Autodidact
Intentionally Blank
You mean that it talks about Jesus? Any reason to think that part in particular is reliable?
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YEC and Christianity
- Thread starter Autodidact
- Start date
You mean that it talks about Jesus? Any reason to think that part in particular is reliable?
DallasApple
Depends Upon My Mood..
Yes...Because despite all the other crap??? He is someone to strive to be like...
Its reliable because who wouldnt want to be Christ like?
A bunch of pigs jumped on the wagon...Never mind...
Love
Dallas
I think a better way to put it is that much of what Jesus said turned out to be pretty universal.
ThereIsNoSpoon
Active Member
A question ...
How do You know what he said or what he didn't say ?
Where is that information included ?
ThereIsNoSpoon
Active Member
Would you explain to me what reliability has got to do with ones personal wishes or ideals ?
And at "Pick and choose" we arrived again.
Let me ask you another question ...
Can you name me one "loving advice"(btw. what do you mean by that) or lesson that you found in the bible that no nonreligious man could have said and that is worth following for you and correct ?
I happen to have many copies of the Bible. I don't need to be Christian to read it.
Sure, how do we know if any of that is actually what he said? Well, he himself never wrote anything down, so the gospels are about as good as we can get.
...Have you ever actually read the Bible yourself? At lest half of the teachings of Jesus have nothing to do with God or mythology.
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."
Father Heathen
Veteran Member
So only those who are strict biblical literalists believe in god? So those who interpret the bible a little differently, or even believe in a different religion entirely, only pretend to believe in god? I would image god would find it insulting when people insist that god is bound by a book written by mere man, that it has power over him.
Dunemeister
Well-Known Member
That's not the implication of a woodenly literalistic approach to the bible. That approach entails other absurdities, but not that one.
Autodidact
Intentionally Blank
What I mean is, Jesus didn't write it. Someone, we don't know who, wrote those parts down a few decades after Jesus died, by people who never saw him. So why is third hand hearsay, finally written down by an anonymous person, reliable?
rocketman
Out there...
Wrong. Go back and read it again.
ThereIsNoSpoon
Active Member
Of course you dont need to be christian to read a book.
Now my point is simple. You see I state that a true christian must believe in christ and his teachings. I hope you agree so far. You spoke about people not believing in the old testament or not being YECs or believing in the god of the old testament not being the same as the god of jesus and so forth. And you said that Jesus never said anything about creation (See your post 16).
My question where you get the information about Jesus from was deliberate. You see you CANT be christian and reasonably claim to "know" or believe in a concrete Jesus while at the same time saying that bible is "about as good as we can get" or that "canonization" was pick and choose. For a simple reason. The bible is the only possible source for religious topics concerning Jesus and God. If you make the bible an uncertain work then the whole religion is nothing but guesswork with no credibility.
I do not have much trouble with it as i believe that anyway but i would say that christians ought to have trouble with it.
The idea to seperate the new testament from the old one does't improove the situation (i guess that would be the first argument you would now mention).
ThereIsNoSpoon
Active Member
Yes
I dont get your point. How is that related to my post ?
Is your last statement the answer to my question. In that case you would claim that you must be a religious man or even God himself (as Jesus incarnate) to say "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" ? Are you really sure you want to claim this ?
DallasApple
Depends Upon My Mood..
I didnt get the last part of your question..But I dont doubt a "non-religious" man could have given the same advice that is worth following..
I just don't know many that are willing to die for me in order so I could hear it..
Love
Dallas
DallasApple
Depends Upon My Mood..
DallasApple
Depends Upon My Mood..
And yes..I pick and choose..I am not blind ...and I have my own brain...
Love
Dallas
I do not claim godhood, nor do I wish for such a thing. My religion is that of an omnist, that I find wisdom in all things. I believe Jesus to be a Sage, but not divine in any way. Much of what he said is directly paralleled in the sayings of Buddha.
I try to "do unto others...", though yes, as I am only human, I sometimes do not succeed in this.
My point is that a mythology doesn't have to be believed as literal to follow the teachings of Jesus. You can be a Christian and not believe the mythology of the Old Testament to be literal truth. I know many.
Credibility doesn't come from minute details. It comes from the wisdom contained within. And there are a ton of other books about the Abrahamic God, such as the books that were not canonized. The Bible isn't exclusive to the books that were ultimately canonized, especially since the canon is not consistent.
camanintx
Well-Known Member
If it was so important that people hear his message, why didn't Jesus bother to have it written down during his lifetime instead of more than a century later?
ThereIsNoSpoon
Active Member
Since I haven't heard any statement of the bible that a nonreligious man couldn't have made and since taking the bible literally obviously results in showing flaws and errors (which man at that time would have believed to be true)...
what evidence would you bring forth to make me believe that this is actually more than just a human made book ?
I would dispute that as well. Many people throuout history died for what they believed to be some better path for humanity (or for their own beliefs).
This however doesn't make it in any way "true" or "divine".
I do not dispute that you have a brain. It would amaze me if you hadn't
My argument is simply that pick and choose is not true religion. Of course you can call yourself a christian. But for me (and i guess for most YECs as well) you simply are not one following the "true" path of christianity. You follow your own path with no reasonable credibility that it matches the supposed "truth".
Pick and choose in the end almost equals "arbitrariness .
You believe (i presume) in "some form" of Jesus ... thats why you call yourself a christian. And you believe in "some form" of the bible with some (for you reasoned) interpretation of its verses. I claim that if you did not live today with the knowledge you have now you would not interpret it in the way you do not. So in a way your christianity is for me a different or lets say evolved religion which only has some basic things in common with its ancient version.
In short: a deviation of the original "truth".