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A question for Christians (and others who believe in heaven)
- Thread starter retrorich
- Start date
Malus 12:9
Temporarily Deactive.
Perhaps so that they can spend more time with their loved ones, and so they are fully prepared for
heaven when that time comes...I dunno, maybe.
heaven when that time comes...I dunno, maybe.
glasgowchick
Gives Glory to God !!!
retrorich said:
Hi, I can't speak for everyone but my own personal fear on death, is the fear of the unknown, the actual experience of dying...I hope to be in Heaven at the end of my journey..
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I don't. Not in the slightest. There have been a few times in my life when I actually wished I could just go to sleep at night and never wake up. This is not to say I would ever have actually considered suicide. But I have as many loved ones waiting for me on the other side as I have here. When it's time for me to go, I'll be ready. My reasons for sticking around as long as possible would be primarily out of concern for those I'd be leaving behind.retrorich said:
nutshell
Well-Known Member
A local leader of my church gave a great talk about this. He said you should not fear death at it is the next natural step in our eternal progression. What we should fear is dying in sin or dying in a state in which we feel we have not always strived to do our best and have not repented when we should have.
Whitsuntide
Member
If all friends and family are goign to be there, where do our enemies go?
nutshell
Well-Known Member
I agree that if you live right you can have a bit of heaven here on earth, but obviously, depending on a persons religion, the definition of heaven may be a bit different. My opinion of heaven is far from what the earth currently is even though I may have my own bit of heaven in my own home.Jaxbac said:
joeboonda
Well-Known Member
According to my earnest expectation and my hope, that in nothing I shall be ashamed, but that with all boldness, as always, so now also Christ shall be magnified in my body, whether it be by life, or by death. For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain. But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labour; yet what I shall choose I wot not. For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ, which is far better; Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you. Phillipians 1:20-24 Therefore we are alway confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord; (For we walk by faith, not by sight We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. II Corinthians 5:6-8
We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. II Corinthians 5:6-8
Lindsey-Loo
Steel Magnolia
I don't fear death. No, absolutely not. Death is just the beginning. But it's not like I'm going to try to die just because I want to get to Heaven. When God wants me to die, I'll die, but it's not my job to...ummm, how do you say this? Bring my own death about?
s2a
Heretic and part-time (skinny) Santa impersonator
The short answer is, of course, is that "believers" are consciously unsure (though they will insist that their 'unconscious' heart knows "the truth").
At the risk of appearing entirely self-serving and self-gratifyingly egotistical, I would also invite thread respondents to ponder and tender considered reply to a personally instigated thread entitled, "What's So Great About a Christian Heaven"?
[http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?p=187645#post187645 ]
In recognition of the fact that "Heaven" is the primary goal of "ultimate" achievement amongst Christianity's faithful adherents, I continue to find it odd that most adherents can't even define/elaborate upon their own prophetically proscribed "ultimate destination".
I yet invite elaboration upon a relatively simple request for enhancement predicated upon fact and truth. So far, the very best "argument" favoring a Christian Heaven is akin to a Jewish haberdasher trying to close sale of a suit to a skeptic....."Trust me, you'll love it...and even if you don't, your wife will love you for it">.
s2a
Heretic and part-time (skinny) Santa impersonator
Christiangirl0909's signature/quote reads:
You probably meant no intentional harm or offense in this quote's signatory useage, but such an attribution and sentiment is insulting to the many military patriots that served or died in combat on foreign soil to preserve religious freedom and liberty for all US citizens.
---------------------
"The membership of the Freedom From Religion Foundation includes many veterans from World War II, Korea and Vietnam, and we also have members who put their lives on the line as police officers and firefighters."
Atheists In Foxholes Monument
http://www.ffrf.org/foxholes/
-----------------------
"4,332 Active Duty Atheists & 112,166 with no religious affliation reported in the military [in the] Salt Lake Tribune. The article itself lays out a new argument by evangelicals that religious tolerance should be foregone because proselytism is such an important tenant of Christianity."
Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers
http://www.maaf.info/index.html
Atheist testaments from decorated (some wounded) combat veterans and others:
http://www.maaf.info/expaif.html
---------------------------
And most sadly, from an American President...
Q: "Surely you recognize the equal citizenship and patriotism of Americans who are atheists?"
A: "No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God."
From interview with George H.W. Bush, August 27 1987
Ahem.
You probably meant no intentional harm or offense in this quote's signatory useage, but such an attribution and sentiment is insulting to the many military patriots that served or died in combat on foreign soil to preserve religious freedom and liberty for all US citizens.
---------------------
"The membership of the Freedom From Religion Foundation includes many veterans from World War II, Korea and Vietnam, and we also have members who put their lives on the line as police officers and firefighters."
Atheists In Foxholes Monument
http://www.ffrf.org/foxholes/
-----------------------
"4,332 Active Duty Atheists & 112,166 with no religious affliation reported in the military [in the] Salt Lake Tribune. The article itself lays out a new argument by evangelicals that religious tolerance should be foregone because proselytism is such an important tenant of Christianity."
Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers
http://www.maaf.info/index.html
Atheist testaments from decorated (some wounded) combat veterans and others:
http://www.maaf.info/expaif.html
---------------------------
And most sadly, from an American President...
Q: "Surely you recognize the equal citizenship and patriotism of Americans who are atheists?"
A: "No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God."
From interview with George H.W. Bush, August 27 1987
retrorich
SUPER NOT-A-MOD
Christiangirl0909:
Your signature ("There has never been an atheist in a foxhole at a battle." -Oliver Rainey) is meant to imply that no atheist would stick to his/her nonbelief in God if faced with an imminent threat of death. I personally know that to be untrue. Many years ago, I was almost certain I was going to drown. I did, however, have time to ponder my atheism, and decided that I was 100% at peace with my atheism, and had no interest in seeking "deathbed salvation." I am quite sure there have been many atheist soldiers who felt the same way when under fire.
Your signature ("There has never been an atheist in a foxhole at a battle." -Oliver Rainey) is meant to imply that no atheist would stick to his/her nonbelief in God if faced with an imminent threat of death. I personally know that to be untrue. Many years ago, I was almost certain I was going to drown. I did, however, have time to ponder my atheism, and decided that I was 100% at peace with my atheism, and had no interest in seeking "deathbed salvation." I am quite sure there have been many atheist soldiers who felt the same way when under fire.
You have had some very thoughtful answers from people who are sticking around for the sake of others. But surely, if we believe in heaven, we must believe in God. If we believe in God, we must believe that we have a purpose while we are here on earth. Is it not correct that our job is not to fear death or welcome it, but just to fulfil our purpose for as long as we are required on this earth.retrorich said:
I suggest you do your best while you are here, and enjoy the gifts you've been given now. Heaven will come soon enough, we actually have a very brief and fleeting life. Don't waste it.
Merlin
it is not unusual for people who would like to prove religion and/or God does not exist to ask these impossible questions. Clearly nobody knows as an absolute certainty what will happen after we are all dead.s2a said:
If, for example, we simply were moved to a 'higher plane of existence', then we would experience much more wonderful things and be freed from most of the restrictions under which we now live. Would that be heaven? Who knows?
If people have a generalised view that life after this will be significantly better, then because we are all human beings, we put our own interpretation on what our version of Paradise will be. That does not mean that something infinitely nicer than now is not waiting for us. Equally of course it does not rule out the possibility that there might be nothing afterwards!
For what it is worth, you are statistically better off believing in God than being an atheist.
Merlin
retrorich
SUPER NOT-A-MOD
Atheism is not a religion--it is the absence of religion. Actually, I did not CHOOSE to be an atheist. By the time I reached my early teens, my mind would no longer allow me to accept the existence of God, gods, goddesses or other types of supernatural beings/powers. My mind has not changed in that respect.Merlin said: