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YHWH worship and Left Hand Paths

EtuMalku

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
Liu said:
It depends on what exactly is meant by that and with what reasoning and motive it's done.

Which aspects of YHWH are you concentrating on? There are many that seem to oppose pretty much every kind of LHP: In the OT he is authoritarian and favors group-mentality over individual mentality. He claims there is only one truth and demands a huge list of often arbitrary rules to be followed to the word for no other reason than because he said so. In the NT he is all about selflessness and helping everyone. Many of his typical worshipers tend to be hypocrites and not even notice it themselves.

All those aspects don't make it a typical deity to be chosen by a LHPer at all, and the only two reasons I see why LHPers would want to worship him is either because they want to break through this aversion and thereby overcome their own taboos, or simply because they have fallen in love with him for whatever strange reason and want to follow their feelings.

And what do you mean by worship? Expressing your feelings of adoration? Seems fine to me.
Experimenting how it is to do veneration rituals to such a deity? Interesting choice, but totally fine - just take care that you get out of that rabbit hole again before you completely lose yourself in it.
Giving up your individuality and acting against your own nature for hope that an external deity will give you their grace? Not so much - but I doubt that's what you mean. On the other hand, that would be what that deity demands, so he (taking a theistic view for a moment) wouldn't accept you as one of his followers and your worship were either in vain or at least only of value for yourself.

Actually I find all that an important question. I recently read Black/Hyatt's "Pacts with the Devil" which concentrates on the kind of rituals Christians would do (or even have done historically) to make demons do their bidding. I found I have some aversion against those ritual texts since most of them acknowledge a Christian worldview, calling upon "Adonai" for protection with attributes that explicitly refer to the Christian god and that imply the literal truth of the bible (and because they treat the demons like sh*t which seems like a bad idea in basically any thought paradigm).

Despite the chaos-magick-approach that I have towards rituals (if I believe in their effectiveness at all), which would make it irrelevant whether the mythology a ritual is based on is true or not, it feels not right to me to do a ritual based on the Christian worldview. And I think that is not uncommon and might be a personal taboo many people would benefit from approaching.
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Which LHP are you referring to?
For instance non-theistic Luciferianism has no deity that is worshiped
 
Liu

Liu

Well-Known Member
EtuMalku said:
Which LHP are you referring to?
For instance non-theistic Luciferianism has no deity that is worshiped
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I was referring to anything I'd deem LHP in general. And even atheistic kinds of LHP can allow for worship of deities - those deities just are not considered to exist as a literal entity outside of oneself or it wouldn't be atheistic anymore.
 
ThirtyThree

ThirtyThree

Well-Known Member
EtuMalku said:
I could ask you the same question, why does it bother you that this is a concern of mine?
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It bothers me because you have this habit of speaking as if you are an absolute authority on what is or is not LHP, or who is or is not able to use a certain religious label, like myself.

Now, if you desire to debate what is and is not LHP without resorting to the type of arrogance you have, I can support that. I see it in no different a light than how many Athiests continue to debate evolutionism verses creationism with Theists. It never really goes anywhere is all. Then, I doubt you care if I agree with what you do or say.

You just come off as a fundamentalist to me? Is that honestly how you desire to be perceived? Is that the best representation of character for the leader of your order to show to people?
 
EtuMalku

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
ThirtyThree said:
It bothers me because you have this habit of speaking as if you are an absolute authority on what is or is not LHP, or who is or is not able to use a certain religious label, like myself
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kinda pisses ya off don't it?

Now, if you desire to debate what is and is not LHP without resorting to the type of arrogance you have, I can support that. I see it in no different a light than how many Athiests continue to debate evolutionism verses creationism with Theists. It never really goes anywhere is all. Then, I doubt you care if I agree with what you do or say.
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Go ahead make the box . . . I'm just going to climb out of it

You just come off as a fundamentalist to me? Is that honestly how you desire to be perceived? Is that the best representation of character for the leader of your order to show to people?
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Are you asking me? What is anything but its fundamentals? Don't worry so much about how you think I come off to those I Work with . . . they understand.

Now . . . back to the discussion
 
ThirtyThree

ThirtyThree

Well-Known Member
EtuMalku said:
kinda pisses ya off don't it?

