‘Jesus was WITH GOD’ therefore Jesus WAS GOD?

[dybmh]

It’s easy to say (sadly) because it is what you express in your presentations.

Here is one example of what you said:

• “The way I understand it, the author of Gospel of John would assert that Jesus is a higher source: direct, no interference, a perfect channel. Most prophecy in the OT is the holy spirit resting on them. That is not a perfect channel. The exceptions would be Moses and Bilam.”

OK, so, I'm talking about the OT, which is what you asked about. See below:

So if Jesus was THE WORD that God spoke… what was different about God speaking through Jesus (Old Testament to New Testament)?

Then I said: "Most prophecy in the OT is the holy spirit resting on them." So, when comparing OT to NT, I'm making a statement about the OT here.

The Holy Spirit (I say, ‘Spirit of God’, which is the correct description) ALSO RESTED ON JESUS:

• ‘And I did not know Him, but He who sent me to baptize with water said to me, ‘The One upon whom you see the Spirit descending and abiding on Him, this is the One who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’ (John 1:33)
• “For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God gives the Spirit without limit.” (John 3:34)

OK. Thank you. You're answering with the NT description, not an OT description. And yes, I missed this detail where the spirit descended when Jesus was baptized.

So, the SOURCE of the word of God is FROM GOD, YHWH, the Father. Jesus is NOT, himself, the higher source. He himself says:

• “For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.” (John 12:49)
• “My teaching is not my own. It comes from the one who sent me.” (John 7:16)

Yes. If I made a mistake it's only by leaving off a few words in my statement, which I thought would have been understood based on my previous reply.

"the author of Gospel of John would assert that Jesus is a higher source: direct, no interference, a perfect channel of God's will."

Which is what I said in my previous reply.

"The word itself is a vessel, a vector, for divine influence which has no will of its own. It carries and expresses the divine will which is delivered to it."

• “For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.” (John 12:49)
  • a direct, no interference, a perfect channel of God's will
• “My teaching is not my own. It comes from the one who sent me.” (John 7:16)
  • direct, no interference, a perfect channel of God's will

Is that better? More correct? What other problems did you see in my post?

 

[dybmh]

thanks for the reply, but what other important TRUTHS?

101G.

All of the things we have been arguing about in previous discussions. The enduring law, the eternal priesthood, the endtime prophecy, etc.

 

[Soapy]

why do you think silly like that? is not Jesus God, (Spirit), one person? who holds both titles of Father/Ordinal First, and the title Son/the Ordinal Last? was not the JESUS in heaven and on earth at the same time? let's see. while talking to a Pharisees, named Nicodemus on Earth in flesh, was he not in heaven, (Spirit), at the very same time? John 3:13 "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven." so, how is that modalism?

that's not what 101G believes..... (smile). a word of advice.... "quit listening to IGNORANT men, and hear and listen to Almighty God".

well Good for you then.

well that just put you into the same groups u deny. so, you're no different from them..... YIKES!

and that's where your mistake came in at which is of the devil.

How IGNORANT. you're worst oof than the trinitarians in understanding God.

well lets see who is lying, and grieving the Spirit.

question, "who MADE ALL THINGS?" this is a simple and stright forward question. scripture,

Isaiah 44:24 "Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;"

so the "LORD", the One who you calls the Father correct. now this,

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:2 "The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."

this is the "Lord" the Word, who is Jesus the Christ.

now Soapy tell us is this the same ONE "PERSON" who ... "MADE ALL THINGS", or is this two separate and distinct PERSONS who Made all Things?

your answer Please.

101G.

No, 101G, almighty God; YHWH; the Father, made all things.

And this same YHWH created a man who He directed an angel to tell the mother-to-be to call the child Jesus. Jesus was not what God told the Angel to tell the mother, nor did the angel tell the mother this. The name YHWH told the Angel to tell the mother was akin to ‘JOSHUA’ (which is like ‘Yeshua’, in Hebrew). The names ‘Joshua’ and how in western language we say, ‘Jesus’ (for unknown reason!! Or do we know the reason?) both hold the exact same meaning, ‘He who saves his people’.

