Morality of the Old Testament

[shunyadragon]

From which Sumerian, Babylonian and Phoenician./Canaanite culture and writings, did this law evolve?

​

Exodus 13:16​

​

והיה לאות על־ידכה ולטוטפת בין עיניך כי בחזק יד הוציאנו יהוה ממצרים׃​

And it shall be for a sign upon your hand, and for frontlets between your eyes; for by strength of hand the Lord brought us forth out of Egypt.​

​

Deuteronomy 11:18​

​

ושמתם את־דברי אלה על־לבבכם ועל־נפשכם וקשרתם אתם לאות על־ידכם והיו לטוטפת בין עיניכם׃​

Therefore shall you lay up these my words in your heart and in your soul, and bind them for a sign upon your hand, that they may be as frontlets between your eyes.​

​

From which Sumerian, Babylonian and Phoenician./Canaanite culture and writings, did these law evolve?

​

Deuteronomy:​

22:6​

כי יקרא קן־צפור לפניך בדרך בכל־עץ או על־הארץ אפרחים או ביצים והאם רבצת על־האפרחים או על־הביצים לא־תקח האם על־הבנים׃​

If a bird’s nest chances to be before you in the way in any tree, or on the ground, whether they are young ones, or eggs, and the mother sitting upon the young, or upon the eggs, you shall not take the mother with the young;​

​

22:7​

שלח תשלח את־האם ואת־הבנים תקח־לך למען ייטב לך והארכת ימים׃​

But you shall let the mother go, and take the young to you; that it may be well with you, and that you may prolong your days.​

​

22:8​

כי תבנה בית חדש ועשית מעקה לגגך ולא־תשים דמים בביתך כי־יפל הנפל ממנו׃​

When you build a new house, then you shall make a parapet for your roof, that you should not bring any blood upon your house, if any man falls from there.​

​

22:9​

לא־תזרע כרמך כלאים פן־תקדש המלאה הזרע אשר תזרע ותבואת הכרם׃​

You shall not sow your vineyard with different seeds; lest the fruit of your seed which you have sown, and the fruit of your vineyard, be defiled.​

​

22:10​

לא־תחרש בשור־ובחמר יחדו׃​

You shall not plow with an ox and an *** together.​

​

22:11​

לא תלבש שעטנז צמר ופשתים יחדו׃​

You shall not wear a garment of different sorts, like woolen and linen together.​

​

22:12​

גדלים תעשה־לך על־ארבע כנפות כסותך אשר תכסה־בה׃​

You shall make fringes upon the four quarters of your cloak, with which you cover yourself.​

First, the Hebrews were a Canaanite tribe,and did not have their own writing until after 600 BCE. Hebrew history as found in the Pentateuch has no provenance before 600 BCE. The myths ;ike the Noah flood have their origins from earlier Sumerian. Babylonian, and Canaanite/Ugarit writings.

Second, archaeological evidence demonstrates that the Gods of Hebrew tribes were Canaanite Gods including El, YHWH and Goddesses. The trends to Monotheism did not come till after 600 BCE with the return of the Hebrews from exile.

The Hebrew Goddess - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Hebrew Goddess supports the theory through the interpretation of archaeological and textual sources as evidence for veneration of feminine beings. Hebrew goddesses identified in the book include Asherah, Anath, Astarte, Ashima, the cherubim in Solomon's Temple, the Matronit (Shekhina), and the personified "Shabbat Bride".

The later editions of the book were expanded to include recent archaeological discoveries and the rituals of unification (Yichudim), which are to unite God with his Shekinah.

The identification of the pillar figurines with Asherah in this book was the first time they had been identified as such

Canaanite/Ugarit writings found in ancient libraries were a source of the Hebrews.

