Antisemitism and free speech on college campus

[Orbit]

it really *should* be treated differently though after reading their "covenant":

https://embassies.gov.il/holysee/AboutIsrael/the-middle-east/Pages/The%20Hamas-Covenant.aspx#:~:text=The%20Hamas%20charter%20is%20the,18%20years%20of%20its%20existence.

Why? The IDF thinks the same way about the Palestinians. Just look at what their soldiers post on twitter.

 

[George Washington]

Why? The IDF thinks the same way about the Palestinians. Just look at what their soldiers post on twitter.

There's a difference between a government openly calling for the death of every Jew, and the full implementation of Islamic rule and jihad.

That's different from the tweets of everyday people speaking on their own, individual behalf.

 

[Orbit]

There's a difference between a government openly calling for the death of every Jew, and the full implementation of Islamic rule and jihad.

That's different from the tweets of everyday people speaking on their own, individual behalf.

How is calling for the death of every Palestinian different?

 

[George Washington]

How is calling for the death of every Palestinian different?

Who's doing that?

 

[Orbit]

Who's doing that?

Well, we've got Netanyahu and other Israeli officials comparing the Palestinians to the Amaleks, and kids singing about wiping out every Palestinian in Gaza on Israeli public TV, so there's a lot of genocidal rhetoric to choose from.

 

[George Washington]

Well, we've got Netanyahu and other Israeli officials comparing the Palestinians to the Amaleks, and kids singing about wiping out every Palestinian in Gaza on Israeli public TV, so there's a lot of genocidal rhetoric to choose from.

IOW, Israel has not officially called for the extermination of all Palestinians like Hamas has.

This is exactly why Hamas should *never* be supported by any good person, let alone by any University professor holding a position of influence.

 

[sun rise]

We really don't need this thread turned into a rehash of a dozen other threads. There's a specific issue that should be focused on and that is the responsibilities and duties of universities when it comes to hate speech.

 

[George Washington]

We really don't need this thread turned into a rehash of a dozen other threads. There's a specific issue that should be focused on and that is the responsibilities and duties of universities when it comes to hate speech.

Exactly, and when we have a Cornell university professor claiming he felt "exhilarated" and "energized" by Hamas' attack, he should probably be relieved of duty.

 

[sun rise]

Exactly, and when we have university professors claiming they felt "exhilarated" by Hamas' attacks, they should probably be relieved of duty.

Supporting murdering babies, raping & murdering women of all ages etc is way over the line.

 

[Colt]

"... the point of college is to keep you physically safe but intellectually unsafe, to force you to confront ideas that you disagree with passionately." - CNN's Van Jones

This quote is found in today's Fareed Zakaria's Opinion: Why university presidents are under fire which begins:

When one thinks of America’s greatest strengths, the kind of assets the world looks at with admiration and envy, America’s elite universities would have long been at the top of that list. But the American public has been losing faith in these universities – and with good reason.​

​

Three university presidents came under fire this week for their vague and indecisive answers when asked whether calling for the genocide of Jews would violate their institution’s code of conduct. But to understand their performance we have to understand the shift that has taken place at elite universities, which have gone from centers of excellence to institutions pushing political agendas.​

I'm interested in your views.

Seems easy to answer the concerns of the Congress if i was a college president.

President Colt of The College of Hard Knocks.

"Dear people of Congress, at CHK we have long supported free political speech. While we support diverse, vigorous dialogue and or protest concerning the long debated Palestinian issue, we do NOT support, nor will we tolerate threats against individuals, groups or nations based on racial, religious or political affiliation anywhere on our campuses or affiliated student and faculty organizations. Failure to adhere to these simple guidelines may result in disbanding of student or faculty organizations and possibly expulsion from enrolment or employment. We are currently reviewing and assessing recent speech and behavior on our campus in regard to the Oct 7 terror attacks in Israel."

