“Hindus fall because they worship lesser gods.” Abrahamics are trampling Hindus. Can you help me understand?

[RamaRaksha]

Interesting. But Hinduism has moved in the opposite direction from worship of One God in the vedas to worship of lesser gods today.

All these Gods - millions - are actually saying God is not important
Just like if you go for a job or a promotion - the boss is not important, what is important are your qualifications
It's the total opposite of Christianity & Islam where they say - Good Works don't matter, it is the boss that is important
In Hinduism it is the opposite - Works are ALL that matters, the boss is not important

 

[RamaRaksha]

@RamaRaksha

How did the people in India protect their land from the Romans during the time the Romans had already taken over Germany's land?



Later:


Did Germany and Hindus lose their land or valuable assets due to similar reasons?

Romans take German land

British-taken Indian land—to take their valuable assets.

We are not one person - we are different people - times change, people change
Sometimes it is up to the leaders - weak leaders give up - when the British came, the Muslim leaders were weak, they gave up easily
When the Romans came, India had strong leadership that would not be conquered
Look up the first world war - Russia kept losing battle after battle, lost a lot of people, and finally gave up and stopped fighting Germany
But the 2nd world war was won by the Russians

 

[RamaRaksha]

Yes, let's look for rational explanations.



@RamaRaksha
Was Krishna living in India prior to Hinduism? I'm not sure what the ancient name for India was; Krishna fled from King Jarasandha. What words were used to express the emotions that Krishna felt during that time?

Earlier, Krishna's parents were sent to prison, or was only one of Krishna's parents sent to prison?

I need to respond to your post in more than one post to help me. In this post response, I'm realizing I didn't address Abrahamic, but only the time of Krishna. However, I'm not sure if those words were absent during the time of Krishna. Can you help me with this? So at what time were those words absent in India?

I understand that reincarnation is a journey of learning and visiting earth.

I am sure a person called Krishna existed - so did Rama, so did Jesus
All the magic, miracle they purportedly did, I am skeptical of that(BTW Rama never said He was God nor did he perform any miracles - Rama was the inspiration for Nietzsche - His Super Man)
Ancient people did not understand the world very well - and in such a world, things they did not understand were put down as magic, miracle
And hence all the religious stories were enhanced
.
"I understand that reincarnation is a journey of learning and visiting earth" um no, Reincarnation says there is only ONE world, this one
If you want life, it is only here
God did not create Heaven - Religions did and the idea of Heaven survives because of the lack of questions by the educated
The media censors questions
Watch any news story where the media interviews religious heads - they stick to 3 or 4 simple questions
1 - Will we be Happy in Heaven?
2 - How wonderful will Heaven be?
3 - Will we see all our DEAD loved ones again?

Not one asks 1 - is there any evidence for Heaven?
2 - What about our LIVING loved ones? Could they be starving, sick, homeless, caught in a war facing rape, torture?
You can see how this makes religious people uncomfortable - how are the dead people supposed to be enjoying
heaven while their OWN loved ones are starving? sick? Homeless?
Makes them look Callous, doesn't it?
3 - What happens to unbelievers? - Billions of innocent people shut out of Heaven - a Segregated heaven!
4 - What does one DO in Heaven?
The last question is so devastating to religions that I can't get it published anywhere

 

[River Sea]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=443035307951485

October 25, 2022 This was posted on Facebook.
The first British Hindu Prime Minister visited ISKCON temple in London

 

[River Sea]

I am sure a person called Krishna existed - so did Rama, so did Jesus
All the magic, miracle they purportedly did, I am skeptical of that(BTW Rama never said He was God nor did he perform any miracles - Rama was the inspiration for Nietzsche - His Super Man)

@RamaRaksha
I thought Rama was Abraham from the Indus Valley.

You wrote that Rama was the inspiration for Nietzsche. In what ways did Rama become an inspiration for Nietzsche? From Google searches, Nietzsche had a lot of health challenges, even memory loss. Did learning about Rama help him through those challenges? If so, in what ways? What caused Nietzsche to want to learn about Rama?

