Always surprised when an atheist says this:

[Aupmanyav]

"The universe is so big, so who are we to think we matter?"

Sure it is big, 2 trillion galaxies at the present count. How do we matter to the universe? Even stars go 'puff' in minutes. Hurts your ego? Goes against your God concept. We are important only to ourselves.

 

[Balthazzar]

I

We are big in our own perspective world and certainly an aspect of the overall universe, however our "little blue speck" in the universe and our own humanity is not the central theme that a number of people think we are.

To think the universe was created for us is a completely preposterous notion to begin with.

I remember all the Voyager photos especially one where Carl Sagan pointed out as a tiny insignificant speck called Earth, this philosophical question hits home whenever it's viewed.

I can just imagine Voyager attempting to take a picture right now in interstellar space, I doubt it would even register.

I was similar in thought a while back. Truth be told, if this earth was the size of a grain of sand, our galaxy would be the same in respect to the universe, which in terms of time, would likewise be viewed the same as it exists today compared to a few billion lightyears from present day earth time. Even so, it's all energy and the way we relate to it as conscious beings. We're hardly insignificant. We are literally all there is, based on our relationship to what is and how we process the energy itself.

 

[Kfox]

Sure it is big, 2 trillion galaxies at the present count. How do we matter to the universe? Even stars go 'puff' in minutes. Hurts your ego? Goes against your God concept. We are important only to ourselves.

Yeah' but we are the only ones who count. Who cares if something non-human doesn't find us important!

 

[Aupmanyav]

Yeah' but we are the only ones who count. Who cares if something non-human doesn't find us important!

We do not know the number of 'us'es in the universe. There could be billions of them in the reported 2 trillion galaxies, unable to interconnect, living in their own closed worlds like us.

 

[Kfox]

We do not know the number of 'us'es in the universe. There could be billions of them in the reported 2 trillion galaxies, unable to interconnect, living in their own closed worlds like us.

We have no reason to believe there are other humans in the Universe, however even if there are, it still doesn't refute what I said.

 

[Aupmanyav]

We have no reason to believe there are other humans in the Universe, however even if there are, it still doesn't refute what I said.

When did I say that creatures with the human-like intelligence exist in the universe? But with billions of earth-like planets (Extra-Solar Earth analog), and an abundance of organic molecules floating around in the universe, on what basis you will deny the possibility? We know of a few: Earth analog - Wikipedia

"On November 4, 2013, astronomers reported, based on Kepler space mission data, that there could be as many as 40 billion Earth-sized planets orbiting in the habitable zones of Sun-like stars and red dwarf stars within the Milky Way Galaxy. .. In September 2020, astronomers identified 24 superhabitable planet (planets better than Earth) contenders, from among more than 4000 confirmed exoplanets at present, based on astrophysical parameters, as well as the natural history of known life forms on the Earth."

And Milky Way is just a medium sized galaxy. Andromeda is bigger than us. And then, the estimate of there being 2 trillion galaxies!

 

[Kfox]

When did I say that creatures with the human-like intelligence exist in the universe? But with billions of earth-like planets (Extra-Solar Earth analog), and an abundance of organic molecules floating around in the universe, on what basis you will deny the possibility? We know of a few: Earth analog - Wikipedia

"On November 4, 2013, astronomers reported, based on Kepler space mission data, that there could be as many as 40 billion Earth-sized planets orbiting in the habitable zones of Sun-like stars and red dwarf stars within the Milky Way Galaxy. .. In September 2020, astronomers identified 24 superhabitable planet (planets better than Earth) contenders, from among more than 4000 confirmed exoplanets at present, based on astrophysical parameters, as well as the natural history of known life forms on the Earth."

And Milky Way is just a medium sized galaxy. Andromeda is bigger than us. And then, the estimate of there being 2 trillion galaxies!

Great! Now care to respond to what I actually said? Let's try again; Why should we care if some non-human doesn't find us important? Our views are the only ones that count to us.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Let's try again; Why should we care if some non-human doesn't find us important? Our views are the only ones that count to us.

Since we are not likely to encounter them, there is no need for us to worry about them nor they should worry about us. We are on different islands and even one way communication will take 5 year, if proxima Centauri B is inhabited, the nearest exolanet. Traveling will take ages. Although NASA have recently taken up a project on extraterrestrials.