Thanks you

Grand Poobah, his wokeness,

Colt

 

[Debater Slayer]

it really *should* be treated differently on campus though after reading their "covenant":

https://embassies.gov.il/holysee/AboutIsrael/the-middle-east/Pages/The%20Hamas-Covenant.aspx#:~:text=The%20Hamas%20charter%20is%20the,18%20years%20of%20its%20existence.

We really don't need this thread turned into a rehash of a dozen other threads. There's a specific issue that should be focused on and that is the responsibilities and duties of universities when it comes to hate speech.

Yep, that's why I refrained from elaborating further on that point here.

@George Washington My response to your above post is best left for another thread. Feel free to tag me if you decide to start one focused on the IDF and Hamas (or if you bring it up in a thread where elaborating on that comparison would be on topic).

 

[George Washington]

Yep, that's why I refrained from pursuing that tangent.

@George Washington My response to your above post is best left for another thread. Feel free to tag me if you decide to start one focused on the IDF and Hamas (or if you bring it up in a thread where elaborating on that comparison would be on topic).

All of my posts are in reference to "campus", "universities", "professors" etc, so exactly on topic. Not sure what you're talking about, but if you don't want to respond to my posts, that's entirely alright.

 

[Debater Slayer]

All of my posts are in reference to "campus", "universities", "professors" etc, so exactly on topic. Not sure what you're talking about, but if you don't want to respond to my posts, that's entirely alright.

I was talking about the tangent that would result in this thread if we both further pursued the comparison I drew between the IDF and Hamas. I wouldn't mind engaging in further discussion or debate about that point, but it would be better suited for another thread since it would shift the focus of this thread away from the subject of universities' codes of conduct and how they should regulate campus speech, if at all.

 

[George Washington]

I was talking about the tangent that would result if we both pursued the comparison I drew between the IDF and Hamas. I wouldn't mind engaging in further discussion or debate about that point, but it would be better suited for another thread since it would shift the focus of this thread away from the subject of universities' codes of conduct and how they should regulate campus speech, if at all.

Oh okay. I felt like I was being singled out for a second, but if that's the case, then I can accept your point.

 

[Debater Slayer]

Oh okay. I felt like I was being singled out for a second, but if that's the case, then I can accept your point.

No, I didn't mean to single you (or anyone else) out; I'm applying what I said to myself too, hence not elaborating on the point here.

Thanks for understanding. This is my last post in this specific exchange, to avoid derailing the thread.

Back on topic: I think this is an informative article about whether the First Amendment applies to universities, including the distinction between public and private ones:

The Basics | PEN America

The First Amendment The First Amendment protects people’s rights to free speech, expression, press, and assembly, as well as the right to petition the

campusfreespeechguide.pen.org

Private universities don't have to abide by the highly permissive limits of the First Amendment, so their restrictions on campus speech can be much tougher than those of a public university. Of course, it's still a subjective call whether they should make use of their right to regulate campus speech beyond the boundaries of the First Amendment and, if so, to what extent.

 

[Orbit]

IOW, Israel has not officially called for the extermination of all Palestinians like Hamas has.

This is exactly why Hamas should *never* be supported by any good person, let alone by any University professor holding a position of influence.

I’m not sure what you mean by your last sentence. Are you accusing me of supporting Hamas? If you are I’d like to see the evidence for that claim.

 

[George Washington]

I’m not sure what you mean by your last sentence. Are you accusing me of supporting Hamas? If you are I’d like to see the evidence for that claim.

I wasn't thinking that, no.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Why? The IDF thinks the same way about the Palestinians.

All of them? Most of them? Is it your intent to model bigotry or are you simply unaware of what you gross generalizations represent?

 

[Orbit]

All of them? Most of them? Is it your intent to model bigotry or are you simply unaware of what you gross generalizations represent?

You tire me. I was responding to one gross generalization with another. But if you want evidence of what I'm talking about, just look at twitter.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

No one on a college campus has called for Jewish genocide---it's a red herring.

Were the university presidents asked if their students had called for genocide, or were they asked if calling for genocide violated their university's code of conduct? Do you understand the difference?