• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Another Example of Pagan Holidays:Valentines Day!

XAAX

Active Member
Not to upset those who don't know it, but just about every Christian holiday was taken from a pagan holiday. I always find it funny how people get upset when you explain this do them...The names and facts where changed to fit the religion thats it...

Did you know that centuries before Christ, the pagan Romans celebrated February 15 and the evening of February 14 as an idolatrous and sensuous festival in honor of Lupercus, the "hunter of wolves"?
The Romans called the festival the "Lupercalia." The custom of exchanging valentines and all the other traditions in honor of Lupercus -- the deified hero-hunter of Rome -- was also linked anciently with the pagan practice of teen-agers "going steady." It usually led to fornication. Today, the custom of "going steady" is thought very modern. It isn't. It is merely a rebirth of an old custom "handed down from the Roman festival of the Lupercalia, celebrated in the month of February, when names of young women were put into a box and drawn out by men as chance directed." That's the admission of the "Encyclopedia Americana", article, "St. Valentine's Day."
When Constantine made Christianity the official religion of the Roman Empire there was some talk in church circles of discarding this pagan free-for-all. But the Roman citizens wouldn't hear of it! So it was agreed that the holiday would continue as it was, except for the more grossly sensual observances.
It w as not until the reign of Pope Gelasius that the holiday became a "Christian custom." As far back as 496, Pope Gelasius changed Lupercalia on February 15 to St. Valentine's Day on February 14." (p. 172 of "Customs and Holidays Around the World" by Lavinia Dobler).
But how did this pagan festival acquire the name of "St. Valentine's Day"? And why is the little naked Cupid of the pagan Romans so often associated today with February 14? And why do little children and young people still cut out hearts and send them on a day in honor of Lupercus the hunter of wolves? Why have we supposed these pagan customs in honor of a false god are Christian?

Who Was the Original "St. Valentine"?
Valentine was a common Roman name. Roman parents often gave the name to their children in honor of the famous man who was first called Valentine in antiquity. That famous man was Lupercus, the HUNTER. But who was Lupercus? -- and why should he have also borne the name Valentine among the heathen Romans?
The Greeks called Lupercus by the name of "Pan". The Semites called Pan "Baal," according to the "Classical Dictionaries". Baal -- mentioned so often in the Bible -- was merely another name for Nimrod, "the mighty HUNTER" (Genesis 10:9). The hunter Nimrod was the Lupercus -- or wolf hunter -- of the Romans. And St. Valentine's Day was originally a day set aside by the pagans in his honor!
But why should Nimrod have been called "Valentine" by the Romans? And why should the celebration of this day have been anciently limited to the city of Rome before Pope Gelasius' time? What part did the site of ancient Rome play in the life of Nimrod?
Valentine comes from the Latin word "Valentinus", a proper name derived from the word "valens", meaning "to be strong," declares "Webster's Unabridged Dictionary". It means literally "strong, powerful, mighty." Any connection with Nimrod? We read in the Bible that Nimrod was the "MIGHTY hunter" (Gen. 10:9). It was a common proverb of ancient time that Nimrod was "the MIGHTY hunter before the Lord." NIMROD WAS THEIR HERO -- THEIR STRONG MAN -- THEIR VALENTINE!
How plain that the original Valentine was Nimrod, the mighty hunter of wolves. Yet another of Nimrod's names was "Sanctus" or "Santa," meaning "Saint." It was a common title of any hero-god. No wonder that the Roman Lupercalia is called "Saint Valentine's Day"!
But why do we associate HEARTS on a day in honor of Nimrod -- the BAAL of the Phoenicians and Semites?
The surprising answer is that the pagan Romans acquired the symbol of the heart from the Babylonians. In the Babylonian tongue the word for "heart" was "bal" (see "Young's" or "Strong's Concordance"). The heart -- "bal" -- was merely a symbol of Nimrod -- the "Baal" or Lord of the Babylonians!

Executed at Rome
Nimrod -- THE ORIGINAL ST. VALENTINE -- was also known as Saturn, the Roman-Babylonian god who HID from his pursuers in a secret place. The Latin word Saturn is derived from the Semitic-speaking Babylonians. It means "be hid," "hide self," "secret," "conceal." The original Semitic (Hebrew) word, from which the Latin Saturn is derived, is used 83 times in the Old Testament (see "Young's Concordance" under "Sathar," also "sether").
According to ancient tradition, Saturn (Nimrod) fled from his pursuers to Italy. The Apennine mountains of Italy were anciently named the mountains of Nembrod or Nimrod. Nimrod briefly hid out at the site where Rome was later built. The ancient name of Rome, before it was rebuilt in 753 B.C., was Saturnia -- the site of Saturn's (Nimrod's) hiding. There he was found and slain for his crimes. Later, professing Christians in Constantine's day made Nimrod -- the St. Valentine of the heathen -- a SAINT of the Church and continued to honor him under the name of a Christian martyr.

