Your religion and you -- are they congruent

[Trailblazer]

Thing is, nature will eventually remove you from the group.

It already has for the most part, since I do not participate in the group.
But I still believe what they do for the most part.

 

[Muffled]

I want this thread to be not so much a debate as a general discussion. And I don't want to restrict it to religious people only. For example, I am a Humanist, and it is important to me that I live according to the precepts that Humanism espouses. I have to ask myself all the time whether or not I do.

I found this quite lovely little quote by U.S. Senator Cory Booker (D) to serve as an example. I think (I'll try to prove it later) that I can answer Senator Booker's challenge, but I'd be interested in how others, of every religion and none, would answer.

How would you say that you -- in living your own day-to-day life -- express the values that you have learned from your religion or belief system, whatever it is?

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I believe it is human to murder babies and rape women. My guess is your humanism actually comes from something other than real humaity.

 

[Muffled]

I believe it is not. I gave up my humaity to become more like God. The old self died because it wasn't congruent with my religion.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I believe it is human to murder babies and rape women. My guess is your humanism actually comes from something other than real humaity.

Humanism is a philosophical and ethical stance that focuses on the potential of individuals and society, and the value of humans as the starting point for moral and philosophical inquiry. Humanists believe that people can use science and reason to solve problems, and that the world's problems should be addressed through human thought and action. Murdering babies and raping women do not fall within either the philosophy nor ethics that Humanism is about.

I believe it is not. I gave up my humaity to become more like God. The old self died because it wasn't congruent with my religion.

That seems bleak to me. You appear to be saying that if you didn't believe in God, you would find it quite alright to murder babies and rape women. It is not, so far as I can see, a very positive view of your own deeper self. I don't kill and rape because I don't want to, not because God forbids it.

 

[Link]

If only. My life and perhaps life of many others would be much better off if I did act accordingly.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

If only. My life and perhaps life of many others would be much better off if I did act accordingly.

What do you think makes it difficult to act accordingly?

 

[Link]

What do you think makes it difficult to act accordingly?

It's not difficult for people who trust in God, believe, submit, humble themselves, are grateful, etc. But I'm arrogant and have in the past left my religion. Seems that darkness of having done so has not gone away. While intellectually I'm convinced of Islam, seems my heart worships vain things and associates fantasy created by caprice and vanities of life of this world in general.

Outwardly, I testify to God and Mohammad (s). But inwardly, I turn away from God and the Messenger's (s) ruling light and authority towards that of Satanic delusion, whims and pleasures that even if were more pleasurable then God's light and sustenance and proximity(which they are not), would surely not last and are but temporary moments.

God is there in the clear horizon, but I run away from that realm and throw God behind back. It seems once I disbelieved in Islam, I took too much pride in coming back to Islam and never really sincerely cleansed my soul with regret of my deviation. Instead I blamed tafsirs and translations.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

It's not difficult for people who trust in God, believe, submit, humble themselves, are grateful, etc. But I'm arrogant and have in the past left my religion. Seems that darkness of having done so has not gone away. While intellectually I'm convinced of Islam, seems my heart worships vain things and associates fantasy created by caprice and vanities of life of this world in general.

Outwardly, I testify to God and Mohammad (s). But inwardly, I turn away from God and the Messenger's (s) ruling light and authority towards that of Satanic delusion, whims and pleasures that even if were more pleasurable then God's light and sustenance and proximity(which they are not), would surely not last and are but temporary moments.

God is there in the clear horizon, but I run away from that realm and throw God behind back. It seems once I disbelieved in Islam, I took too much pride in coming back to Islam and never really sincerely cleansed my soul with regret of my deviation. Instead I blamed tafsirs and translations.

You know, I really find that interesting.

I have described my beliefs many, many times here, and I really do not act in ways that contradict my beliefs. But my beliefs are not based on God -- they're based on my own concern for the people around me...all of them. They're based on my acceptance that everyone -- every person -- who, when not deliberately harming others, possesses the same dignity of being human that I do.

I never deliberately hurt anyone -- I don't steal from them, or malign them behind their backs. I've never hit anybody, I own no weapons, I don't pray for vengeance against those who have hurt me. I don't even ask anyone to give up their religion simply because I don't believe it. (I do ask them not to try to involve me in their religion, but I think that's fair.)

I'm not perfect -- I make mistakes. But I accept those mistakes as mine, and when I know they're mistakes, I try to ensure I don't make them again. (And after 76 years, I'm getting better at that. Not perfect yet, but making fewer mistakes than I used to.)

I'd like to ask you -- how is it you think that what you call "whims and pleasures that even if were more pleasurable then God's light and sustenance and proximity(which they are not), would surely not last and are but temporary moments" are somehow wrong, or evil? When you meet someone, and the two of you find an attraction and a connection that you both think real and valuable, what is wrong with taking it to it's (perhaps) natural conclusion? Some of our whims and pleasures are really just that -- but don't in any way offend the universe. (I'll tell you, I've never understood why some people suppose that when you're alone, and maybe a bit horny, it's so terribly wrong to satisfy yourself -- maybe even while looking at a bit of racy photography.)

I think -- and this is my opinion and mine only -- that too many people get bound up in trying to do "what God wants," when they can't even begin to know what that is. I think they forget that they have the instincts within themselves to know the difference between right and wrong. And that sometimes doing things just for the pleasure of doing them isn't necessarily wrong at all.

 

[Spice]

I think -- and this is my opinion and mine only -- that too many people get bound up in trying to do "what God wants," when they can't even begin to know what that is. I think they forget that they have the instincts within themselves to know the difference between right and wrong. And that sometimes doing things just for the pleasure of doing them isn't necessarily wrong at all.

^^^^^This. "God" is in the heart, one's conscious, one's instinct. @Link Learn to listen and trust. That's what scared texts help one do, but the written word is not needed. It's all inside to be discovered.