The Bible and the Ugaritic Literature | Church Blog

The Bible and the Ugaritic Literature. Find out about it in our monastery blog. We have been writing about Christianity, church history, church products and crafts, the lives of the great ascetics, etc.

catalog.obitel-minsk.com

Is Psalm 29 a Creative Reworking of a Ugaritic Hymn?​

The biblical authors also borrowed genres and literary styles from Ugarit. Judging from the analysis of the Biblical Psalms and the found Ugaritic hymns, we can conclude that these Canaanite hymns were known to ancient Hebrew authors, who took their images and style as a basis and applied them to the religion of the God of Israel. Psalm 29 is a vivid example of such cultural borrowing. The protagonist in the Ugarit prototype of Psalm 28 was Baal, the god of thunderstorms and tempest, whose attributes the author of the Psalm transferred from a pagan deity to the true God Yahweh. Yahweh is represented as a formidable God: The voice of the Lord is upon the waters: the God of glory thundereth (Psalm 29:3); His voice makes the earth shake: The voice of the Lord breaketh the cedars; yea, the Lord breaketh the cedars of Lebanon (Psalm 29:5), The voice of the Lord shaketh the wilderness; the Lord shaketh the wilderness of Kadesh (Psalm 29:8). God of Israel is represented as the Lord of storms and lightning: The voice of the Lord divideth the flames of fire (Psalm 29:7). Psalm 29 is not the only Psalm where some Canaanite images describing Baal are applied to the true God. Thus, Ugaritic texts call Baal “riding on the clouds” (O Ba’lu. Ugaritic Poetical Narratives), because one of his functions was to send down rain. This description is applied more than once by the prophets to the God of Israel, who maketh the clouds his chariot: who walketh upon the wings of the wind (see Psalm 68:33; 104:3; 18:10).

I can provide many more archaeological and ancient text reference that document the origins of the foundation of the Pentateuch as compiled form earlier sources and later adapted and edited to include Hebrew traditions and beliefs,

 

[Banach-Tarski Paradox]

The Laws of slavery have been contentious issues throughout history with the failure of ancient texts to forbid slavery.

The Wars of Independence were not Holy Wars. Better examples of Holy Wars are the wars between Judaism, Christianity and Islam. The Tribal nature of ancient religions has resulted in persecution, ethnic cleansing, pogroms, and anti-semitism and anti-Islamic violence against other religions up until today.

I’m talking about Black History here in America.

And, in this case, the history of Catholicism, and the history of Freedom.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

My question is simple. Do theists agree with these the verses, or not?

The only thing simple is your understanding of the verses, so allow me to quote a couple of excepts by Nahum Sarna on Exodus 21:20-21.

But first, a note on the rendering Exodus 21:20. You offer ...

• Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result,

The following is from Robert Alter and the JPS [ibid] respectively.

• And should a man strike his mail slave or his slavegirl with a rod and they die under his hand, they shall surely be avenged.
• When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod, and he dies there and the, he must be avenged,

And now, Sarna:

Injury to a Slave (vv. 20-21)​

​

This law -- the protection of slaves from maltreatment by their masters -- is found nowhere else in the entire existing corpus of ancient Near Eastern legislation. It represents a qualitative transformation inn social and human values and expresses itself once again in the provisions of verses 26-27. The underlying issue, as before, is the determination of intent on the part of the assailant at the time the act was committed. ...​

​

he must be avenged -- The master is criminally liable and faces execution, in keeping with the law of verse 12. Rabbinic tradition prescribes decapitation. This interpretation -- that the Hebrew stem n-k-m means the death penalty -- is supported by the early tradition behind the Samaritan version, which, in place of our received Hebrew text, actually reads here, "He must be put to death" (mot yumat).​

​

21. Should the beaten slave linger more than a day before succumbing, certain new and mitigating circumstances arise. The direct, causal relationship between the master's conduct and the slave's death is now in doubt, for there may have been some unknown intermediate cause.​

​

As for verse 12:

• He who fatally strikes a man shall be put to death.

Do I "believe in these verse"?

• I believe that a person should demonstrate a genuine effort to understand the verses.
• I believe that a person should demonstrate a genuine effort to understand the societal context.
• And, most importantly, I believe that a person should make a genuine effort to understand what he or she doest not understand.

