It is really weird and troubling that someone would bring up the death penalty as a way of justifying the government getting involved in medical decisions.
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“Let the states decide.”
- Thread starter an anarchist
- Start date
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
I didn't bring it up as a way of justifying the government getting involved.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
Legally that is well defined again, it is a medical term though many seem to add all sorts of baggage to it.
abortion
Abortion is the voluntary termination of a pregnancy. In 2022, nearly 50 years after Roe v. Wade changed the legal status of abortion by striking down a Texas law that criminalized abortion except as a means of saving the life of the pregnant person, the United States Supreme Court in Dobbs v. Jackson Women's Health Organization held that abortion is not a fundamental right under the US Constitution, clearing the way for states to pass laws restricting abortions that would have to withstand only rational-basis review when challenged in courts.
If you oppose what would be needed to make the thing happen, then you oppose the thing.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
You don't have to, just be a reasonably informed citizen.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Good. I am reasonably informed but I don't pay attention to memes.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
I don't think that a larger goverment is what we need at all.
Medical definition of abortion:
Abortion is the termination of a pregnancy before the fetus can survive outside the uterus. It can occur spontaneously, known as a miscarriage, or be induced intentionally through medical or surgical procedures.
Abortion
Abortion is the termination of a pregnancy before the fetus can survive outside the uterus. It can occur spontaneously, known as a miscarriage, or be induced intentionally through medical or surgical procedures.
www.yalemedicine.org
So why did you bring it up? Was it just a non-sequitur?
Pogo
Well-Known Member
You don't pay attention to them, you recognize when repetition of certain ideas become one.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
I believe I am reasonably informed but I pay no attention to memes or Trump.
Maybe you've been hanging out here too long. And maybe I am too removed from politics but people around here don't talk much about politics and I am pretty busy with real life. (And some of my best friends are Democrats!)
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
First of all, you never identified which women you were talking about. Now you reveal that the group of women you were talking about believe that the fetus is "more than just a piece of tissue". That would seem to describe pretty much all women, whether they feel they need an abortion or not.
But I'm guessing that you are thinking of those women who oppose abortion for other women, not just themselves. How are they not being represented? That is the question I was asking.
If you believe that the anti-abortion women can only be represented by getting their wish for other women not to have abortions, would that not then make the women who want to have an abortion "not represented"? If you are concerned about one group of women not being represented, then how would it help to take away the representation of the other group? Or is it just that you are only concerned about the representation of one specific group of women and not the other? Can you clarify?
Huh??? Why would this have anything to do with the level of government that ought to have the power to take away a woman's right to control her own health and manage her condition of pregnancy?
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
Another cryptic response for me to puzzle out. Whose lives? The mother's? The fetus's?
Sometimes the lives of women are put at risk to save a nonviable fetus simply because doctors are uncertain of the legality of treating a pregnant woman. I have no doubt that you want everyone to live, but there are so many ways that these laws can end up killing when they take choices away from pregnant women and medical professionals. I understand that you disapprove of the choices that most women seeking an abortion make. You've made that clear. But the only way you can achieve your goal seems to be by having the government force women to carry their pregnancies to term. By taking away their control over their bodies, once they find themselves in a condition of pregnancy. Even when the law carves out exceptions to abortion bans, doctors tend to be uncertain about the legality going ahead with an abortion, especially if some court might later decide that they made the wrong judgement. Better for them to err on the side of caution, but not for the pregnant woman.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Um those women are referencing to would be what you would call a pro-lifer being you're not familiar with the term. You're welcome.
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
Please make a greater effort to write in coherent English. I get from this that you prefer me to use the label "pro-Life", even though the label is quite inaccurate.
And "perfect"...."getting there".
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Maybe in the future you could do some sensible comments for a change instead of this unintelligible b******* you're spewing out.
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
If you had some sensible reply to my posts, you wouldn't need to resort to childish insults. Let's try to stay on topic.
Do you want the states to be able to decide to prosecute women for having a miscarriage? It's happened in Ohio:
apnews.com
and in Oklahoma:
www.bbc.com
www.kswo.com
And in Alabama:
www.themarshallproject.org
Texas charges women with murder for taking misoprostol:
apnews.com
and many others:
www.themarshallproject.org
A Black woman was criminally charged after a miscarriage. It shows the perils of pregnancy post-Roe
A Black Ohio woman who miscarried in her bathroom has been charged with abuse of a corpse. Thirty-three-year-old Brittany Watts, of Warren, awaits grand jury action.
US women are being jailed for having miscarriages
More and more American women are facing prison for allegedly harming their unborn baby by using drugs.
Lawton woman arrested in connection to death of newborn baby
A Lawton woman has been arrested and charged with manslaughter for the death of her newborn baby in late 2019.
She Lost Her Baby, Then Her Freedom
In its war on drugs, Alabama targets moms.
Texas woman's lawsuit after being jailed on murder charge over abortion can proceed, judge rules
A federal judge has ruled that a Texas woman who was jailed and charged with murder over self-managing an abortion in 2022 can move forward with her lawsuit. U.S.
and many others:
They Lost Their Pregnancies. Then Prosecutors Sent Them to Prison.
Dozens of women who used drugs while pregnant have faced criminal charges. Experts expect even more cases now that Roe has been overturned.
Texas is suing against the shield law that protects women's medical records when they go out of state for an abortion: is it that State's right to pursue someone for legal activity in another state? Article from Sept 6, 2024. So much for the argument that you can go to where the laws suit you. Texas obviously does not agree with that argument. Slaves can't wander off the plantation.
apnews.com
Texas sues to stop a rule that shields the medical records of women who seek abortions elsewhere
Texas is suing to try to block a federal rule that shields the medical records of women from criminal investigations if they cross state lines to get an abortion where it is legal.
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