• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

about the new testament

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Isn't it strange that NO historian ever mentioned Jesus?
It is not strange that the historians of that time did not mention Jesus, because Prophets are rarely recognized in the years when they walked the earth, and not even for a long time afterwards. It is only much later that very many people recognize their divine station and then they garner more followers and then historians start to write about them. Just look at all that is written about Jesus now.

“Just how small was the Christian movement in the first century is clear from the calculations of the sociologist R Stark (1996:5-7; so too Hopkins 1998:192-193). Stark begins his analysis with a rough estimation of six million Christians in the Roman Empire (or about ten percent of the total population) at the start of the fourth century... There were 1,000 Christians in the year 40, 1 400 Christians in 50, 1,960 Christians in 60, 2,744 Christians in 70, 3,842 Christians in 80, 5,378 Christians in 90 and 7,530 Christians at the end of the first century.

These figures are very suggestive, and reinforce the point that in its initial decades the Christian movement represented a tiny fraction of the ancient world.”
How many Jews became Christians in the first century?
 
Last edited:

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
I've read the new testament. My opinion is that it's fake. Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all! :cool:

The books are about miracles that go against nature. Please! :confused:

Ok, he didn't have material existence. Did Jesus have spiritual existence? Did Jesus have existence in the minds of men?

If he did, is that important or not important?
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
I am one Bahai who will agree that most of the NT is fiction. ;)
You're also the second Baha'i to make this point when replying to my post. Both of you completely missed the "maybe" in the post when I referred to Muslims and Baha'i.
 

Mike.Hester

Member
I've read the new testament. My opinion is that it's fake. Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all! :cool:

The books are about miracles that go against nature. Please! :confused:
SYO 100% correct! This myth has caused 2000 years of confusion!
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Borrowed theology? It's fiction, in my opinion. It has nothing to do with theology, in my opinion. And it hijacked Judaism.
Its just abrahamic religions are still being practiced today, so that's why I called it borrowed theology because it's a compiled menagerie of various religions including the Greek pantheon of gods and demigods some pagan traditions and anything else along those lines mish mashed into a fine religious stew.

But yeah I agree, It's obviously all fiction.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
You're also the second Baha'i to make this point when replying to my post. Both of you completely missed the "maybe" in the post when I referred to Muslims and Baha'i.
Why did we miss the maybe? o_O
I liked the other Baha'i answer a lot better than mine, mine was just a quick reply based partly upon emotion.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
Why did we miss the maybe? o_O
I liked the other Baha'i answer a lot better than mine, mine was just a quick reply based partly upon emotion.
I personally saw no point in replying to my answer just to point out that I was wrong when I never even made a sweeping statement. It was just a suggestion of a possibility. In fact, I didn't reply the first time because I never figured more than one person would feel the need to "call it out", so to speak. Guess I was wrong.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I personally saw no point in replying to my answer just to point out that I was wrong when I never even made a sweeping statement. It was just a suggestion of a possibility. In fact, I didn't reply the first time because I never figured more than one person would feel the need to "call it out", so to speak. Guess I was wrong.
I was not disagreeing with you, I was agreeing.
Call what out? o_O
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all!
Do you know what a non-sequitur is? An example might go something like this:

@syo is a fake; s/he never existed! Why? Because the above quote don't make any sense at all.

My guess is that there are any number of things that you and I do not understand that nevertheless exist..
 

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
The parables, and teachings would be historically significant and their influence on humanity. So it would be well worth knowing how those parables originated.

Without the parables and sermons it's just a bunch of nonsense. What hooks people is the moral teachings and parables.

Reading about miracles 2000 years later when no miracles like that happen just affirms its fictional.

And then Paul comes along and makes his own thing about it.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
To make the definitive claim that "historians never mentioned Jesus" while knowing nothing about Josephus is laughably irresponsible.

It is true the historians and philosophers who wrote during the life of Jesus did not mention Jesus. It is alos true that Joseohus wrote third hand repots concerning Jesus, if the mentions of Jesus in his writngs were original and not added or altered, which is a strong possibility.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
To the best of my knowledge, that is not the consensus. This is a worthwhile resource.

Also, from Wikipedia:

The first and most extensive reference to Jesus in the Antiquities, found in Book 18, states that Jesus was the Messiah and a wise teacher who was crucified by Pilate. It is commonly called the Testimonium Flavianum.[1][3][4] Almost all modern scholars reject the authenticity of this passage in its present form, while the majority of scholars nevertheless hold that it contains an authentic nucleus referencing the execution of Jesus by Pilate, which was then subject to Christian interpolation and/or alteration.[3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10] The exact nature and extent of the Christian redaction remains unclear, however.[11][12]

Modern scholarship has largely acknowledged the authenticity of the second reference to Jesus in the Antiquities, found in Book 20, Chapter 9, which mentions "the brother of Jesus, who was called Christ, whose name was James."[13] This reference is considered to be more authentic than the Testimonium.[14][1][15][16][17][18]

Josephus is worthwhile reference to read to understand the history in context of the time, but not necessarily accurate, because of the problems with the the citations concerning Jesus only represent the view of some of the followers of Jesus Christ at the time they were written and edited. Josephus represents a third hand reference, and the other later day historians are not first hand references to the life of Jesus.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Josephus is worthwhile reference to read to understand the history in context of the time, but not necessarily accurate, because of the problems with the the citations concerning Jesus only represent the view of some of the followers of Jesus Christ at the time they were written and edited. Josephus represents a third hand reference, and the other later day historians are not first hand references to the life of Jesus.