Joshua, in the Old Testament, was the prophet who led the children of the Israelites into the promised land… future echoing ‘Jesus’ leading the children of God into the paradise world.

In both cases, GOD CHOSE the person, the man, Joshua, and his namesake, the man, ‘Jesus’, to carry out that task. God ANOINTED the man, (I’ll just say, ‘Jesus’ now) at the river Jordan and adopted him in spirit as ‘Son of God’:

• “You know what has happened throughout the province of Judea, beginning in Galilee after the baptism that John preached how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.” (Acts 10:37-38)

And Jesus, himself, declares the act that God performed towards himself:

• “what about the one [Jesus] whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world?” (John 10:36)

You say Jesus is God and the Father - but Jesus says that the Father chose him from among men (consecrated him, set him apart, anointed him) as HIS (the Father’s) very own (As a Son) - which is echoed in this verse:

• “…Christ did not take on himself the glory of becoming a high priest. But God said to him, “You are my Son; today I have become your Father.” (Hebrews 5:5)

An adoption statement: ‘You are now my son; this day I have become your Father!’

How is Jesus, God, when God is the one who adopts the man (Jesus) as his spiritual Son?

Are you using ‘ChatGPT’ to write your posts?

 

[Soapy]

OK, so, I'm talking about the OT, which is what you asked about. See below:



Then I said: "Most prophecy in the OT is the holy spirit resting on them." So, when comparing OT to NT, I'm making a statement about the OT here.

Yes, maybe I missed the precise point. But my question was regarding claims that Jesus was in the Old Testament as the word of God… trinity claim (of was of just 101G - who seems adamant to express completely false ideologies for his own amusement!)

You correctly state that the word of God came down through the prophets in the O.T., but came down through Jesus in the N.T.

Yes, Jesus expressed God’s words exactly… hence the Jesus is correctly called ‘The word of God’ - but note that the book of John DOES NOT state ‘WORD OF GOD’, but only ‘The Word’. The ONLY reference to Jesus being ‘WORD OF GOD’ is in the book of Revelation. Trinitarians read this TITLE and BACK-LABELLED IT into the book of John.

The truth is that ‘GOD CREATED ALL THINGS BY HIS WORD’… and as we just stated, the word of God is the SPIRIT OF GOD…

‘Let there be… ’… is that not “GOD’s WORD that created …’?

There is Nothing that was created except that which was created by the word of God: ‘Let there be…!’

OK. Thank you. You're answering with the NT description, not an OT description. And yes, I missed this detail where the spirit descended when Jesus was baptized.



Yes. If I made a mistake it's only by leaving off a few words in my statement, which I thought would have been understood based on my previous reply.

"the author of Gospel of John would assert that Jesus is a higher source: direct, no interference, a perfect channel of God's will."

Which is what I said in my previous reply.

"The word itself is a vessel, a vector, for divine influence which has no will of its own. It carries and expresses the divine will which is delivered to it."

• “For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.” (John 12:49)
  • a direct, no interference, a perfect channel of God's will
• “My teaching is not my own. It comes from the one who sent me.” (John 7:16)
  • direct, no interference, a perfect channel of God's will

Is that better? More correct? What other problems did you see in my post?

Well, thank you for being honest with the parts you erred on. Most people in this (and virtually all) forum would spin a yarn trying to claim they didn’t err!!

‘A perfect channel’, is correct.

Moses struck the rock even though God told him to ‘Speak’ to it… He also got angry and killed man and then ran away before God called him back into service. Abraham lied about Sarah because he feared Pharoah and also wrongly listened to his wife by taking a servant to make s child after god had already promised him one by Sarah. David killed many men and also directed the killing of one of his own in order to obtain the man’s wife. Solomon took (too) many wives and did not manage them to the extent that he gave in to one of them and worshipped her pagan God. Many more scriptures show flaws in the prophets.

 

[SDavis]

This should be a very short debate:

• If Jesus was ‘WITH God’ how could he ‘BE GOD’?
• Who is ‘GOD’ that Jesus was ‘WITH’?

God our Father is who Jesus was WITH.

Scripture says the Word was with God and the Word was God. It uses WITH and AND interchangeably.

