeling stupid or not understanding someone else and are therefore intolerant.

 

[Melody]

George Bush is a classic example of this. He is not a smart man, and he never was. He got poor grades in school and if his name was not Bush he never would have gotten into an Ivy League school. He's failed at every business enterprise he's been handed by his wealthy father's cronies, and he would never have been elected president if he weren't named George Bush. Yet when he speaks, he assumes an attitude of perpetual condescension, and keeps repeating phrases like "don't ya see?", as if he, in his quantified stupidity, is able to see and understand what the rest of us cannot. And so he must explain it to us as if we were dim-witted children. He really has convinced himself that he is somehow wiser than everyone else around him because he's not intellectual. And his whole sense of self-worth depends upon maintaining this illusion. This is why he never asks himself if he's made any mistakes, as most intelligent people do. He has long since chosen to refuse to confront the concept of his being stupid and of his making mistakes. That concept just doesn't exist for him. His ego won't allow it.

:clap