Rama: 1996 to 1646 BCE
birth date of Abraham as before 2090 BCE

I google search Nietzsche
Born Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche
15 October 1844 AD
Died 25 August 1900 (aged 55) AD

Please read further down as I added more in this post.

Friedrich Nietzsche - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

@RamaRakshaI found a book by Friedrich Nietzsche. I'll go read it and get an idea of how Nietzsche thinks.

Beyond Good and Evil, by Friedrich Nietzsche

BEYOND GOOD AND EVIL

By Friedrich Nietzsche

Translated by Helen Zimmern

I'm using reading aloud from Microsoft Edge. Because that's a lot of reading, using Bluetooth earbuds so hear as I do other things.

CHAPTER I.	PREJUDICES OF PHILOSOPHERS
CHAPTER II.	THE FREE SPIRIT
CHAPTER III.	THE RELIGIOUS MOOD
CHAPTER IV.	APOPHTHEGMS AND INTERLUDES
CHAPTER V.	THE NATURAL HISTORY OF MORALS
CHAPTER VI.	WE SCHOLARS
CHAPTER VII.	OUR VIRTUES
CHAPTER VIII.	PEOPLES AND COUNTRIES
CHAPTER IX.	WHAT IS NOBLE?

That's a lot of reading, so hearing it helps

That's more difficult reading then I thought.

Example
further down Chapter 1
20. That the separate philosophical ideas are not anything optional or autonomously evolving, but grow up in connection and relationship with each other, that, however suddenly and arbitrarily they seem to appear in the history of thought, they nevertheless belong just as much to a system as the collective members of the fauna of a Continent—is betrayed in the end by the circumstance: how unfailingly the most diverse philosophers always fill in again a definite fundamental scheme of POSSIBLE philosophies

My response is that, as I listen to it, it feels like a drone of words.
How come it does that for me as I listen? It's as if my mind only hears sounds, and that's it.

Maybe it's because I have it on aloud at Microsoft Edge and hear it only.

Lets see, the most diverse philosophers always fill in again a definite fundamental scheme of POSSIBLE philosophes.

That's that last line

so there's a scheme of possible philosophes, what does that mean?

I think the way I read is slower and I ask questions

See even by me asking this question, so there's a scheme of possible philosophes, I'll ask what is the scheme, and do philosophers actually have a scheme?

see now just by me asking that questions causes me to be more interested even if I'm wrong in my asking, but it helps

then it'll cause me to read again and perhaps further up, just to understand the question I form

See how I did that?

Do philosophers scheme and if so what is the schemes?

Found more online about
What was Nietzsche's main belief?
God and Evil - Nietzsche | Philosophy | University of Southampton

Nietzsche believed that the world is full of suffering and that it lacks any overall purpose or meaning. However, he thought that our ability to deal with this suffering, to endure hardships and overcome them, is an important and valuable exercise of our power and character.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

“Hindus fall because they worship lesser gods.” Abrahamics are trampling Hindus. Can you help me understand?

I understand that Celestial beings like Archangels, Angels, etc., in the Abrahamic tradition are considered lessor Gods in other religions. All religions so far as I know have Celestial hierarchies, including the Abrahamic.

 

[RamaRaksha]

@RamaRaksha
I thought Rama was Abraham from the Indus Valley.

You wrote that Rama was the inspiration for Nietzsche. In what ways did Rama become an inspiration for Nietzsche? From Google searches, Nietzsche had a lot of health challenges, even memory loss. Did learning about Rama help him through those challenges? If so, in what ways? What caused Nietzsche to want to learn about Rama?

Rama: 1996 to 1646 BCE
birth date of Abraham as before 2090 BCE

I google search Nietzsche
Born Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche
15 October 1844 AD
Died 25 August 1900 (aged 55) AD

Please read further down as I added more in this post.

Friedrich Nietzsche - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

@RamaRakshaI found a book by Friedrich Nietzsche. I'll go read it and get an idea of how Nietzsche thinks.