How - here's one way

Cloning: MedlinePlus

Cloning is the process of creating an exact genetic replica of a cell, tissue or organism. Learn about the types and uses in medicine.

medlineplus.gov

Man has the ability to clone, make exact copies of a living creature. Think of what a deity who has existed for eternity could do. If it took man, according to science, a few million years (theory of evolution) to come from using stones to their technology of today _ what could an entity who is not of this Earth accomplish? And do so supernaturally, in a way that's unnatural to man, and a way that man could not even comprehend.

So yes Jesus could be God _ was God _ is God

 

[dybmh]

Yes, maybe I missed the precise point. But my question was regarding claims that Jesus was in the Old Testament as the word of God… trinity claim (of was of just 101G - who seems adamant to express completely false ideologies for his own amusement!)

You correctly state that the word of God came down through the prophets in the O.T., but came down through Jesus in the N.T.

Yes, Jesus expressed God’s words exactly… hence the Jesus is correctly called ‘The word of God’ - but note that the book of John DOES NOT state ‘WORD OF GOD’, but only ‘The Word’. The ONLY reference to Jesus being ‘WORD OF GOD’ is in the book of Revelation. Trinitarians read this TITLE and BACK-LABELLED IT into the book of John.

The truth is that ‘GOD CREATED ALL THINGS BY HIS WORD’… and as we just stated, the word of God is the SPIRIT OF GOD…

‘Let there be… ’… is that not “GOD’s WORD that created …’?

There is Nothing that was created except that which was created by the word of God: ‘Let there be…!’

OK. Your question is regarding claims that Jesus was in the Old Testament as the word of God. Yes. I think I understand that. And I'd like to try to address that issue.

I propose that God's creating did not end in Gen 1. Every revelation, blessing, curse, law, judgement, all of it is itself a creation. These creations while not written in the form of "Let there be ..." still descend from God and are expressed by God in a similar manner as divine speech.

"By the word of the Lord were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth."

And

"For ever, O Lord, your word is fixed in heaven.
Your faithfulness endures to all generations; you have established the earth, and it stands firm.
They continue this day according to your ordinances; for all are your servants."

These verses expand on the concept of God's word as the vehicle for all creation, and also for maintaining all of creation. "They continue this day according to your ordinances; for all are your servants." They continue ( all the generations, and the earth ), according to your ordinances ( God's laws, decisions, expressed-will, which is: the word which is fixed in heaven ); for all ( that's every thing, that's all of creation ) are your servants."

If so, then, the word is expressing God's will continuously from the beginning in Gen 1, all the way to the end of Malachi. This especially includes every miracle and divine revelation. To be clear, it's all God's will. It's not the word's will. The word doesn't have a will. But God's will is coming through the word. So, I hear Christians talk about the cloud of glory? Also any angel making an appearance? Even the voice of God that Abraham hears? All of those are the word of God, which isn't literally the word "Let there be ...", but it's simply the channel for God's will interacting with the material world.

Good so far? Objections?

 

[Wandering Monk]

This should be a very short debate:

• If Jesus was ‘WITH God’ how could he ‘BE GOD’?
• Who is ‘GOD’ that Jesus was ‘WITH’?

Odd that his brothers James and Jude say nothing about Jesus' divinity in their epistles.

 

[101G]

All of the things we have been arguing about in previous discussions. The enduring law, the eternal priesthood, the endtime prophecy, etc.

(smile)... ok.
The enduring law... it was added. Galatians 3:19 "Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator." Abraham got the promise of Life by "FAITH". Galatians 3:20 "Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one." Galatians 3:21 "Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law." (READ THAT AGAIN). Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe." Galatians 3:23 "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed." Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith." Galatians 3:25 "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster." Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus."

now as said about the Law. so also the priesthood. Psalms 110:4 "The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek." THIS PRIEST AFTER MELCHIZEDEK WILL BUILD THE TEMPLE OF THE LORD. let's see from the OT. Zechariah 6:12 "And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:" (STOP, WHO WILL BUILD THE TEMPLE OF THE LORD? ... THE MAN WHO IS THE BRANCK, JESUS THE CHRIST, SHILOH). Zechariah 6:13 "Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both."

this priest is also KING... Uh O read Zechariah 6:13 again. and the temple that he is building is a Spiritual in Nature. never to be destroyed .. EVER.

let's see it. Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." it can never be destroyed.

