The Mystery Thread

[ecco]

You can't help me, sir. To me it all seems ridiculous. You can't pound it into my head and I can't give you what you want. If a simple question bends you out of shape it's just a matter of me accepting it. You can say that isn't the proper question asked in the proper way because I'm ignorant . . . but c'mon. You aren't stupid. You know it's just a matter of me accepting it.

I can't do that because it doesn't make sense to me. The premise is set. Everything from there is "evidence" of that faulty premise. But it isn't. It's just nonsense.

No one can accept anything that conflicts with deeply held, religious beliefs in which they have been indoctrinated since birth. Period.

 

[Earthling]

No one can accept anything that conflicts with deeply held, religious beliefs in which they have been indoctrinated since birth. Period.

I wonder how many times I have to say this. I was taught evolution at a time when I thought the Bible was equally ridiculous. I was an unbeliever for 27 years. In school I was taught evolution long before becoming a believer, and I thought it was stupid then. From the time I became a believer until now, of all of my family and friends only my mother became a believer and none of the unbelievers that I know of believe in evolution.

You are the ones who have been indoctrinated. You actually think it's an intelligent answer to some question of how things work. It isn't.

 

[Earthling]

Your question was weak and only demonstrated a lack of understanding. I tried to explain that to you and you got rather angry. You did not appreciate my "Steve" answer and you would not accept a valid one. It appears that you are blaming others for your inability to understand a rather simple concept.

That is why I often offer to start at the beginning and work up to the concept. How about forgetting the theory for now and working on understanding the basics of science. I have yet to meet an evolution denier that understands the concept of evidence. That is a good place to start, would you like to begin there?

Why? I have no interest in the subject. It isn't important or relevant to me.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Why? I have no interest in the subject. It isn't important or relevant to me.

That is belied by your constant denial and attack of it. If it was truly not important you would not continually dispute it. Who won the last lottery was not important to me. I did not buy a ticket, I do not even know when someone won it, though I am aware of the fact that there are "big winners" from time to time. I do not fixate on it and deny that others won it or wonder why I didn't (I know why, odds of hundreds of millions to one against my winning might be a clue) win.

 

[Earthling]

That is belied by your constant denial and attack of it. If it was truly not important you would not continually dispute it. Who won the last lottery was not important to me. I did not buy a ticket, I do not even know when someone won it, though I am aware of the fact that there are "big winners" from time to time. I do not fixate on it and deny that others won it or wonder why I didn't (I know why, odds of hundreds of millions to one against my winning might be a clue) win.

I think that what you fail to appreciate is that if it weren't for atheists who are fanatical about evolution constantly berating me about it I wouldn't give it a thought, ever.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I think that what you fail to appreciate is that if it weren't for atheists who are fanatical about evolution constantly berating me about it I wouldn't give it a thought, ever.

Do you think that it is only atheists that attempt to correct your errors?

 

[Earthling]

Do you think that it is only atheists that attempt to correct your errors?

I stand corrected. A lot of Christians have been indoctrinated with the nonsense as well. Do you think that makes any difference at all? It doesn't. Most Christians have also been indoctrinated with the pagan Trinity, Immortal Soul, Cross, Hell, Christmas, Easter, as well as Rapture and a dozen other nonsensical teachings. Not me.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I stand corrected. A lot of Christians have been indoctrinated with the nonsense as well. Do you think that makes any difference at all? It doesn't. Most Christians have also been indoctrinated with the pagan Trinity, Immortal Soul, Cross, Hell, Christmas, Easter, as well as Rapture and a dozen other nonsensical teachings. Not me.

When you make obviously false claims about others by accusing them of being "indoctrinated" you put a burden of proof upon yourself. Care to back that up?

 

[Earthling]

When you make obviously false claims about others by accusing them of being "indoctrinated" you put a burden of proof upon yourself. Care to back that up?

Nope.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Nope.

Didn't think so.