Beyond Good and Evil, by Friedrich Nietzsche

BEYOND GOOD AND EVIL

By Friedrich Nietzsche

Translated by Helen Zimmern

I'm using reading aloud from Microsoft Edge. Because that's a lot of reading, using Bluetooth earbuds so hear as I do other things.

CHAPTER I.	PREJUDICES OF PHILOSOPHERS
CHAPTER II.	THE FREE SPIRIT
CHAPTER III.	THE RELIGIOUS MOOD
CHAPTER IV.	APOPHTHEGMS AND INTERLUDES
CHAPTER V.	THE NATURAL HISTORY OF MORALS
CHAPTER VI.	WE SCHOLARS
CHAPTER VII.	OUR VIRTUES
CHAPTER VIII.	PEOPLES AND COUNTRIES
CHAPTER IX.	WHAT IS NOBLE?

That's a lot of reading, so hearing it helps

That's more difficult reading then I thought.

Example
further down Chapter 1
20. That the separate philosophical ideas are not anything optional or autonomously evolving, but grow up in connection and relationship with each other, that, however suddenly and arbitrarily they seem to appear in the history of thought, they nevertheless belong just as much to a system as the collective members of the fauna of a Continent—is betrayed in the end by the circumstance: how unfailingly the most diverse philosophers always fill in again a definite fundamental scheme of POSSIBLE philosophies

My response is that, as I listen to it, it feels like a drone of words.
How come it does that for me as I listen? It's as if my mind only hears sounds, and that's it.

Maybe it's because I have it on aloud at Microsoft Edge and hear it only.

Lets see, the most diverse philosophers always fill in again a definite fundamental scheme of POSSIBLE philosophes.

That's that last line

so there's a scheme of possible philosophes, what does that mean?

I think the way I read is slower and I ask questions

See even by me asking this question, so there's a scheme of possible philosophes, I'll ask what is the scheme, and do philosophers actually have a scheme?

see now just by me asking that questions causes me to be more interested even if I'm wrong in my asking, but it helps

then it'll cause me to read again and perhaps further up, just to understand the question I form

See how I did that?

Do philosophers scheme and if so what is the schemes?

Found more online about
What was Nietzsche's main belief?
God and Evil - Nietzsche | Philosophy | University of Southampton

Nietzsche believed that the world is full of suffering and that it lacks any overall purpose or meaning. However, he thought that our ability to deal with this suffering, to endure hardships and overcome them, is an important and valuable exercise of our power and character.

The goal of Hindus is to follow in the footsteps of God - to aspire, to reach the hand of God
The story of Rama is one of a person born a human being but did what the Gods could not do(no magic or miracles, please, then he would not be a human being)
Yes life is full of suffering as Rama found life to be, but one must not back down, one must fight for a better world
That is the message of the Ramayana that Nietzsche read(his teacher was schopenhauer was well known for quoting Hinduism) and was his inspiration for Ubermensch - Superman or Overman
.
When I google this word i find
"A person who seems superhuman, with astounding powers, can be called an Ubermensch. This German word, more accurately spelled Übermensch, literally means "overman" and was coined in 1883 by the philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche. The Ubermensch was meant to be an ideal future human and an ultimate goal for humanity.
.
And when I read the first sentence I sigh - we seem to constantly look for people with super powers, magic, miracle even though by now we should know that there are no such people
Yet we keep drooling over "magic man is coming any day now, abracadabra and we will be living in paradise"!
That is not what Nietzsche nor the Ramayana talked about
Rama never once said he was God nor did he perform any magic or miracles
Nietzsche's Superman was a person who rose above his circumstances and blazed a new path and that was the story of Rama

 

[RamaRaksha]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=443035307951485

October 25, 2022 This was posted on Facebook.
The first British Hindu Prime Minister visited ISKCON temple in London

The ISKCON people have lost their way - they insist that Krishna is the Only God and there are no other
That is NOT Hinduism
When one insists that there is only one way that is a good way to descend down to a Communist/Dictator style religion
God then becomes a Master and we in turn become Slaves - "a Slave may serve Only One Master"
It is fine if the goals are low, easy - but if one has higher, tougher goals, a Master/Slave relationship won't cut it