Zechariah testifies to the Psalms. it's inescapable the branch is to build the Temple, not YOU. that's scripture out of your Tanaka. the command is for the BRANCH to build the Temple, not with HUMAN hands, but with hands eternal.

you see my brother, our bodies are this temple, waiting for the redemption to put on eternity. and our bodies come from heaven, and are not earthly.

we suggest you read those scriptures above.

101G.

 

[101G]

No, 101G, almighty God; YHWH; the Father, made all things.

well U are not reading your bible, John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:2 "The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."

so, try again.

101G.

 

[101G]

to all,
people, the term "WITH" do not mean a separate and distinct person of God, no. listen, Isaiah 41:4 "Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he."
this one person the "FIRST", the LORD is "WITH" the last... correct, sound like two persons... correct? ... WRONG. listen and learn. Isaiah 48:12 "Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last." BINGO, it's the same one person.... he also is the Last, same one person.... "shared in the ECHAD of the Godhead. ... THINK ABOUT IT

101G

 

[dybmh]

(smile)... ok.
The enduring law... it was added. Galatians 3:19 "Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator." Abraham got the promise of Life by "FAITH". Galatians 3:20 "Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one." Galatians 3:21 "Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law." (READ THAT AGAIN). Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe." Galatians 3:23 "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed." Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith." Galatians 3:25 "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster." Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus."

now as said about the Law. so also the priesthood. Psalms 110:4 "The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek." THIS PRIEST AFTER MELCHIZEDEK WILL BUILD THE TEMPLE OF THE LORD. let's see from the OT. Zechariah 6:12 "And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:" (STOP, WHO WILL BUILD THE TEMPLE OF THE LORD? ... THE MAN WHO IS THE BRANCK, JESUS THE CHRIST, SHILOH). Zechariah 6:13 "Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both."

this priest is also KING... Uh O read Zechariah 6:13 again. and the temple that he is building is a Spiritual in Nature. never to be destroyed .. EVER.

let's see it. Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." it can never be destroyed.

Zechariah testifies to the Psalms. it's inescapable the branch is to build the Temple, not YOU. that's scripture out of your Tanaka. the command is for the BRANCH to build the Temple, not with HUMAN hands, but with hands eternal.

you see my brother, our bodies are this temple, waiting for the redemption to put on eternity. and our bodies come from heaven, and are not earthly.

we suggest you read those scriptures above.

101G.

The entire nation will be priests in the end of days:

​

Exodus 19:5-6​

​

Now therefore, if you will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then you shall be my own treasure among all peoples; for all the earth is mine;​

And you shall be to me a kingdom of priests, and a holy nation. These are the words which you shall speak to the people of Israel.​

And Galatians doesn't have authority to change the law. We've been though this, and you said you understood.

 

[101G]

Now therefore, if you will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant,

which you didn't keep.... Hello...... listen, Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:" Jeremiah 31:32 "Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:"

so, you cannot use that anymore..

And Galatians doesn't have authority to change the law. We've been though this, and you said you understood.

I know. God changed the Priesthood, from which the Law was Given. so you cannot use that either.

now what? no more excuses. if you all build a temple for the LORD you will be violating God own command. meaning you will be in disobedience. and the prophet Sameul by God said, "Obedience is better than sacrifice". so, you want to try something else?

101G.

 

[dybmh]

which you didn't keep.... Hello...... listen, Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:" Jeremiah 31:32 "Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:"

Leviticus 26:44-45

And yet for all that, when they are in the land of their enemies, I will not cast them away, nor will I loathe them, to destroy them utterly, and to break my covenant with them; for I am the Lord their God.

But I will for their sakes remember the covenant of their ancestors, whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt in the sight of the nations, that I might be their God; I am the Lord.

Job 22:23

If you return to the Almighty, you shall be built up, you shall put away iniquity far from your tent.