Otherwise, "simple" rhetorical questions are effectively disingenuous.

 

[shunyadragon]

Genesis 22:10-12

10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son.

11 And the angel of the Lord called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I.

12 And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me.


That's absolutely correct. I Am an Ultra Extremist Christian Gnostic. True Devoted Religion is Ultra Extremism as Elohim/God taught Abraham. Precisely, Without True Religious Devotion to Elohim/God you Fall prey to the Fallible and Weak Nature.

One way of demonstrating True Religious Devotion to Elohim/God is to Separate like the Amish. Elohim/God has Ordained that I live among True Devoted Satanists.


Amish Abduction - Trailer

I will take this extremist radical egocentric beliefs in consideration concerning future communications

 

[shunyadragon]

The only thing simple is your understanding of the verses, so allow me to quote a couple of excepts by Nahum Sarna on Exodus 21:20-21.

But first, a note on the rendering Exodus 21:20. You offer ...

• Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result,

The following is from Robert Alter and the JPS [ibid] respectively.

• And should a man strike his mail slave or his slavegirl with a rod and they die under his hand, they shall surely be avenged.
• When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod, and he dies there and the, he must be avenged,

And now, Sarna:

Injury to a Slave (vv. 20-21)​

​

This law -- the protection of slaves from maltreatment by their masters -- is found nowhere else in the entire existing corpus of ancient Near Eastern legislation. It represents a qualitative transformation inn social and human values and expresses itself once again in the provisions of verses 26-27. The underlying issue, as before, is the determination of intent on the part of the assailant at the time the act was committed. ...​

​

he must be avenged -- The master is criminally liable and faces execution, in keeping with the law of verse 12. Rabbinic tradition prescribes decapitation. This interpretation -- that the Hebrew stem n-k-m means the death penalty -- is supported by the early tradition behind the Samaritan version, which, in place of our received Hebrew text, actually reads here, "He must be put to death" (mot yumat).​

​

21. Should the beaten slave linger more than a day before succumbing, certain new and mitigating circumstances arise. The direct, causal relationship between the master's conduct and the slave's death is now in doubt, for there may have been some unknown intermediate cause.​

​

As for verse 12:

• He who fatally strikes a man shall be put to death.

Do I "believe in these verse"?

• I believe that a person should demonstrate a genuine effort to understand the verses.
• I believe that a person should demonstrate a genuine effort to understand the societal context.
• And, most importantly, I believe that a person should make a genuine effort to understand what he or she doest not understand.

Otherwise, "simple" rhetorical questions are effectively disingenuous.

These citations are incomplete concerning foreign slavery and indentured servitude in the Hebrew scripture.

The problem is the acceptance and regulating slavery in the Hebrew scriptures and the failure of the Hebrew, Christian and Islamic scriptures to forbid slavery had an impact on wide spread slavery in the world up until the 19th century.

 

[Elihoenai]

Yes, yes, very distressing. Could you enlighten me as to how the Elect interpret the following psalm:

I am counted among those who go down to the Pit;
I am like those who have no help,
like those forsaken among the dead,
like the slain that lie in the grave,
like those whom you remember no more,
for they are cut off from your hand.
(Psalm 88:4-5, NRSVue)

As I read it, if God no longer remembers the dead, then he can't forgive their sins. If the dead are cut off from his hand, then God can't resurrect them.

Or what about Psalm 93:1, Psalm 96:10, or Psalm 104:5, all of which say that the Earth cannot move?

The Elect Interprets the Holy Scriptures/Bible with Divine Esoteric Spiritual Knowledge. Elohim/God in the Bible teaches Esoteric and Exoteric Knowledge. Exoteric Knowledge is the Literal and Historical Interpretation that is accessible to All. It's the Secret Esoteric Knowledge that Saves and Only Elohim/God can Reveal this to you.