Why February 14?
But why should the Romans have chosen February 15 and the evening of February 14 to honor Lupercus -- the Nimrod of the Bible? (Remember that days in ancient times began at sunset the evening before.)
Nimrod -- the Baal or sun god of the ancient pagans -- was said to have been born at the winter solstice. In ancient times the solstice occurred on January 6 and his birthday therefore was celebrated on January 6. Later, as the solstice changed, it was celebrated on December 25 and is now called Christmas. It was the custom of antiquity for the mother of a male child to present herself for purification on the fortieth day after the day of birth. The fortieth day after January 6 -- Nimrod's original birthdate -- takes us to February 15, the celebration of which began on the evening of February 14 -- the Lupercalia or St. Valentine's Day.
On this day in February, Semiramis, the mother of Nimrod, was said to have been PURIFIED and to have appeared for the first time in public with her son as the original "mother and child."
The Roman month February, in fact, derives its name from the "februa" which the Roman priests used in the rites celebrated on St. Valentine's Day. The "februa" were thongs from the skins of sacrificial animals used in rites of purification on the evening of February 14.

Cupid Makes His Appearance
Another name for the child Nimrod was "Cupid" -- meaning "desire" ("Encyclopedia Britannica", art., "Cupid"). It is said that when Nimrod's mother saw him, she LUSTED after him -- she DESIRED him. Nimrod became her Cupid -- her desired one -- and later her Valentine! So evil was Nimrod's mother that IT IS SAID SHE MARRIED HER OWN SON! Inscribed on the monuments of ancient Egypt are inscriptions that Nimrod (the Egyptians called him Osiris) was "the husband of his mother."
As Nimrod grew up, he became the child-hero of MANY women who DESIRED him. He was their Cupid! In the Book of Daniel he is called the "DESIRE of women" (Dan. 11:37). Moffatt translates the word as Tammuz -- a Babylonian name of Nimrod. He provoked so many women to JEALOUSY that an idol of him was often called the "image of jealousy" (Ezekiel 8:5). Nimrod, the hunter, was also their Valentine -- their strong or mighty hero! No wonder the pagans commemorated their hero-hunter Nimrod, or Baal, by sending heartshaped love tokens to one another on the evening of February 14 as a symbol of him.
 

Lindsey-Loo

Steel Magnolia
Very interesting. I don't get upset in the least, personally, when I hear about all of these 'Christian' holidays that come from Pagan holidays. What does upset me is the term 'Christian holiday'. Someone enlighten me on what these Christian holidays are, please. I've read the Bible cover to cover, and I've never seen the commandment to celebrate Christmas or Valentine's Day or Easter as Christian holidays in there anywhere. I celebrate them...but they have nothing to do with anything religious for me. Not meaning to get off topic or anything. :) But yeah, that was interesting to read, thanks for posting!
 

XAAX

Active Member
Anade said:
Very interesting. I don't get upset in the least, personally, when I hear about all of these 'Christian' holidays that come from Pagan holidays. What does upset me is the term 'Christian holiday'. Someone enlighten me on what these Christian holidays are, please. I've read the Bible cover to cover, and I've never seen the commandment to celebrate Christmas or Valentine's Day or Easter as Christian holidays in there anywhere. I celebrate them...but they have nothing to do with anything religious for me. Not meaning to get off topic or anything. :) But yeah, that was interesting to read, thanks for posting!

Well Anade, when you start telling the devout that all their "special holidays", including the day Jesus was born were all pre-existing pagan holidays it tends to throw them in a tizzy...It makes them feel less significant...:eek:
 

Quiddity

UndertheInfluenceofGiants
Yeah, we have a tendency of adapting pagan culture and making a part of ourselves. Nothing new....
 

Feathers in Hair

World's Tallest Hobbit
And I think that many of those pagan cultures probably adopted and adapted from other cultures before them. As Victor said, nothing new. Just how humans tend to work.
 

XAAX

Active Member
Feathers in Hair said:
And I think that many of those pagan cultures probably adopted and adapted from other cultures before them. As Victor said, nothing new. Just how humans tend to work.