Deuteronomy 30:1-2

And it shall come to pass, when all these things have come upon you, the blessing and the curse, which I have set before you, and you shall call them to mind among all the nations, where the Lord your God has driven you,
And shall return to the Lord your God, and shall obey his voice according to all that I command you this day, you and your children, with all your heart, and with all your soul;
That then the Lord your God will turn your captivity, and have compassion upon you, and will return and gather you from all the nations, where the Lord your God has scattered you.

so, you cannot use that anymore..

God remembers, we can always return to the covenant, and we will be a holy nation of priests.

 

[dybmh]

I know. God changed the Priesthood, from which the Law was Given. so you cannot use that either.

I have yet to see this in writing.

now what? no more excuses. if you all build a temple for the LORD you will be violating God own command. meaning you will be in disobedience. and the prophet Sameul by God said, "Obedience is better than sacrifice". so, you want to try something else?

Building the temple is not violating a command. Isaiah said it will happen, there's nothing that can stop it.

 

[Soapy]

God our Father is who Jesus was WITH.

Scripture says the Word was with God and the Word was God. It uses WITH and AND interchangeably.

How - here's one way

Cloning: MedlinePlus

Cloning is the process of creating an exact genetic replica of a cell, tissue or organism. Learn about the types and uses in medicine.

medlineplus.gov

Man has the ability to clone, make exact copies of a living creature. Think of what a deity who has existed for eternity could do. If it took man, according to science, a few million years (theory of evolution) to come from using stones to their technology of today _ what could an entity who is not of this Earth accomplish? And do so supernaturally, in a way that's unnatural to man, and a way that man could not even comprehend.

So yes Jesus could be God _ was God _ is God

You are forgetting one major critical aspect: God was alone - by himself - ‘Besides me there is no other God’.

But you are saying that Jesus was God who was with the Father, who is God. That is a contradiction.

Moreover, you are talking about cloning! Why would God clone himself as a spirit being?
Indeed, God’s creation did included a ‘clone’- man, in His image!

And God created spirit beings: Angels.

So, I think you missed the mark. This is normal though as every trinitarian who has ever tried to justify trinity which is ‘Jesus is that WORD’ in John 1:1 that was WITH GOD, has had to screw with truth and reality, ignore obvious conundrums, and deluded themselves because they’d church leaders have told them a believable (to them) lie.

No! One entity cannot BE WITH another entity AND also BE that entity it is WITH.

The saying: ‘Straining at a gnat while swallowing an elephant’ is so true. The gnat is the truth and the elephant is the big fat lie!!

 

[Soapy]

OK. Your question is regarding claims that Jesus was in the Old Testament as the word of God. Yes. I think I understand that. And I'd like to try to address that issue.

I propose that God's creating did not end in Gen 1. Every revelation, blessing, curse, law, judgement, all of it is itself a creation. These creations while not written in the form of "Let there be ..." still descend from God and are expressed by God in a similar manner as divine speech.

"By the word of the Lord were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth."

And

"For ever, O Lord, your word is fixed in heaven.
Your faithfulness endures to all generations; you have established the earth, and it stands firm.
They continue this day according to your ordinances; for all are your servants."

These verses expand on the concept of God's word as the vehicle for all creation, and also for maintaining all of creation. "They continue this day according to your ordinances; for all are your servants." They continue ( all the generations, and the earth ), according to your ordinances ( God's laws, decisions, expressed-will, which is: the word which is fixed in heaven ); for all ( that's every thing, that's all of creation ) are your servants."

If so, then, the word is expressing God's will continuously from the beginning in Gen 1, all the way to the end of Malachi. This especially includes every miracle and divine revelation. To be clear, it's all God's will. It's not the word's will. The word doesn't have a will. But God's will is coming through the word. So, I hear Christians talk about the cloud of glory? Also any angel making an appearance? Even the voice of God that Abraham hears? All of those are the word of God, which isn't literally the word "Let there be ...", but it's simply the channel for God's will interacting with the material world.

Good so far? Objections?

No objections.

By the way, it is not me saying that Jesus was the word with God. I am asking those who DO THINK SO to justify their belief… clearly, you are not of such persons.