 

[Kfox]

Since we are not likely to encounter them, there is no need for us to worry about them nor they should worry about us. We are on different islands and even one way communication will take 5 year, if proxima Centauri B is inhabited, the nearest exolanet. Traveling will take ages. Although NASA have recently taken up a project on extraterrestrials.

So you agree with me now; that we have no reason to care?

 

[Aupmanyav]

We have no reason to believe there are other humans in the Universe, however even if there are, it still doesn't refute what I said.

So you agree with me now; that we have no reason to care?

Part of what you said in the first post - "We have no reason to believe there are other humans in the Universe" - is not true. There may be billions of life forms in the universe, and some, in their time, may have resembled humans. As of now, we are confronted with a insanely huge universe (scientists say 2 trillion galaxies). God must have been real mad to create such a large universe. The rest what you say is true. We have no reason to care about these life forms because we are never going to encounter them.

 

[Kfox]

Part of what you said in the first post - "We have no reason to believe there are other humans in the Universe" - is not true. There may be billions of life forms in the universe, and some, in their time, may have resembled humans.

To "resemble" humans doesn't make you human. Again; we have no reason to believe there are other humans in the Universe.

 

[Aupmanyav]

To "resemble" humans doesn't make you human. Again; we have no reason to believe there are other humans in the Universe.

Humans even on Earth till very recently were in various sub-species - H. luzonensis, Red Deer Cave people - Wikipedia, Denisovan - Wikipedia, Penghu 1 - Wikipedia, Penghu 1 - Wikipedia, Homo floresiensis - Wikipedia, Neanderthal - Wikipedia
Homo - Wikipedia

They were fully human. We carry their DNA. They are extinct now.

 

[Kfox]

Humans even on Earth till very recently were in various sub-species - H. luzonensis, Red Deer Cave people - Wikipedia, Denisovan - Wikipedia, Penghu 1 - Wikipedia, Penghu 1 - Wikipedia, Homo floresiensis - Wikipedia, Neanderthal - Wikipedia
Homo - Wikipedia

They were fully human. We carry their DNA. They are extinct now.

Modern apes resemble humans, but they are not humans. We have no reason to assume there are other humans in the Universe; there is no evidence to support such an assumption

 

[Aupmanyav]

We have no reason to assume there are other humans in the Universe; there is no evidence to support such an assumption

It is a statistical guess. Remember 2 trillion galaxies. Each galaxy having millions of stars and the stars having their planets.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I've noticed a certain view of the cosmos in the atheists I've talked to.

You've clearly talked to too few.
That said, I find it rather sad that you and others seem to view anthropocentrism as a coveted feature of theism.

 

[RabbiO]

You've clearly talked to too few.
That said, I find it rather sad that you and others seem to view anthropocentrism as a coveted feature of theism.

Actually the OP who originally presented on the forum as an Orthodox Jew has since fallen off the derach and identifies with A Course In Miracles… or did last time he was heard from. As such he probably no longer holds to much in his post.

 

[Kfox]

It is a statistical guess. Remember 2 trillion galaxies. Each galaxy having millions of stars and the stars having their planets.

So what's your point? Let's say there are human like people on some distant planet, and they don't care about us here on Earth; is that gonna break your heart? How about if you don't know if they care about us, but you know there is a chance they do not; are you really gonna spend any time trippin' over this? What's your point here?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Nothing will ever break my heart. I will take whatever comes in my stride.
Even if they care, as people do here too, we are going to be in our respective island planets. We are not going to interact except perhaps by radio signals, the possibility of which is extremely low. The aliens have be at least at our level of development. The cosmic time-scales are much larger than the life-span of a species.

 

[Kfox]

Nothing will ever break my heart. I will take whatever comes in my stride.
Even if they care, as people do here too, we are going to be in our respective island planets. We are not going to interact except perhaps by radio signals, the possibility of which is extremely low.

No, there is no interaction at all! Zero, zilch; we are unaware of their existence. So are you agreeing with me, that we don’t care whether other species finds us important or not?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Yeah, if we are never to meet or even interact, what for and why care?