The new human Genetics life DNA attack owns title in every owned Holy land as a different brother, but owns the same realization/science advice. Hence DNA title is given to country of its origin....factually, yet historically the scientific Christ realization was accepted in the science community as relative advice.

Temple science and pyramid technology dis assembled and not used anymore. Relative laws of natural Order on God O Earth as One titled teaching, REAL.

The relative science quotes said that the Immaculate gases were owned by the stone O and in their natural order were once burning but all went cold. So were as night time gases are...clear.

Then the Sun burst and burnt attacked Earth, so de evolved the Immaculate state...so the theme God O stone gas spirit history said that the Immaculate state had been sacrificed.....as said by a male human scientist owner of the theorising, so conscious equating then places self as owner of the thinking.

Yet God never thought...a human male told a human male and then said God told him, yet God did not speak to him. Yet historically because machine encoding existed for voice/image transmission, he historically after ancient science attack factually heard his own male self speaking science quotes about God to him.

Why the 2 stories were told as relative advice to why modern day man re invented the science knowledge by what he heard spoken to him, as recorded by his ancient science brothers who destroyed life on Earth. How it was relative.

Sun radiation mass in space is cold. And cold radiation Sun mass did not own the reason why the gases on Earth were burning. Historically hot sun radiation mass owned the reason why it reignited/sacrificed the Immaculate spirit of God...which is not male owned...it was owned by the planet.

Then as he used the mass of UFO as a converter, he then sacrificed the Immaculate mass again...as a different cause...and so then he quoted, so I removed another one mass of the atmosphere my own self. So first life de evolves into mutation. Then eventually when the gases return, the mutation disappears. Then the life cell becomes healthier and healthier by conditions of regained Earth heavenly mass...which biology proves it had.

Science therefore cannot argue against biblical advice, seeing it was owned historically by their human male choice and heard by human males on behalf of human males being the science inventor for science machines/reaction.

Yet creation was not created for science to own reactive machines...what is lied about historically.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
You're also the second Baha'i to make this point when replying to my post. Both of you completely missed the "maybe" in the post when I referred to Muslims and Baha'i.

Since the Bible including the New Testament and the Tanakh set in history and not history, most, but not all Baha'is consider it containing Revelation, spiritual truths, prayers, and guidance set in the time of Jesus for the NT and the Tanakh for the early history of Judaism, and not necessarily a literal account.

Many, but not all Muslims may consider Genesis a historical account, but not the New Testament concerning the life of Jesus. In general the Muslims consider the New Testament a corrupted version of an earlier simpler gospel. The Gospel of Barnabas is considered by many Muslims to be a more earlier original gospel of the life of Jesus.
 
Last edited:

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Since the Bible including the New Testament and the Tanakh set in history and not history, most, but not all Baha'is consider it containing Revelation, spiritual truths, prayers, and guidance set in the time of Jesus for the NT and the Tanakh for the early history of Judaism, and not necessarily a literal account.

Many, but not all Muslims may consider Genesis a historical account, but not the New Testament concerning the life of Jesus. In general the Muslims consider the New Testament a corrupted version of an earlier simpler gospel. The Gospel of Barnabas is considered by many Muslims to be a more earlier original gospel of the life of Jesus.

Star watchers and Keeper of the moon tides was a spiritual conscious advice memory recording that said males kept watch on the stars, relative to O Earth being attacked because of ancient science technology.

They said and named DATA by reference MESSENGER, and all Messengers on Earth historically and categorically own the same data/science information.

ST ONE, the O planet mass gets removed in human science trans mutation science ownership.....the Earth gases are burnt out....cold radiation UFO mass in space gets heated by entering our heated gas atmosphere...and return to space heated and burning and begin to burn out other gases from asteroid/Saviour messenger history.

DNA on Earth becomes baby life mutated. Adult life gets sick and changes into various caused radiation conditions. Life in attack, notified.

Then a Messenger arrives by asteroid stone releasing its colder gases into irradiated space as a replaced gas release. How it was taught.

Same science cause, changing natural order, same theme, different names as the titles were DATA inferred. If Barnabas is studied and claimed to be similar to Jesus story...Jesus is just a quantified DATA referral about history changed in the heavens again by technology. For it is human males doing all the studies and comparison of information.

The books of the study therefore were always updated. The new testaments were not updated because science of the occult had been forbidden and we were awaiting the RETURN saviour cooling outcome of 2012. Which never happened.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
SA VI OUR.

Human psyche says our saving......SA TAN...the flogging science sine/gas burning SA removal by the tan irradiation event.....DNA attack.

SA VI (6) holy accounting ours.

How it was stated by namesake, without owning a future name...for the atmospheric mass was Immaculate and never owned a name.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
Since the Bible including the New Testament and the Tanakh set in history and not history, most, but not all Baha'is consider it containing Revelation, spiritual truths, prayers, and guidance set in the time of Jesus for the NT and the Tanakh for the early history of Judaism, and not necessarily a literal account.

Many, but not all Muslims may consider Genesis a historical account, but not the New Testament concerning the life of Jesus. In general the Muslims consider the New Testament a corrupted version of an earlier simpler gospel. The Gospel of Barnabas is considered by many Muslims to be a more earlier original gospel of the life of Jesus.
Yes. I know all of this.
 

syo

Well-Known Member
Ok, he didn't have material existence. Did Jesus have spiritual existence? Did Jesus have existence in the minds of men?

If he did, is that important or not important?
In my opinion, I truly believe Jesus is the Harry Potter of 1 century. He was in the minds as literature figure.
 
Top