I agree with verses such as:

• “6By the word of the YHWH the heavens were made, their starry host by the breath of his mouth. 7He gathers the waters of the sea into jars; he puts the deep into storehouses. 8Let all the earth fear the YHWH; let all the people of the world revere him. 9For he spoke, and it came to be; he commanded, and it stood firm.” (Psalm 33:6-8)

These verses clearly state that it was YHWH who created all things - but Trinitarians and modalist etc., will use the ALTERNATIVE to YHWH, ‘LORD’, so they can claim it was Jesus… of course, you and I know that ‘LORD’ is ‘YHWH’, and not ‘Lord’, which is a title, not a name.

The verses clearly show that it is the Father, YHWH, who said, ‘Let there be…’ and it was: ‘By His word’ - ‘The breath of His mouth’.

So where did the idea that Jesus was WITH GOD come from - clearly not from scriptures. And certainly nothing that is expressed in the Old Testament.

Im challenging responders to show how they come to their conclusion of what is not there - their elusion!

 

[Soapy]

to all,
people, the term "WITH" do not mean a separate and distinct person of God, no. listen, Isaiah 41:4 "Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he."
this one person the "FIRST", the LORD is "WITH" the last... correct, sound like two persons... correct? ... WRONG. listen and learn. Isaiah 48:12 "Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last." BINGO, it's the same one person.... he also is the Last, same one person.... "shared in the ECHAD of the Godhead. ... THINK ABOUT IT

101G

‘First and Last’ just means ‘Only’, ‘The only one’.

 

[Soapy]

well U are not reading your bible, John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:2 "The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."

so, try again.

101G.

John 1:1 is not speaking about Jesus. Where are you getting your nonsense from?

6By the word of the Lord the heavens were made,​

their starry host by the breath of his mouth.​

7He gathers the waters of the sea into jars a ;​

he puts the deep into storehouses.​

8Let all the earth fear the Lord;​

let all the people of the world revere him.​

9For he spoke, and it came to be;​

he commanded, and it stood firm” (Psalm 33:6-8)​

101G, show me from the verses above where you see Jesus?

 

[101G]

Leviticus 26:44-45

And yet for all that, when they are in the land of their enemies, I will not cast them away, nor will I loathe them, to destroy them utterly, and to break my covenant with them; for I am the Lord their God.

(smile), LOL, what will they do for a Klondike Bar. now read the conditions for this. Leviticus 26:41 "And that I also have walked contrary unto them, and have brought them into the land of their enemies; if then their uncircumcised hearts be humbled, and they then accept of the punishment of their iniquity:" that's the condition, see God told them... You to circumcise your hearts and be humbled. Deuteronomy 10:16 "Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked." see, you all was not. and also as said that was under the OLD COVENANT. Leviticus 26:46 "These are the statutes and judgments and laws, which the LORD made between him and the children of Israel in mount Sinai by the hand of Moses." YIKES! now we have a NEW COVENANT. so you cannot used that either.your law and OT covenant testify against you. but let's hear what you must do.

Joel 2:32 "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call."

now who "NAME" do one call on to be delivered? Acts 4:10 "Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole." Acts 4:11 "This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner." Acts 4:12 "Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved."

"Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel" now you know too.

Job 22:23

If you return to the Almighty, you shall be built up, you shall put away iniquity far from your tent.

but did you? no, see Jeremiah 31:31-32

Deuteronomy 30:1-2

see above

God remembers, we can always return to the covenant, and we will be a holy nation of priests.

not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, by accepting your redemption in Christ Jesus.... until then .... you're still in your sins.

101G.

 

[101G]

I have yet to see this in writing.

STOP, are you hard of hearing? or still stiffed-necked just as the LORD said. Deuteronomy 10:16 "Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked." see, you have not changed. now for the LAST TIME. Psalms 110:4 "The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek." READ HEBREWS CHAPTER 5-CHAPTER 8.

now, 101G will not say anything else unto you about the order of Melchizedek, for you have been told.

Building the temple is not violating a command. Isaiah said it will happen, there's nothing that can stop it.

LOL, LOL, LOL, the temple been under construction since the day of Pentecost... lol, lol, and is ongoing even as we speak.....(smile), lol, Oh dear, those who love darkness still cannot see... Oh well.

101G.