Oh, most certainly Feathers. I am not stating this as some ground shattering new idea. The people here are pretty informed when it comes to religious history and what not. You should see the reaction of telling Southern Baptist what I stated. They loose their minds...lol...I was just seeing if there were any among us in here. I guess I am guilty at poking at the glass from time to time for my own amusement...:run:
 

Arabis

see me run
It is just like the symbols that Christian religions use, we got them from somewhere, but it doesn't really matter where. We apply a meaning to a holiday or a symbol and we make it our own. I see nothing wrong or upsetting about that.
 

XAAX

Active Member
Arabis said:
It is just like the symbols that Christian religions use, we got them from somewhere, but it doesn't really matter where. We apply a meaning to a holiday or a symbol and we make it our own. I see nothing wrong or upsetting about that.

As long as the symbols themselves aren't negative I agree with you...None of the holidays that Christians took from the pagans are evil.
 

athanasius

Well-Known Member
XAAX said:
Not to upset those who don't know it, but just about every Christian holiday was taken from a pagan holiday. I always find it funny how people get upset when you explain this do them...The names and facts where changed to fit the religion thats it...


I knew that some of the days and seasons coincided. We definantly could have borrowed that from them. Ie..we Baptised the pagan holidays and used some of thier symbols. But he meanings behind them ie the Holdiay itslef and what was celebrated had a totaqlly different meaning. Why would this worry a Christian?

Just becuase something can be traced back originally to paganism does that mean that it is displeasing to God? Certainly not! Jews and Christians practiced circumcison and that can be traced back orignally to paganism. That didn't stop god from using it as a old covenanent sign for his people of Isreal. Either which way, how does using the day or season or even some its symbols equate us(Christians) with taking the whole holiday from the pagans? Did the Pagans Patent the holiday? I didn't know we patent it either? The Roman Pagans would borrow all thier Gods and holidays from Greeks and other relgions. We only borrowed seasons, a few symbols, and some general days, not the actual meaning of the holiday! I didn't know the Pagans celebrated Jesus Christ birthday and resurrection too? Wow, learn somthing new everyday!
 

Gentoo

The Feisty Penguin
Maybe it's just me, but I actually get a bit annoyed when I hear people say that the Christians stole Pagan holidays...
 

Bishka

Veteran Member
XAAX said:
Well Anade, when you start telling the devout that all their "special holidays", including the day Jesus was born were all pre-existing pagan holidays it tends to throw them in a tizzy...It makes them feel less significant...:eek:

Not entirely. I'm as devout as any other, and it doesn't bother me in the leastest. It's a date, it could have been any other day and it wouldn't matter. That date doesn't matter, what is being celebrated matters.
 

darkpenguin

Charismatic Enigma
beckysoup61 said:
Not entirely. I'm as devout as any other, and it doesn't bother me in the leastest. It's a date, it could have been any other day and it wouldn't matter. That date doesn't matter, what is being celebrated matters.

I still find it odd that the exact birth date for the 'savior' isn't known!
Thats why it bugs me that yule (a date close yes i know!) was used to celebrate his birth.
It makes me question just how important Jesus really was for his birthdate to be lost in history by his 'devout' followers!
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
I personally feel that the sacredness of a holiday comes from the individual; it is wrought through the meaning that one attributes to it through past experience. Holidays really aren't owned by religions, they are owned by individuals.
 

Bishka

Veteran Member
darkpenguin said:
I still find it odd that the exact birth date for the 'savior' isn't known!

Why? Does it matter in the eternal scheme of things to know someones birthday, or know them?

darkpenguin said:
Thats why it bugs me that yule (a date close yes i know!) was used to celebrate his birth.
It makes me question just how important Jesus really was for his birthdate to be lost in history by his 'devout' followers!

It's not, it's the reason that it is being celebrated that counts.
 
Basing Christian holy days on pagan feast days is a very common occurence. It is similar to Christians taking over pagan temples and making them into churches. There is a symbolism there: a baptism of sorts.

So yes, many Christian holidays do share the dates with pagan holidays. I don't see how this reduces the validity of Christianity in any way...
 

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
XAAX said:
Not to upset those who don't know it, but just about every Christian holiday was taken from a pagan holiday. I always find it funny how people get upset when you explain this do them...The names and facts where changed to fit the religion thats it...
I don't think you'll find very many RFers who aren't well-aware of that fact, and I don't personally know anybody who celebrates Valentines Day as a religious holiday anyway. I'm just glad my husband remembered the flowers!!
 

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
XAAX said:
As long as the symbols themselves aren't negative I agree with you...None of the holidays that Christians took from the pagans are evil.
Well, I'm sure there is somebody somewhere who can find some negative connotations associated with a heart-shaped box of chocolates but it's not going to be me!
 
Top