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

The goal of Hindus is to follow in the footsteps of God - to aspire, to reach the hand of God
The story of Rama is one of a person born a human being but did what the Gods could not do(no magic or miracles, please, then he would not be a human being)
Yes life is full of suffering as Rama found life to be, but one must not back down, one must fight for a better world
That is the message of the Ramayana that Nietzsche read(his teacher was schopenhauer was well known for quoting Hinduism) and was his inspiration for Ubermensch - Superman or Overman
.
When I google this word i find
"A person who seems superhuman, with astounding powers, can be called an Ubermensch. This German word, more accurately spelled Übermensch, literally means "overman" and was coined in 1883 by the philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche. The Ubermensch was meant to be an ideal future human and an ultimate goal for humanity.
.
And when I read the first sentence I sigh - we seem to constantly look for people with super powers, magic, miracle even though by now we should know that there are no such people
Yet we keep drooling over "magic man is coming any day now, abracadabra and we will be living in paradise"!
That is not what Nietzsche nor the Ramayana talked about
Rama never once said he was God nor did he perform any magic or miracles
Nietzsche's Superman was a person who rose above his circumstances and blazed a new path and that was the story of Rama

Good. However, yoga vashishtha does not talk of suffering or detachment.

 

[RamaRaksha]

Good. However, yoga vashishtha does not talk of suffering or detachment.

It is sad that so many of us view God as our ticket to an everlasting life of ease & comfort - sadly, that is what we seek
It's either we go off to Heaven - enjoy the easy lazy good life - or - he is coming any day now and then what? Well, you guessed it -the easy good life, no worries, no sickness - everything wonderful
Pleasures of the flesh, the easy lazy life of no pain or suffering & God is our ticket
Sadly, Even Buddhists fell for this - the Buddha sought a way OUT of pain & suffering
The ancient Hindus tried to teach him that his quest was a lost cause, but he did not listen
He thought he found it by checking out of life - by rejecting desires
He was right - but he lost out on life also
And that is the downside of trying to get away from pain & suffering
It is not that difficult - just ignore all the pain & suffering around us, and we can be happy
A callous, uncaring person is happy, but the one who cares about others, sees the suffering of others is unhappy
.
An old man has Alzheimer's - he has lost his memory, but is not in pain - he is happy
His daughter sits by him, crying her eyes out because her own father does not recognize her
Whom would you rather be? The old Father or the Daughter?
.
Kid A wants top marks or grades - he gets a B+ and is crying
Kid B doesn't care - he gets a D and is so happy
Which one would you rather be? Kid A or B?
I bet most of you would choose the Daughter and Kid A - the unhappy ones!
Happiness is over-rated
.
Where would you find Jesus? Look for him in the Leper Colony!
People have parked Jesus in Heaven - enjoying the good life
But Jesus is more likely in Hell
God is not in Heaven, he is down here with us, sharing in our pain & suffering
.
That is the teaching of Reincarnation - the opposite of what the Buddha sought - it teaches a way IN to pain & suffering
.
At the end of the day God does not need to create a whole magic land where people get to just sit and enjoy the good life
Does a Tree suffer? No
Does a Rock Suffer? No
Do Ghost Suffer? No