Or how about this passage from the story of the creation:

And God said, "Let there be a dome in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters." So God made the dome and separated the waters that were under the dome from the waters that were above the dome. And it was so. God called the dome Sky.
(Genesis 1:6-7, NRSVue)

Why would there be waters above the Earth's atmosphere? Doesn't that imply that the author believed that the universe is filled with water? And why would the atmosphere be in the shape of a dome? A dome shaped atmosphere can't fit over a spherical Earth, so it seems to me that the author must have believed that the Earth is flat. Is that what Gnosticism holds?

Christian Gnosticism is Divine Spiritual Knowledge. Gnostics don't get involved in Wild Natural Speculations that cannot be Resolved.


Gnosticism

Gnosticism (from Ancient Greek: γνωστικός, romanized: gnōstikós, Koine Greek: [ɣnostiˈkos], 'having knowledge') is a collection of religious ideas and systems that coalesced in the late 1st century AD among Jewish and early Christian sects. These various groups emphasized personal spiritual knowledge (gnosis) above the proto-orthodox teachings, traditions, and authority of religious institutions.

Gnosticism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And here's the very first passage from the story of creation:

When God began to create the heavens and the earth, the earth was complete chaos, and darkness covered the face of the deep, while a wind from God swept over the face of the waters.
(Genesis 1:1-2, NRSVue)

It would seem that the author believed that the substance of the earth and the waters both preexisted before God began the act of creation by saying "Let there be light." That is the opposite of what most Christian sects claim to believe. But is it a fundamental tenet of Gnosticism?

Gnostics don't get involved in Scientific discussions relating to the Bible. The Natural Mind cannot Really understand the Bible and Albert Einstein is a perfect example of this. Although Albert Einstein was a Natural Genius he didn't have a clue where the Bible is concerned:

Einstein's "God Letter" - An English translation

I doubt that I am as knowledgeable as you concerning Gnostic beliefs, but here is an excerpt from a Gnostic document known as "On The Origin of the World" from the Nag Hammadi library:

Since everyone-- the gods of the world and men-- says that nothing has existed prior to Chaos, I shall demonstrate that [they] all erred, since they do not know the [structure] of Chaos and its root. Here [is the] demonstration:
If it is [agreed by] all men concerning [Chaos] that it is a darkness, then it is something derived from a shadow. It was called darkness.
But the shadow is something derived from a work existing from the beginning.
So it is obvious that it (the first work) existed before Chaos came into being, which followed after the first work.
(The Nag Hammadi Library, Translated by Members of the Coptic Library Project of the Institute for Antiquity and Christianity, James M. Robinson Director, (c) E.J. Brill 1977, pg. 162)

The document goes on to describe a time before the time of Yahweh when a previous generation of divine spirits created Chaos. Is that the version of Gnosticism to which you adhere?

Job 38:4-5

4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?


Real Christian Gnosticism is All About becoming Unified With Elohim/God through Total Religious Devotion/Obedience. On the Journey to becoming Unified with Elohim/God the things Hidden from Mortal Man are Revealed. I'm at the Beginning Stages of the Spiritual Journey.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Do Christians actually believe in the morality of the Old Testament? Let’s consider the Fourth Commandment:
“Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long in the land which the LORD your God gives you.”

In West, generally the children leave the parents when they become adults. Many curse their parents (real or adopted).

 

[Banach-Tarski Paradox]

Ohhhh! the unfortunate proliferation of youtube idiocy at the expense of a logical argument.

In some religions, music and dance are very important.

Apparently not in yours.

I’ve met Charlie King and heard him perform that tune in person.

As a mathematical logician by profession, I’ve grown wary of asking what anybody means when they use the phrase “logical argument”.

The Logical Song

 

[shunyadragon]

In some religions, music and dance are very important.

Apparently not in yours.

I’ve met Charlie King and heard him perform that tune in person.

As a mathematical logician by profession, I’ve grown wary of asking what anybody means when they use the phrase “logical argument”.

The Logical Song

Itis not a matter of the importance of music and dance. It is the mindless proliferation of Youtube videos and not discussing the subject at hand.

