America is Becoming Less Religious

[Shadow Wolf]

No it doesn't. It shows that they are less likely to be affiliated. The numbers of agnostics/atheists isn't all that different, the way I see it.

The big problem here is in defining what "being religious" means. Does it specifically mean "affiliated?" Because if it does, it's meaningless. Lots of people are religious without being affiliated.

The rest of your post I agree with.

No matter how the questions are asked and presented, poll after poll after poll have consistently shown that the younger the generation, the less likely they are to be religious. Of course there are always the questions of "what exactly did the pollster mean by this," but the consistency of such polls makes such questions less of an issue because they all show the same general trend regardless of what questions are being asked, how they are asked, and the exact meaning of the terms in the polls.

 

[paarsurrey]

America is Becoming Less Religious

Does it mean less Christian?

Regards

 

[Skwim]

America is Becoming Less Religious

Does it mean less Christian?

Regards

​

 

[sojourner]

In general I agree. But what constitutes "espousal" is also different in many cases; there are progressive Christians with views of Jesus that are virtually indistinguishable from the views of progressive Jews. What sets them apart is religious practice, tradition, symbolism and self-identification and the central position of Jesus, not so much their beliefs about the meaning of Jesus or what he taught. What do we make of people like Ann Holmes Redding, a defrocked Episcopalian priest who claims both Islam and Christianity? Or someone who claims both Catholicism and Buddhism?

Why should we make anything of them? Just because one is spiritual -- or even "religious" -- doesn't mean one can't think outside the box. While I might defend the veracity of orthodoxy, I'm not so narrow that I dismiss other expressions -- so long as those expressions are honest and serve to set the adherent free.

 

[paarsurrey]

​

So you confirm America is becoming less Christian. They have realized that the creeds of Christianity are mythical.

Regards

 

[sojourner]

No matter how the questions are asked and presented, poll after poll after poll have consistently shown that the younger the generation, the less likely they are to be religious. Of course there are always the questions of "what exactly did the pollster mean by this," but the consistency of such polls makes such questions less of an issue because they all show the same general trend regardless of what questions are being asked, how they are asked, and the exact meaning of the terms in the polls.

OK, but it depends on what is meant by "religious." Because young people are highly spiritual and many long for some way to express and practice that spirituality. They just don't want to do it within the confines of a system that they see as dishonest. Young people don't "join (traditional) churches." But they are spiritual.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

Rex!!! Hey man! I don't know if anyone told you but I am totally like worthy of controlling the entire RF right now with your permission! (wary look)...Only joking.

And I tend to notice the same thing! Regards!

 

[Gnostic Seeker]

Skwim pretty well clenched it, heh

 

[gzusfrk]

Well duh, all ya have to do is look out the window.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

OK, but it depends on what is meant by "religious." Because young people are highly spiritual and many long for some way to express and practice that spirituality. They just don't want to do it within the confines of a system that they see as dishonest. Young people don't "join (traditional) churches." But they are spiritual.

That's true, but it doesn't cover the fact up that the younger a person the less likely they are to be religious or spiritual. They are also more likely to hold to some non-traditional views, which these polls reveal as well. But from the amount of these polls that have been done, it can be stated with a fair degree of confidence that the younger the person, the less likely they are to be religious or even spiritual. Yes, there probably are a handful of people who are not being represented accurately, but because so many of these polls have been done and have consistent results the few who are misrepresented are statistically insignificant.

 

[sojourner]

That's true, but it doesn't cover the fact up that the younger a person the less likely they are to be religious or spiritual. They are also more likely to hold to some non-traditional views, which these polls reveal as well. But from the amount of these polls that have been done, it can be stated with a fair degree of confidence that the younger the person, the less likely they are to be religious or even spiritual. Yes, there probably are a handful of people who are not being represented accurately, but because so many of these polls have been done and have consistent results the few who are misrepresented are statistically insignificant.

I think that's more due to the fact that young people don't typically engage in reflective or introspective thought. They think more outwardly than inwardly. Spirituality is, by and large, an inward journey that reflects on outward presentation. The adolescent brain lacks the development for deep introspection. Therefore, spirituality is naturally less pervasive among younger people, as well as it being a cultural trend among Millennials.

 

[sojourner]

So you confirm America is becoming less Christian. They have realized that the creeds of Christianity are mythical.

Regards

The creeds have always been mythic, and were designed to be mythic. it's why you people largely misunderstand them. Have you ever actually read the Nicene Creed??

 

[sun rise]

I think that's more due to the fact that young people don't typically engage in reflective or introspective thought. They think more outwardly than inwardly. Spirituality is, by and large, an inward journey that reflects on outward presentation. The adolescent brain lacks the development for deep introspection. Therefore, spirituality is naturally less pervasive among younger people, as well as it being a cultural trend among Millennials.

For a long time it's seemed quite structural to me. Of course there are exceptions, but most people first need a full developed personality including completing education, becoming engaged in the world and so forth. Then people can start asking themselves questions about the meaning of life.

What is decreasing, I think, is the "follow the parents" automatic acceptance of religion. Religion used to be a requirement for social acceptance and which church a mark of social standing and so forth. I'm glad this structure is disappearing bit by bit. Good riddance.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

What is decreasing, I think, is the "follow the parents" automatic acceptance of religion. Religion used to be a requirement for social acceptance and which church a mark of social standing and so forth. I'm glad this structure is disappearing bit by bit. Good riddance.

That is probably one of the main factors. It's still very much alive, and around here (and I suspect even more as you go further south deeper into the Bible Belt) church going is still widely assumed and not believing in god is seen by many as inherently bad and wrong, but it is changing (just not fast enough around here).

