126,000 babies died today.

[nutshell]

I never once said, nor even hinted that right-to-lifers do not speak out about divorce, adultry, etc.
I never once stated nor even hinted that theyare not concerned about it either.

I did say that they make a much bigger fuss over abortion than all those things combined.
Which is true.
So how is that 'stereotyping?'

You're assuming all of us make a bigger fuss over abortion than all those things combined.

Anyway - no skin off my nose. I just call it like I see it.

 

[McBell]

You're assuming all of us make a bigger fuss over abortion than all those things combined.

Anyway - no skin off my nose. I just call it like I see it.

I see.
You are assuming that I am speaking of each and every right-to-lifer individually instead of the right-to-lifer group.

 

[Gentoo]

How is that not birth control? Even if it is back-up to your planned birth control, it is still serving the same purpose. If you don't want children, why not get your tubes tied or have your husband/boyfriend get his tied off?

Because as Danisty has said a couple of times on the forum already that some doctors won't perform sterilization unless you already have children. Their reasoning is that they could "change their mind". So there are still snags in the sterlization methods.

 

[Gentoo]

How do you practice "safer sex"?

I heard that it's now called safer sex, because no sex is completely safe from both pregnancy or STI's. It's the usual stuff: condoms (both male and female), cervical cap, sponges, IUD's, the pills etc.

 

[nutshell]

I heard that it's now called safer sex, because no sex is completely safe from both pregnancy or STI's. It's the usual stuff: condoms (both male and female), cervical cap, sponges, IUD's, the pills etc.

Are you using all of the above and using it correctly?

 

[Ðanisty]

What do you attribute your lack of value for human life to? Help me understand why I shouldn't care about an unborn human.

I value you the life of those who have been born. I just don't value you the life of a fetus. I doubt I could give you any kind of answer that would help you understand. It's not like something I had to think about. I've just never cared. On the same token, I will never understand your value of the fetus. I cannot fathom how it is more important than the mother.

The pro-choice movement isn't trying to reduce abortions. That is a PR campaign they've cooked up because they are trying to appeal to religious people. The goal of the pro-choice movement is easy, open and unrestricted access to abortions for anyone at anytime in anyway.

What? The pro-choice movement is trying to reduce abortions by reducing unwanted pregnancy in the first place. The pro-choice movement is addressing the cause rather than just the symptom.

I'm not, at all. I find it very irresponsible that some people do this. What I'm advocating is the right to do with my body as I see fit. If I practice safer sex and it fails (as it's almost bound to, since most contraceptives are not 100% effective) the thought of being forced to carry to term frightens me to my very core. I'm trying to avoid this as much as possible. Abortion may not be the right answer, but it's still AN answer, and that's what I want to keep: the option, whether or not I choose to use it.

It terrifies me too Gentoo. I would get an abortion even if it weren't legal. I'd find a way....go to another country...something.

Because as Danisty has said a couple of times on the forum already that some doctors won't perform sterilization unless you already have children. Their reasoning is that they could "change their mind". So there are still snags in the sterlization methods.

Not to mention that sterilization isn't 100% effective either.

 

[Gentoo]

Are you using all of the above and using it correctly?

All of the above? No, but we are the "perfect users" (according to statistics) of the methods we choose to use.

 

[jonny]

What? The pro-choice movement is trying to reduce abortions by reducing unwanted pregnancy in the first place. The pro-choice movement is addressing the cause rather than just the symptom.

Unfortunately, the pro-choice movement is adamantly opposed to the #1 way that unwanted pregnancies can be avoided - abstinence before marriage and fidelity within marriage. Once you are married there is still the possibility of an unwanted pregnancy, but the probability of such goes way down.

The campaign to reduce the number of abortions is great, but we should be looking to eliminate abortions - not reduce them.

 

[McBell]

Unfortunately, the pro-choice movement is adamantly opposed to the #1 way that unwanted pregnancies can be avoided - abstinence before marriage and fidelity within marriage. Once you are married there is still the possibility of an unwanted pregnancy, but the probability of such goes way down.

The campaign to reduce the number of abortions is great, but we should be looking to eliminate abortions - not reduce them.

You are not going to eliminate abortions.
Period.
So why set yourselves up for failure from the onset?

 

[Ðanisty]

Unfortunately, the pro-choice movement is adamantly opposed to the #1 way that unwanted pregnancies can be avoided - abstinence before marriage and fidelity within marriage. Once you are married there is still the possibility of an unwanted pregnancy, but the probability of such goes way down.

The campaign to reduce the number of abortions is great, but we should be looking to eliminate abortions - not reduce them.

The pro-choice movement is not adamantly opposed to abstinence before marriage or fidelity within marriage. The pro-choice movement makes no stand either way on that.

 

[jonny]

The pro-choice movement is not adamantly opposed to abstinence before marriage or fidelity within marriage. The pro-choice movement makes no stand either way on that.

I disagree, but this is off the topic of the thread so we'll just leave it at that.

 

[jonny]

You are not going to eliminate abortions.
Period.
So why set yourselves up for failure from the onset?

We're not going to eliminate rape, so why do we try?
We're not going to eliminate murder, so why do we try?
We're not going to eliminate child abuse, so why do we try?

Eliminating something sick and evil can be difficult or impossible, but there is no good reason why we shouldn't try.

 

[The Seeker]

Unfortunately, the pro-choice movement is adamantly opposed to the #1 way that unwanted pregnancies can be avoided - abstinence before marriage and fidelity within marriage. Once you are married there is still the possibility of an unwanted pregnancy, but the probability of such goes way down.

The campaign to reduce the number of abortions is great, but we should be looking to eliminate abortions - not reduce them.

Since when has the pro-choice camp endorsed premarital sex and adultery? People who are pro-choice merely want the government to stay out of this matter and allow a woman to choose what she wants to do with her fetus/baby.

Also, eliminating abortions is as realistic as eliminating drug use. There will always be someone who will get pregnant and want to terminate the pregnancy for some reason or another.

If abortion were to be illegal, people would still find ways to terminate their pregnancy. Many of those ways aren't safe (using a coat hanger, going to another country, etc.) IMO it's better for abortion to be legal so that those who choose this option can have it done safely.

 

[Darkness]

What do you attribute your lack of value for human life to? Help me understand why I shouldn't care about an unborn human.

Because the unborn human has no method of feeling concious thought. The organs required to produce those are not developed yet. Can you tell me why we should value an unborn human? (Don't simply say because it is a baby).

 

[angellous_evangellous]

That is shameful

The high abortion rate among Christians is due to, IMHO, the fact that many Christians who have extramarital sex do not use contraception and then fear the stigma and shame of illegitimate children. An abortion is very tempting in these circumstances.

 

[McBell]

We're not going to eliminate rape, so why do we try?
We're not going to eliminate murder, so why do we try?
We're not going to eliminate child abuse, so why do we try?

Eliminating something sick and evil can be difficult or impossible, but there is no good reason why we shouldn't try.

Nice strawman.

 

[Mathematician]

We're not going to eliminate rape, so why do we try?
We're not going to eliminate murder, so why do we try?
We're not going to eliminate child abuse, so why do we try?

Eliminating something sick and evil can be difficult or impossible, but there is no good reason why we shouldn't try.

If we legalized any of those, not only would the crimes increase but society would experience total anarchy. Abortion has an opposite effect. Legalized abortion provides mothers with life-saving procedures, as well as the ability to speak openly about the action without fear of going to jail [or, as some would demand, being put to death].

Also, we're in a disagreement over how terrible abortion is. I don't agree with comparing abortion to anything having to do with harming a person. Though I do have to ask, do you consider a human corpse a person?