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

It is sad that so many of us view God as our ticket to an everlasting life of ease & comfort - sadly, that is what we seek
It's either we go off to Heaven - enjoy the easy lazy good life - or - he is coming any day now and then what? Well, you guessed it -the easy good life, no worries, no sickness - everything wonderful
Pleasures of the flesh, the easy lazy life of no pain or suffering & God is our ticket
Sadly, Even Buddhists fell for this - the Buddha sought a way OUT of pain & suffering
The ancient Hindus tried to teach him that his quest was a lost cause, but he did not listen
He thought he found it by checking out of life - by rejecting desires
He was right - but he lost out on life also
And that is the downside of trying to get away from pain & suffering
It is not that difficult - just ignore all the pain & suffering around us, and we can be happy
A callous, uncaring person is happy, but the one who cares about others, sees the suffering of others is unhappy
.
An old man has Alzheimer's - he has lost his memory, but is not in pain - he is happy
His daughter sits by him, crying her eyes out because her own father does not recognize her
Whom would you rather be? The old Father or the Daughter?
.
Kid A wants top marks or grades - he gets a B+ and is crying
Kid B doesn't care - he gets a D and is so happy
Which one would you rather be? Kid A or B?
I bet most of you would choose the Daughter and Kid A - the unhappy ones!
Happiness is over-rated
.
Where would you find Jesus? Look for him in the Leper Colony!
People have parked Jesus in Heaven - enjoying the good life
But Jesus is more likely in Hell
God is not in Heaven, he is down here with us, sharing in our pain & suffering
.
That is the teaching of Reincarnation - the opposite of what the Buddha sought - it teaches a way IN to pain & suffering
.
At the end of the day God does not need to create a whole magic land where people get to just sit and enjoy the good life
Does a Tree suffer? No
Does a Rock Suffer? No
Do Ghost Suffer? No

Yoga vashistha please

 

[SalixIncendium]

It is sad that so many of us view God as our ticket to an everlasting life of ease & comfort - sadly, that is what we seek
It's either we go off to Heaven - enjoy the easy lazy good life - or - he is coming any day now and then what? Well, you guessed it -the easy good life, no worries, no sickness - everything wonderful
Pleasures of the flesh, the easy lazy life of no pain or suffering & God is our ticket
Sadly, Even Buddhists fell for this - the Buddha sought a way OUT of pain & suffering
The ancient Hindus tried to teach him that his quest was a lost cause, but he did not listen
He thought he found it by checking out of life - by rejecting desires
He was right - but he lost out on life also
And that is the downside of trying to get away from pain & suffering
It is not that difficult - just ignore all the pain & suffering around us, and we can be happy
A callous, uncaring person is happy, but the one who cares about others, sees the suffering of others is unhappy
.
An old man has Alzheimer's - he has lost his memory, but is not in pain - he is happy
His daughter sits by him, crying her eyes out because her own father does not recognize her
Whom would you rather be? The old Father or the Daughter?
.
Kid A wants top marks or grades - he gets a B+ and is crying
Kid B doesn't care - he gets a D and is so happy
Which one would you rather be? Kid A or B?
I bet most of you would choose the Daughter and Kid A - the unhappy ones!
Happiness is over-rated
.
Where would you find Jesus? Look for him in the Leper Colony!
People have parked Jesus in Heaven - enjoying the good life
But Jesus is more likely in Hell
God is not in Heaven, he is down here with us, sharing in our pain & suffering
.
That is the teaching of Reincarnation - the opposite of what the Buddha sought - it teaches a way IN to pain & suffering
.
At the end of the day God does not need to create a whole magic land where people get to just sit and enjoy the good life
Does a Tree suffer? No
Does a Rock Suffer? No
Do Ghost Suffer? No

This sort of confusion will happen when one tries to look at Hinduism and Buddhism through an Abrahamic lens.

 

[RamaRaksha]

This sort of confusion will happen when one tries to look at Hinduism and Buddhism through an Abrahamic lens.

Can you expand on that? The concept of a Heaven says we want a life without pain or suffering
That is what the Buddha sought -but he was not about running away to an afterlife - he was about how we can have a life without pain & suffering down here - unfortunately his solution was to not face down our problems but lay down our dreams, aspirations which usually lead to pain & suffering

 

[SalixIncendium]

Can you expand on that?

Sure.

You are applying the Abrahamic concept of Heaven to dharmic religions that have a different conception of heaven.

You are also arriving at the incorrect conclusion that dharmic religions teach some sort of escapism, which is a complete misrepresentation. Dharmic religions say nothing about living a life without pain. All are subject to karma. Dharmic religions teach one about reaction to pain, which can lead to various levels of suffering, or eliminate suffering entirely.

Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.

 

[RamaRaksha]

Sure.

You are applying the Abrahamic concept of Heaven to dharmic religions that have a different conception of heaven.