 

[dfnj]

Take it easy. Take it slow. No fuss.

First question. Is it okay for me to reject evolution while accepting other tenets of science?

In my experience, once people spend real time studying evolution they no longer reject it.

 

[Earthling]

Didn't think so.

Well, a few have made the accusation that I won't accept evolution because I was indoctrinated from birth with religious nonsense. I corrected them. How could they back up their claim? They can't. How can I refute it? I just did. Is that good enough? It will have to do. The same for my claim. It it isn't true correct it.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Well, a few have made the accusation that I won't accept evolution because I was indoctrinated from birth with religious nonsense. I corrected them. How could they back up their claim? They can't. How can I refute it? I just did. Is that good enough? It will have to do. The same for my claim. It it isn't true correct it.

It would seem like a reasonable conclusion since the theory of evolution is supported by evidence. Religious beliefs, not so much. The question now is why would you reject a concept that is well supported by evidence and accept one that is not?

 

[Earthling]

In my experience, once people spend real time studying evolution they no longer reject it.

If that's true then the people I know and grew up with are exceptional in that capacity. Which . . . I am not at all prepared to argue.

 

[Earthling]

It would seem like a reasonable conclusion since the theory of evolution is supported by evidence. Religious beliefs, not so much. The question now is why would you reject a concept that is well supported by evidence and accept one that is not?

Evidence. The golden ticket. Oh, look! Evidence. One selects ones evidence. I know, don't tell me . . . science is above that. The very suggestion is a warning flag to me, just as it was to religion. Religion, like science, has a long history of getting the evidence wrong. Look how many times the big bang has changed just in 70 years or so.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Evidence. The golden ticket. Oh, look! Evidence. One selects ones evidence. I know, don't tell me . . . science is above that. The very suggestion is a warning flag to me, just as it was to religion. Religion, like science, has a long history of getting the evidence wrong. Look how many times the big bang has changed just in 70 years or so.

Ideas are constantly refined in science. What is wrong with that? The computer you are using now is far beyond what you could have bought 20 years ago. Even a mere ten years ago it would have had far less memory and would have been slower. Science builds upon the work of the past.

A belief that ideas should be gotten 100% right on the first go is self defeating.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

So? Who cares? It's redundant, or as my great science teacher, @Subduction Zone would say, Occam's Razor.

Are you going to be sensible or are you going to continue being obtuse?

 

[Bird123]

So, you found god by looking at your nose. OK





You are not the first theobabbler I've come across in my time. Comments from folks like you are often along the lines of ...

• You are not ready to see The Truth.
• You must open your mind to see The Truth.
• You have not learned to see the entity that is The Universe.

Those who are not open to all possibilities rarely see anything except what they want to see. This is in every field not just God or religion. This is a lesson to learn. Further, those who do not seek rarely discover anything.

 

[Jollybear]

ecco said: ↑​

Theists:
Every thing has a cause and an origin.
Uh, oh, er, {cough, cough} except my god.

And you really want to talk about logic?


Got nuttin eh. I'm not surprised. I've seen it before so many times.

I know you can't justify your beliefs that your god has always existed. So let's try an easier question: Why did your God wait for 99.999999999999999999999999999+% of Eternity before creating anything?

Got nothing? You did not refute the point.

And your question assumes time, time requirs a wait.

There was no time. It was eternity.

In anycase, there has to be a first cause, a prime mover, a prime reality. There has to be.

 

[Earthling]

Ideas are constantly refined in science. What is wrong with that? The computer you are using now is far beyond what you could have bought 20 years ago. Even a mere ten years ago it would have had far less memory and would have been slower. Science builds upon the work of the past.

A belief that ideas should be gotten 100% right on the first go is self defeating.

Exactly. And this isn't an exclusive phenomenon to scientific inquiry. All the evidence for the majority of your life would have you defending Pluto as a planet and Evolution as fact. You can be wrong.