 

[mystic64]

If you're defining "religion" in terms of traditional ways of gathering, affiliating and expressing, I agree. If you're defining "religion" as broadly defining an acknowledgement of a spiritual element to humanity (and the universe), then I disagree. Education, while not being "religious," has not ignored spirituality.

What! How can this be!?

I wondered if you were going to respond to my post too Sojourer, thank you, it is appreciated! First, I like your prediction that religion (the worship of the Creator) is alive and well in the minds of Americans (In God We Trust) and will continue to be. Yea ! But, spirituality to the educated mind is the same thing as Who do Voo do stuff and no rational mind would ever consider it real. The problem is that science is going to prove that it is real because it can be measured .

I have forty years as a yogi mystic, basically advance shawman training, so I know that "spirituality" is real and that it can be measured. And it is just a matter of time until science reaches the point to where they can measure it beyond a shadow of a doubt. And also when this happens the concept of how the DNA computer works is going to be radically changed along with some new approaches to the laws of physics.

Will the existance of God ever be proven? No not really. All that can actually be proven is that some individuals have abilities that they claim come from God that can be measured. And that other individuals have abilities that can be measured that claim that their abilities do not come from any higher source and that God is not needed. Thus the concept of atheism will always be alive and well. And this should be said that whatever a person can do with their mind science can do with a machine. Physics is physics and there is no such thing as magic.

Religion as we know it today is a dinosaur and spirituality as we know it today is in its infancy. Anyway Sojourner, your argument is valid, but for different reasons than what you are using to anchor your argument .

Maybe ?

 

[sojourner]

What! How can this be!?

I wondered if you were going to respond to my post too Sojourer, thank you, it is appreciated! First, I like your prediction that religion (the worship of the Creator) is alive and well in the minds of Americans (In God We Trust) and will continue to be. Yea ! But, spirituality to the educated mind is the same thing as Who do Voo do stuff and no rational mind would ever consider it real. The problem is that science is going to prove that it is real because it can be measured .

I have forty years as a yogi mystic, basically advance shawman training, so I know that "spirituality" is real and that it can be measured. And it is just a matter of time until science reaches the point to where they can measure it beyond a shadow of a doubt. And also when this happens the concept of how the DNA computer works is going to be radically changed along with some new approaches to the laws of physics.

Will the existance of God ever be proven? No not really. All that can actually be proven is that some individuals have abilities that they claim come from God that can be measured. And that other individuals have abilities that can be measured that claim that their abilities do not come from any higher source and that God is not needed. Thus the concept of atheism will always be alive and well. And this should be said that whatever a person can do with their mind science can do with a machine. Physics is physics and there is no such thing as magic.

Religion as we know it today is a dinosaur and spirituality as we know it today is in its infancy. Anyway Sojourner, your argument is valid, but for different reasons than what you are using to anchor your argument .

Maybe ?

I'm going to disagree with your statement about the educated mind thinking spirituality is hoo-doo. I'd say most of the creative, spiritual practitioners are well-educated, liberal people. Many of the "church-like-we-did-in-1950" crowd are not.

 

[paarsurrey]

The creeds have always been mythic, and were designed to be mythic. it's why you people largely misunderstand them. Have you ever actually read the Nicene Creed??

I have read the product of the Nicene that is NT-Bible from cover to cover. There were lot many more books before it:

"The Pre-Nicene New Testament: Fifty-four Formative Texts

In this monumental work, Professor Price offers an inclusive New Testament canon with twenty-seven additional sacred books from the first three centuries of Christianity, including a few of the Dead Sea Scrolls and Nag Hammadi writings. Price also reconstructs the Gospel of Marcion and the lost Gospel according to the Hebrews. Here, for the first time, is a canon representing all major factions of the early church."

http://www.amazon.ca/The-Pre-Nicene-New-Testament-Fifty-four/dp/1560851945

Regards

 

[sojourner]

I have read the product of the Nicene that is NT-Bible from cover to cover. There were lot many more books before it:

"The Pre-Nicene New Testament: Fifty-four Formative Texts

In this monumental work, Professor Price offers an inclusive New Testament canon with twenty-seven additional sacred books from the first three centuries of Christianity, including a few of the Dead Sea Scrolls and Nag Hammadi writings. Price also reconstructs the Gospel of Marcion and the lost Gospel according to the Hebrews. Here, for the first time, is a canon representing all major factions of the early church."

http://www.amazon.ca/The-Pre-Nicene-New-Testament-Fifty-four/dp/1560851945

Regards

I asked if you'd ever read the Nicene Creed. It's got nothing to do with some trumped-up "canon" of scripture. See? This is what I mean. Ya Just. Don't. Get. It.

 

[sun rise]

I'm going to disagree with your statement about the educated mind thinking spirituality is hoo-doo. I'd say most of the creative, spiritual practitioners are well-educated, liberal people. Many of the "church-like-we-did-in-1950" crowd are not.

Pew study:

Nearly half of Hindus in the U.S., one-third of Jews and a quarter of Buddhists have obtained post-graduate education, compared with only about one-in-ten of the adult population overall. Hindus and Jews are also much more likely than other groups to report high income levels.

http://religions.pewforum.org/pdf/table-education-by-tradition.pdf is a table by religion for those that are interested in the actual numbers.

 

[sojourner]

Pew study:



http://religions.pewforum.org/pdf/table-education-by-tradition.pdf is a table by religion for those that are interested in the actual numbers.

Informative, but doesn't speak to my post.