By the way I believe in the importance of song and dance in human spiritual, but that is not the issues of the thred.

 

[shunyadragon]

I’m talking about Black History here in America.

The issues of the Black history in America were not an issue of Holy War, It was an issue of slavery in Christianity justified by racial superiority and slavery based on the ancient tribal text of the Bible, The failure of a scriptural basis to forbid slavery contributed to the prevalence of slavery in the West up until the 19th century. Racial justification of widespread penal slavery in the USA persisted up until very recently in the USA.

And, in this case, the history of Catholicism, and the history of Freedom.

The history of the Roman Church (RCC) has been more to autocratic control than actual promotion of freedom in history, and not an enlightend view of slavery until the 18th and 19th century.

Catholic Church and slavery - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Catholic Church and slavery have a long and complicated history. Slavery was practiced and accepted by many cultures and religions around the world throughout history, including in ancient Rome. Passages in the Old Testament sanctioned forms of temporal slavery for Israelites as a means to repay a debt. Slaves, captured in war or purchased, and their children were enslaved for life.[1] After Christianity was legalized under the Roman empire, sentiment grew that many kinds of slavery were incompatible with Christian justice. Views ranged from rejecting all forms of slavery to accepting slavery subject to certain restrictions (Thomas Aquinas). The Christian West almost entirely enforced that a free Christian could not be enslaved, for example as a captive in war. However, this was not consistently applied throughout history. The Middle Ages witnessed the emergence of orders of monks such as the Mercedarians who focused on ransoming Christian slaves. By the end of the Medieval period, enslavement of Christians had been largely abolished throughout Europe, although enslavement of non-Christians remained permissible and was revived in Spain and Portugal. Slavery remained a subject of debate within the Church for centuries, with several Popes issuing bulls on the issue, such as Sublimis Deus.

By the 1800s, the Church reached relative consensus in favor of condemning chattel slavery and praising its abolition.[2]

 

[shunyadragon]

The Elect Interprets the Holy Scriptures/Bible with Divine Esoteric Spiritual Knowledge. Elohim/God in the Bible teaches Esoteric and Exoteric Knowledge. Exoteric Knowledge is the Literal and Historical Interpretation that is accessible to All. It's the Secret Esoteric Knowledge that Saves and Only Elohim/God can Reveal this to you.










Christian Gnosticism is Divine Spiritual Knowledge. Gnostics don't get involved in Wild Natural Speculations that cannot be Resolved.


Gnosticism

Gnosticism (from Ancient Greek: γνωστικός, romanized: gnōstikós, Koine Greek: [ɣnostiˈkos], 'having knowledge') is a collection of religious ideas and systems that coalesced in the late 1st century AD among Jewish and early Christian sects. These various groups emphasized personal spiritual knowledge (gnosis) above the proto-orthodox teachings, traditions, and authority of religious institutions.

Gnosticism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Gnostics don't get involved in Scientific discussions relating to the Bible. The Natural Mind cannot Really understand the Bible and Albert Einstein is a perfect example of this. Although Albert Einstein was a Natural Genius he didn't have a clue where the Bible is concerned:

Einstein's "God Letter" - An English translation

Job 38:4-5

4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?


Real Christian Gnosticism is All About becoming Unified With Elohim/God through Total Religious Devotion/Obedience. On the Journey to becoming Unified with Elohim/God the things Hidden from Mortal Man are Revealed. I'm at the Beginning Stages of the Spiritual Journey.

Like many who take an arrogant egocentric conflicting views of only a select few that understand some sort mythical truth you believe only those that believe as you do understand scripture.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

These citations are incomplete concerning foreign slavery and indentured servitude in the Hebrew scripture.

Of course they are. They are also to the point. Whine less.

The problem is the acceptance and regulating slavery in the Hebrew scriptures and the failure of the Hebrew, Christian and Islamic scriptures to forbid slavery had an impact on wide spread slavery in the world up until the 19th century.

Brilliant.