You are also arriving at the incorrect conclusion that dharmic religions teach some sort of escapism, which is a complete misrepresentation. Dharmic religions say nothing about living a life without pain. All are subject to karma. Dharmic religions teach one about reaction to pain, which can lead to various levels of suffering, or eliminate suffering entirely.

Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.

Let's not put all Dharmic religions in one basket
Hinduism preaches Reincarnation - come back to this harsh life - and that is life with pain which is what they tried to teach the Buddha
I talk about Reincarnation - I would never say Dharmic religions, specifically Hinduism, teach escapism - in fact the opposite is true
But people are another matter
Life is harsh, horrible and most people see God and their religion as a way out of all this & ignore what the religion is teaching them
People may read whatever they want to read in religion
Schopenhauer saw in Hinduism defeat, acceptance of life as it is, his student Nietzsche saw it completely differently - his Ubermensch or Superman was based on God Rama, in my opinion
.
"Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional."
That is deep, not sure I get it - a bit of a fine line there
When a team loses - they must feel the pain or suffering of that loss - otherwise they will never improve

 

[Valjean]

Then they should not have succumbed to the british or moguls.

Does a country's or religion's greatness derive from its political or military prowess?

 

[Valjean]

@RamaRaksha


This is helping me make more than one post to respond to your post.



What did Muslims think about Gandhiji and the thought of living with Hindus?

Did Gandhiji follow Sankara's philosophy? If so, what was it about Sankara philosophy that taught how Gandhiji thought and led? Was it mandatory that one be taught the Sankara philosophy, or could a person in India find a different philosophy to learn from?

Gandhi wasn't into the abstruse, Vedantic philosophy of Shankara. He was more a devout, popular Hindu and political activist. He treated the world as Real.

Gandhi promoted the peaceful coexistence of Hindus and Muslims. It was Jinnah and his Muslim league who stirred up the religious discord that eventually led to partition.

 

[RamaRaksha]

Not a reply to india being behind bangladesh in gdp per capita

The US is behind a whole bunch of countries when it comes to GDP per capita
The UK was once the leader of the world, today it is just another rich country - important but not the ruler of the world
I doubt anyone living in these countries are crying about it
I don't care about India being behind some other country
All I care about is whether India will become at least a middle income country by the time I die - that would be nice
We seem to have woken up at the wrong time - this climate change might yet kill us all before we can get there

 

[RamaRaksha]

Gandhi wasn't into the abstruse, Vedantic philosophy of Shankara. He was more a devout, popular Hindu and political activist. He treated the world as Real.

Gandhi promoted the peaceful coexistence of Hindus and Muslims. It was Jinnah and his Muslim league who stirred up the religious discord that eventually led to partition.

I am a big supporter of Gandhiji but when it came to partition I am glad that he lost
When we see how Muslims treat minorities in Pakistan and Bangladesh and basically in most Islamic countries - first of all, why are they Islamic countries? Shouldn't we all live in Secular countries? - I fear what they would do to minorities if India had stayed united and their numbers are far more than they are now
I see a Western media that is totally biased towards them
Pakistan held elections recently - all the articles were about who would win the election, the state of the economy, Imran Khan etc
Not one word on Minorities living as 2nd class citizens under Islamic laws, at any time blasphemy accusations mean a mob lynching, neighborhoods destroyed(that has happened but which this media does not report), young girls being abducted and sold off to old Muslim men
.
India is holding elections now
And EVERY one of the articles are about minorities - their suffering
An anecdote here, another there - this muslim said he was discriminated, that one said this happened to him and they have an article
Hard to believe but this media is actively trying to stoke religious hate

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

The US is behind a whole bunch of countries when it comes to GDP per capita
The UK was once the leader of the world, today it is just another rich country - important but not the ruler of the world
I doubt anyone living in these countries are crying about it
I don't care about India being behind some other country
All I care about is whether India will become at least a middle income country by the time I die - that would be nice
We seem to have woken up at the wrong time - this climate change might yet kill us all before we can get there

Wake up please. You have to care why bangladesh is ahead. We were ahead of china in 1965. Great performance.