Go ahead make the box . . . I'm just going to climb out of it

Are you asking me? What is anything but its fundamentals? Don't worry so much about how you think I come off to those I Work with . . . they understand.

Now . . . back to the discussion
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It causes me frustration to observe behavior like yours, yes. However, in regard to fundamentalism, I refer to the attitude some radical Christians have where anyone who does not agree with their world view will "burn in Hell" if they do not repent. You are similar in that you proclaim absolute knowledge on certain matters, which you have been proven wrong about several times, yet you, like the fundamentalist keep going on.
 
Shadow Wolf

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
The entire concept of worshiping a deity is counter to the LHP. Jehova also requires many rules and policies to be followed - to worship Jehovah is to carry out his will and not your own. It is also from Christianity that many Western taboos are based; sexual regulations, dietary restrictions, homosexuality, gender repression, and having faith. The LHP path isn't about serving a god and growing according to a deity's plan, but serving yourself and growing yourself according to your visions.
 
ThirtyThree

ThirtyThree

Well-Known Member
Shadow Wolf said:
The entire concept of worshiping a deity is counter to the LHP. Jehova also requires many rules and policies to be followed - to worship Jehovah is to carry out his will and not your own. It is also from Christianity that many Western taboos are based; sexual regulations, dietary restrictions, homosexuality, gender repression, and having faith. The LHP path isn't about serving a god and growing according to a deity's plan, but serving yourself and growing yourself according to your visions.
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Is Eastern LHP included in this proclamation?
 
EtuMalku

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
ThirtyThree said:
It causes me frustration to observe behavior like yours, yes. However, in regard to fundamentalism, I refer to the attitude some radical Christians have where anyone who does not agree with their world view will "burn in Hell" if they do not repent. You are similar in that you proclaim absolute knowledge on certain matters, which you have been proven wrong about several times, yet you, like the fundamentalist keep going on.
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Show me where I "proclaim absolute knowledge" on anything. There's a big difference between lying to someone that they will burn in hell and stating what they know about a certain subject matter. This is a LHP DIR which hasn't the slightest agreement as to what the LHP is or isn't.
As for being proven wrong, much less several times, do show me where this has taken place.
 
EtuMalku

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
Satans_Serrated_Edge said:
Why not? That's like asking if one can combine liking potato chips and wearing Nikes. Just be aware that if you eat too many, you won't move as fast in those shoes.
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Well, I for one would like to hear how you can combine a RHP tradition with a LHP tradition?
 
EtuMalku

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
Shadow Wolf said:
The entire concept of worshiping a deity is counter to the LHP. Jehova also requires many rules and policies to be followed - to worship Jehovah is to carry out his will and not your own. It is also from Christianity that many Western taboos are based; sexual regulations, dietary restrictions, homosexuality, gender repression, and having faith. The LHP path isn't about serving a god and growing according to a deity's plan, but serving yourself and growing yourself according to your visions.
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Ever notice the other DIR's don't have this problem? LOL . . . :confused:
 
ThirtyThree

ThirtyThree

Well-Known Member
EtuMalku said:
Show me where I "proclaim absolute knowledge" on anything. There's a big difference between lying to someone that they will burn in hell and stating what they know about a certain subject matter. This is a LHP DIR which hasn't the slightest agreement as to what the LHP is or isn't.
As for being proven wrong, much less several times, do show me where this has taken place.
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Okay, Etu. I agree with you that this directory has yet to fully define what the Western LHP is and is not.

My issue with you, as you already know, is your overwhelmingly oppressive desire to relabel Luciferianism to only your world view. Then, you also said the LHP is only about self deification, hetrodoxy and antinomianism, which many disagree with it seems?
 
EtuMalku

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
ThirtyThree said:
Okay, Etu. I agree with you that this directory has yet to fully define what the Western LHP is and is not.

My issue with you, as you already know, is your overwhelmingly oppressive desire to relabel Luciferianism to only your world view. Then, you also said the LHP is only about self deification, hetrodoxy and antinomianism, which many disagree with it seems?
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It's not my fault these people are clueless about the LHP.
I'm not 're-labeling' Luciferianism, I'm trying to define it . . . so, that it doesn't turn into another Satanism which has come to mean anything you need it to be.

You're just bent because I confronted you about your Luciferian association . . . let's not play dumb.
 
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