Abortion

[We Never Know]

The American Medical Association opposes such laws, as it deters pregnant people from getting help to get off drugs.

Don’t criminalize pregnant patients with substance-use disorders

An Ohio mom was prosecuted after disclosing her illicit drug use upon giving birth. Learn why an appeals court was right to overturn her conviction.

www.ama-assn.org

Doesnt matter. There are laws.
Btw, even California is one state so its not just repub states.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

What are you going on about?

Those aren't any laws that I'm aware of.

Apparently there are in some states:

Are There Laws Against Serving Alcohol to Pregnant Women?

Any individual who serves alcohol should make themselves aware of any legal responsibilities they have regarding serving alcohol to pregnant women.

alcohol.org

 

[We Never Know]

This demonstrates that not all pregnant people are pregnant women.

Pregnant people came about because of transgender males.

Anytime I see anyone pregnant, its obvious they are female.

 

[crossfire]

Doesnt matter. There are laws.
Btw, even California is one state so its not just repub states.

And those who make the laws are not health care professionals, either. I would much rather see the effort go towards interventions that help these pregnant people get off drugs than to push them further away from getting help by criminalizing them and putting them in jail after they give birth.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Make yourself aware.
Google "how many states have laws about a drug or alcohol abuse while pregnant"

Then I'd say that's an intrusion. Which drugs, exactly? Are prescription meds included?
Instead of prosecuting them, addictions services should be made available to these women.

And I would think that these laws might be in place in cases where the woman is planning on giving birth, wherein the use of narcotics would negatively affect fetal development. Such as in the case of fetal alcohol syndrome.

We don't have such laws here in Canada but (in some provinces) we do have addictions and mental health services on offer.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Apparently there are in some states:

Are There Laws Against Serving Alcohol to Pregnant Women?

Any individual who serves alcohol should make themselves aware of any legal responsibilities they have regarding serving alcohol to pregnant women.

alcohol.org

And so it appears to be the case in half or so of the states. So you can't serve alcohol to women.

But is it illegal for a woman to consume alcohol while pregnant?

 

[crossfire]

Pregnant people came about because of transgender males.

Anytime I see anyone pregnant, its obvious they are female.

And they are persons, as well. Not all are women, as the pregnant 10-year-old demonstrates.

 

[We Never Know]

And they are persons, as well. Not all are women, as the pregnant 10-year-old demonstrates.

Pregnant girls and pregnant women.
You can call them pregnant people all you want.
As I said when I see anyone pregnant its obvious they are female or they wouldn't be pregnant.

 

[crossfire]

And so it appears to be the case in half or so of the states. So you can't serve alcohol to women.

But is it illegal for a woman to consume alcohol while pregnant?

According to this article from a year ago, 21 states have defined alcohol or substance use during pregnancy as child abuse or child neglect.

State-based policies on alcohol use during pregnancy

Forty-three states have implemented an alcohol policy targeting alcohol use among pregnant people. This is a look at their policies.

www.npwomenshealthcare.com

 

[crossfire]

Pregnant girls and pregnant women.
You can call them pregnant people all you want.
As I said when I see anyone pregnant its obvious they are female or they wouldn't be pregnant.

Do you find the term "pregnant people" sounding ridiculous, as the poster I was addressing does?

I rather like it. I like keep the reminder they are people, and avoid going anywhere near the extreme of the "Axlotl Tanks" of the Bene Theilax of Dune.

Axlotl Tank

An Axlotl tank or Axolotl tank was the "tank" by which the Bene Tleilax reproduced a living human being from the cells of a cadaver, producing type of clone called a ghola. These tanks were also used in the creation of genetically engineered assassins known as Face Dancers. The axlotl tanks were...

dune.fandom.com

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

And so it appears to be the case in half or so of the states. So you can't serve alcohol to women.

It gets weird. Apparently, there's also a discrimination case from New York where a restaurant is being sued for refusing to serve alcohol to a pregnant person.

But is it illegal for a woman to consume alcohol while pregnant?

Seems like it's not an across the board "yes," but there are cases where ongoing alcohol consumption during pregnancy could lead to civil penalties, criminal charges, or even commitment.

... but I'm not sure what point @We Never Know is trying to make here. A person's bodily autonomy can remain intact even if they can't get a drink.

 

[We Never Know]

It gets weird. Apparently, there's also a discrimination case from New York where a restaurant is being sued for refusing to serve alcohol to a pregnant person.



Seems like it's not an across the board "yes," but there are cases where ongoing alcohol consumption during pregnancy could lead to civil penalties, criminal charges, or even commitment.

... but I'm not sure what point @We Never Know is trying to make here. A person's bodily autonomy can remain intact even if they can't get a drink.

Its her body so she can do drugs and drink if she wants right? Its her body!
So what if substance abuse leads to a miscarriage or abortion or death of the fetus, it has no rights and isn't a baby anyway right?

 

[an anarchist]

Its her body so she can do drugs and drink if she wants right? Its her body!
So what if substance abuse leads to a miscarriage or abortion or death of the fetus, it has no rights and isn't a baby anyway right?

I think if the baby is born with damage, then the point you are making is moot. But if the baby dies as a result before the birth happens... I see your point that the pro-choice logic can be applied.

 

[We Never Know]

Do you find the term "pregnant people" sounding ridiculous, as the poster I was addressing does?

Already addressed that.

Being a transgender male can get pregnant, pregnant people sounds better than pregnant men.
Pregnant people also sounds better than birthing people or people with uteruses.

You gotta be politically correct ya know

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Pregnant people came about because of transgender males.

Regardless of how it came about, it's accurate.

Do you need a Venn diagram?

Anytime I see anyone pregnant, its obvious they are female.

What's the obvious conclusion when someone refuses to refer to a pregnant woman as a person and even tries to "correct" others?

Why do some people freak out at the suggestion that a pregnant is a person?

 

[We Never Know]

Regardless of how it came about, it's accurate.

Do you need a Venn diagram?


What's the obvious conclusion when someone refuses to refer to a pregnant woman as a person and even tries to "correct" others?

Why do some people freak out at the suggestion that a pregnant is a person?

Lets go with 'people with uteruses'. After all they are the people who can get pregnant.

 

[We Never Know]

Regardless of how it came about, it's accurate.

Do you need a Venn diagram?

Need a biology lesson?

What's the obvious conclusion when someone refuses to refer to a pregnant woman as a person and even tries to "correct" others?

What is the obvious conclusion is when someone refuses to refer to a pregnant woman as a pregnant woman/girl/female even though its obvious they are who get pregnant but instead want to call them pregnant people and even tries to "correct" others?

Why do some people freak out at the suggestion that a pregnant is a person?

Not all 'people' can get pregnant.

Instead of pregnant woman/girl/female

Why not
People with uteruses?
People with eggs(ovum)?
People with fallopian tubes?
People with vaginas?
People with a placenta?

Those are key in a pregnancy and not all people have them.

 

[Ignatius A]

Her body is not the fetus's body.

Correct so to say, "my body my choice" is nonsensical at best.

 

[Ignatius A]

Lets go with 'people with uteruses'. After all they are the people who can get pregnant.

NEVER surrender to the language of transism. Only women can get pregnant. "People with uteruses" = women

 

[We Never Know]

NEVER surrender to the language of transism. Only women can get pregnant. "People with uteruses" = women

I said that because...

"People with uteruses" is fine in context, but most people with uteruses aren't pregnant.

Its like they ignore the majority of 'people' can't get pregnant.