 

[Banach-Tarski Paradox]

Itis not a matter of the importance of music and dance. It is the mindless proliferation of Youtube videos and not discussing the subject at hand.

By the way I believe in the importance of song and dance in human spiritual, but that is not the issues of the thred.

Music and dance have everything to do with the issues at hand.



Libertine Behavior: "The Slaves Act As If They Are Free"

In July, 1819, Gerónimo Torres decided to travel to his mine given that during the previous months the royalist government had devised a campaign against the insubordinate slave gangs of San Juan and neighboring Saija. Although the government's offensive led to apparent victory, after 11 months at the mine, Torres had to draft a letter pleading for help because of the difficult situation he had encountered. Torres' 1820 letter to the governor of Popayán noted that the "scandalous insubordination [of the slaves in the mine] demands that public authority aid the masters to subject and correct them."

Torres had arrived thinking he would find "the slaves weakened, submissive, and willing to repair all of the damage they had caused their masters." Instead he was shocked when all he found in the slaves was "pride, arrogance, insubordination, and neglect." The description that Torres provides in the letter is interesting and certainly serves as an exceptional source of information. He notes that in the months he spent amoung what he considered to be his slaves, they rejected his orders, forcing him to tolerate their disorder and disrespect. Particularly noteworthy is that Torres said that whenever he attempted to scold a slave, the parents and family of the slave being punished would soon arive at Torres' house to challenge him. Additionally, he recounted that he constantly recieved threats from the slaves, who used the hunting spears they posessed to warn him, "if I punished them they would kill me with their spears." Finally, Torres noted that he was particularly bothered because "they have organized dances in my house without my permission, insulting me even in their songs," and "the slaves at as if they were free."

Torres decided to leave the mine given that it was impossible for him to keep his slaves under control, since he had no authority over them, and in view of the "innate, and impossible to overcome, hatred that the slave has for his master, which he immediately applies at the moment when he does not feel the master's authority over him." From this statement it seems that Torres acknowledged his slaves had expressed their will not to be dominated by him nor to obey him. This was possible for the slaves - now closer to ex-slaves - lately because during the past nine years they had made the mine their own and, at the time of his return, were armed (with spears and knives); thus, they did not feel threatened by a single white mine owner attempting to retun them to slavery. They were not receptive to his multiple attempts to negociate with them, through such measures as giving them new work tools, allowing them to continue working their plots, decreasing their working day (jornal) by one-half, treating them for their illnesses, and distributing clothes and goods to them free of charge.

(pages 183-184)

snip-----------

Indian and Slave Royalists in the Age of Revolution: Reform, Revolution, and Royalism in the Northern Andes, 1780-1825

 

[Audie]

Historically, the Laws of Slavery were contentious issues back in the 1700s and early 1800s.

The Wars of Independence, for example, were Holy Wars.

The wars of independence?

 

[Audie]

In West, generally the children leave the parents when they become adults. Many curse their parents (real or adopted).

Many deserve worse.

I'm among the lucky, to have a mom
of whom i'm constantly in awe.

But then it's a fools game to understand said
Commandments as absolutes.

 

[Banach-Tarski Paradox]

The wars of independence?

There was a mural recently installed in Universidad del Cauca. It contains elements several elements related to afropatiana religion. (Catholic)

The four figures in the center foreground represent those wars.

Noticias y actualidad

www.unicauca.edu.co

Arte y Cultura - Miércoles, Febrero 2, 2022​

Unicauca tendrá mural representativo de la cultura patiana​

A un costado del Paraninfo Francisco José de Caldas, se ubicará el mural “Un Canto a la Escuetería”, obra artística que representa la libertad, y que se convierte en un homenaje de la academia y la sociedad a los macheteros del Patía.

 

[DavidSMoore]

@Elihoenai :

Christian Gnosticism is Divine Spiritual Knowledge. Gnostics don't get involved in Wild Natural Speculations that cannot be Resolved.

But that's exactly what the Gnostic document "On The Origin Of The World" I cited does! It seems to me that you're advocating a variant of Gnosticism that has strayed from its roots.

@Elihoenai :

Job 38:4-5
4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?

Real Christian Gnosticism is All About becoming Unified With Elohim/God through Total Religious Devotion/Obedience. On the Journey to becoming Unified with Elohim/God the things Hidden from Mortal Man are Revealed. I'm at the Beginning Stages of the Spiritual Journey.

You're very good at citing passages from the Bible that support your theological position, but your answer to my direct questions about other passages in the Bible seems to be "those passages don't matter; the only passages that matter are the ones I care about." I can find passages from the Bible that support any of a range of theological positions-- some of them anathema to many major Christian sects. Citing a specific subset of passages as proof of the "truth" is a common Christian gimmick. The real question shouldn't be "What do the specific passages I love say?" but should instead be "What is the broad message of the Bible as a whole?" That's a much more difficult thing to assess-- and it certainly can't be arrived at by simply ignoring vast swaths of the biblical writings. As far as the original Gnostic literature goes-- at least as concerns those documents retrieved from the Nag Hammadi library-- in my opinion that body of works is a morass of woolly speculation and conjecture.

 

[dybmh]

First, the Hebrews were a Canaanite tribe,and did not have their own writing until after 600 BCE. Hebrew history as found in the Pentateuch has no provenance before 600 BCE. The myths ;ike the Noah flood have their origins from earlier Sumerian. Babylonian, and Canaanite/Ugarit writings.

Second, archaeological evidence demonstrates that the Gods of Hebrew tribes were Canaanite Gods including El, YHWH and Goddesses. The trends to Monotheism did not come till after 600 BCE with the return of the Hebrews from exile.

The Hebrew Goddess - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Hebrew Goddess supports the theory through the interpretation of archaeological and textual sources as evidence for veneration of feminine beings. Hebrew goddesses identified in the book include Asherah, Anath, Astarte, Ashima, the cherubim in Solomon's Temple, the Matronit (Shekhina), and the personified "Shabbat Bride".

The later editions of the book were expanded to include recent archaeological discoveries and the rituals of unification (Yichudim), which are to unite God with his Shekinah.

The identification of the pillar figurines with Asherah in this book was the first time they had been identified as such

Canaanite/Ugarit writings found in ancient libraries were a source of the Hebrews.

The Bible and the Ugaritic Literature | Church Blog

The Bible and the Ugaritic Literature. Find out about it in our monastery blog. We have been writing about Christianity, church history, church products and crafts, the lives of the great ascetics, etc.

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Is Psalm 29 a Creative Reworking of a Ugaritic Hymn?​

The biblical authors also borrowed genres and literary styles from Ugarit. Judging from the analysis of the Biblical Psalms and the found Ugaritic hymns, we can conclude that these Canaanite hymns were known to ancient Hebrew authors, who took their images and style as a basis and applied them to the religion of the God of Israel. Psalm 29 is a vivid example of such cultural borrowing. The protagonist in the Ugarit prototype of Psalm 28 was Baal, the god of thunderstorms and tempest, whose attributes the author of the Psalm transferred from a pagan deity to the true God Yahweh. Yahweh is represented as a formidable God: The voice of the Lord is upon the waters: the God of glory thundereth (Psalm 29:3); His voice makes the earth shake: The voice of the Lord breaketh the cedars; yea, the Lord breaketh the cedars of Lebanon (Psalm 29:5), The voice of the Lord shaketh the wilderness; the Lord shaketh the wilderness of Kadesh (Psalm 29:8). God of Israel is represented as the Lord of storms and lightning: The voice of the Lord divideth the flames of fire (Psalm 29:7). Psalm 29 is not the only Psalm where some Canaanite images describing Baal are applied to the true God. Thus, Ugaritic texts call Baal “riding on the clouds” (O Ba’lu. Ugaritic Poetical Narratives), because one of his functions was to send down rain. This description is applied more than once by the prophets to the God of Israel, who maketh the clouds his chariot: who walketh upon the wings of the wind (see Psalm 68:33; 104:3; 18:10).

