Luther did remove some parts to make a Protestant Bible. He removed 7 books from the original.
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A ground-zero position when talking about the Bible
- Thread starter David Young
- Start date
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
It's definitely been refined over the years. Lots of changes and redactions have likely eliminated the orginal in ways that its just not recoverable anymore.
Neither for religious or historical/archeological purposes.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Been there, done that, and ironically reading the Bible--actually reading it instead of looking at what the Pastor said to read--during a crises of faith that lead to me seeing Jehovah in a whole new way. I didn't see the love, mercy, and forgiveness. Instead I saw heinous cruelty, extreme violence, anger and wrath, absolutely nothing I could in good conscience continue to worship.
exchemist
Veteran Member
Well one can still go back to source documents in Greek and Hebrew that have been little changed for centuries. In fact this is what is done for many new versions of the bible. Here is the Greek source that is often used: Novum Testamentum Graece - Wikipedia
You will see it is a compilation from various Greek manuscripts known to scholars, as there is no single source.
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
Certainly. The Bible has one of the best openings lines in all of world literature. We should not ignore the poetic drive and energy of those first few verses.
If God could write, he’d struggle to improve on Genesis 1:1-5 and it’s echo in John 1:1-5
InChrist
Free4ever
I used to read the Bible and found it confusing and disjointed. Then I was saved and my (spiritual) eyes were opened. Immediately, I could see and understand the consistent theme running through the scriptures; OT and NT- that was Jesus Christ, the promised Messiah and Savior who saves all who trust Him for forgiveness of sin and eternal life.
exchemist
Veteran Member
Agree about the second one, certainly. I am just old enough to remember when that was said at the end of every Tridentine mass, the "Last Gospel". Very mysterious and poetic.
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
I don't very often go to mass these days, but am I right in thinking that it usually ends now with Revelation 22:21 ?
I was a little put out at a friends funeral recently, to find a lot of the liturgy appeared to have been recently "updated". Apart from anything else, I think doing that insults the intelligence of the congregation.
Bree
Active Member
the catholic church did not exist until around the 3rd century... christianity and the bible scriptures was created by Jesus apostles shortly after his death when they were instructed to 'preach' the word of salvation. Their gospels became the basis of christianity. the catholic church had nothing to do with it.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I don't think any orginal Bible ever survived.
Just vauge scattered bits and pieces, even in medieval times.
What little was left, I suspect the Catholics just filled the holes with their theology and the 'complete bible' was produced then for use by the clergy.
I would say the Catholic church invented most of it.
Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
The Bible never names the authors of the Gospels. We don't know who they were. We only have TRADTION that they were written by the Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.
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Bree
Active Member
fortunately, christianity spread far and wide after the first century. It went out into Africa, Asia and Europe which is why there are different forms of christianity. As it spread, the gospels and letters from the apostles of jesus were copied by skilled copiest and delivered to new congregations in all those lands.
There is plenty of evidence that the bible we have today is accurate as modern translators are able to utilise these many manuscripts
Here is some good information about the bible and its historicity
exchemist
Veteran Member
It ends with the Blessing and Dismissal, which can take various forms. Sometimes it might include something along those lines. But there is no fixed recitation from the bible at the end of mass.
The only recent updating I'm aware of (in England and Wales) has been to go back to slightly more literal translations of the Latin, e.g. in the Creed we now say "consubstantial with the Father" (consubstantialem Patri) instead of "of one being with the Father". And we now say "and with thy spirit" (et cum spiritu tuo) instead of "and also with you". And so on.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
It's impossible to be accurate.
exchemist
Veteran Member
Hmm, this is a Jehovah's Witness link, so it is unlikely to reflect the view of most historians about the bible. JWs do not have a reputation for respecting and encouraging scholarship.
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
Apparently "time" started at the "beginning". There was no "once upon a time" prior to the "beginning".
I kind of think the "Word of God" refers to the Branch of David, who of course will be anointed, who will reign over the nations/Gentiles with a rod of iron (Revelation 19:15).
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I'm sure they made a contribution in their own way.
They certainly derived their own interpretation and meaning over their Jewish counterparts.
Chief Rabbinate protests to Vatican over pope’s remarks on Torah
I'll start with 2 Timothy 3:16-17 that ALL Scripture is inspired by God.
To me the pure obvious Bible message is the message Jesus taught and instructed to teach at Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8
The main theme of Jesus' teaching was about God' kingdom solution according to Luke 4:43.
God's Kingdom of Daniel 2:44, that God's kingdom government through Christ will end all corrupt rulership now on Earth.
So, yes, there is 'the pure, obvious message' found in the Bible alone about the good news (aka gospel) of God's kingdom in the hands of Christ Jesus who will come to mankind's rescue.