I can provide many more archaeological and ancient text reference that document the origins of the foundation of the Pentateuch as compiled form earlier sources and later adapted and edited to include Hebrew traditions and beliefs,

You seem to have down-shifted into preaching. Would you please stay on topic? This was your assertion:

The Laws and mythology most likely evolved from Sumerian, Babylonian and Phoenician./Canaanite culture and writings,

From which "Sumerian, Babylonian and Phoenician./Canaanite culture and writings," did this law evolve?

Exodus 13:16​

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והיה לאות על־ידכה ולטוטפת בין עיניך כי בחזק יד הוציאנו יהוה ממצרים׃​

And it shall be for a sign upon your hand, and for frontlets between your eyes; for by strength of hand the Lord brought us forth out of Egypt.​

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Deuteronomy 11:18​

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ושמתם את־דברי אלה על־לבבכם ועל־נפשכם וקשרתם אתם לאות על־ידכם והיו לטוטפת בין עיניכם׃​

Therefore shall you lay up these my words in your heart and in your soul, and bind them for a sign upon your hand, that they may be as frontlets between your eyes.​

From which "Sumerian, Babylonian and Phoenician./Canaanite culture and writings," did these law evolve?

Deuteronomy:​

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22:6​

כי יקרא קן־צפור לפניך בדרך בכל־עץ או על־הארץ אפרחים או ביצים והאם רבצת על־האפרחים או על־הביצים לא־תקח האם על־הבנים׃​

If a bird’s nest chances to be before you in the way in any tree, or on the ground, whether they are young ones, or eggs, and the mother sitting upon the young, or upon the eggs, you shall not take the mother with the young;​

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22:7​

שלח תשלח את־האם ואת־הבנים תקח־לך למען ייטב לך והארכת ימים׃​

But you shall let the mother go, and take the young to you; that it may be well with you, and that you may prolong your days.​

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22:8​

כי תבנה בית חדש ועשית מעקה לגגך ולא־תשים דמים בביתך כי־יפל הנפל ממנו׃​

When you build a new house, then you shall make a parapet for your roof, that you should not bring any blood upon your house, if any man falls from there.​

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22:9​

לא־תזרע כרמך כלאים פן־תקדש המלאה הזרע אשר תזרע ותבואת הכרם׃​

You shall not sow your vineyard with different seeds; lest the fruit of your seed which you have sown, and the fruit of your vineyard, be defiled.​

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22:10​

לא־תחרש בשור־ובחמר יחדו׃​

You shall not plow with an ox and an *** together.​

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22:11​

לא תלבש שעטנז צמר ופשתים יחדו׃​

You shall not wear a garment of different sorts, like woolen and linen together.​

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22:12​

גדלים תעשה־לך על־ארבע כנפות כסותך אשר תכסה־בה׃​

You shall make fringes upon the four quarters of your cloak, with which you cover yourself.​

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[shunyadragon]

You seem to have down-shifted into preaching. Would you please stay on topic? This was your assertion:

Failure to respond. It is right on topic that the morality and ethics of the Pentateuch evolved from more ancient texts as demonstrated. These are ancient tribal morals and ethics that have fortunately potentially evolved beyond the morals and ethics of the Torah, NT and Quran, which do not meet the moral and ethical standards of the contemporary world as in the Declaration of Human Rights. promoted by the UN, and other modern standards that are more universal and equitable to the diversity of the present world

 

[dybmh]

can provide many more archaeological and ancient text reference that document the origins of the foundation of the Pentateuch as compiled form earlier sources and later adapted and edited to include Hebrew traditions and beliefs,

But can you answer the questions I asked about the law?

Failure to respond.

You are welcome to ask a question, and maybe I will respond. However it is exceptionally rude to write this when you did not respond to the question I asked.

Please take your preaching elsewhere. I have higher standards for intellectual discourse.