Got any clue what Allah's justification might be ?
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any muslims against polygamy
- Thread starter MochaRadha
- Start date
Got any clue what Allah's justification might be ?
In a clash between scripture and rationality, many people would choose either rationality or reinterpret scripture to make it compatible with rationality.
Sorry to note that Quran allows no such freedom to its followers.
So, can I take it to mean that there is no rational reason [without taking to scripture, that is] you can provide to explain why a man can have 4 wives [why not 3 or 5?] but a woman cannot have even 2 husbands?
In what sense are you a "moderate Muslim" if I may ask?
I did not realize i was a moderate Muslim ?
I have read the Quran and found it similar to most religious writing although it does ramp up the fear factor more so than most (IMO).
Religion was recognized long ago for its ability to control the masses. The Egyptians had a concept called Maat. Maat represented the structure and order in the world. Maat was crucial in human life and embraced notions of reciprocity, justice truth and so on. At the end of days ones life was weighed on the scales of justice. If one was found too light you were fed to a monster and that was it.
Fast forward through Judaism to Christianity and we start to see the ideas of punishment in the afterlife. This fear was very successful in controling the masses and the Church and Kings recognized this power ... especially under monotheism.
Under monotheism the King and/or religious leader could speak for God .. and who can argue with God.
Constantine had seen the Persian empire united under Zoroastrianism. He ruled at a time of trememdous chaos. He chose Christianity as a religion.. sorted out the issue of the divinity of Jesus by implementing and enforcing the Trinity as doctrine and took the title Pontifex Maximus (Bishop of Bishops). As with Persia the Roman empire was united under Christianity and the Church held tremendous power over the people and this power grew with time.
This lesson was not lost on Muhammad who also lived at a time of chaos. Muhammad followed the Christian model by adopting Judaism but he really ramped up the fear factor. Do this and suffer eternally .. dont to that and be thrown into a pit of fire .. page after page. The impact of this kind of fear based indoctrination on children is long lasting and profound.
As with Zoroastrianism (which also had the concept of punishment in the afterlife), and Christianity before it .. the model of using fear of punishment in the afterlife worked extremely well for Islam.
The real God of Abraham however was neither Yahweh nor Allah. The God of Abraham was "El" (Father and Creator). Enlil/Ellil is the Sumerian equivalent. If you want a far more detailed account of the creation of man than is given in Genesis read the creation account given in the Sumerian "atrahasis text".
El .. as described in Genesis and in Psalms .. is one of many Gods. He also had many wives so perhaps in this one can find some justification for Polygamy !
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F0uad
Well-Known Member
I just did your being dishonest read my previous message.
Like i said we do not need to explain ourselves on this subject its the law period, off-course people can (try to marry) more then one husband but that's just breaking the Islamic-Law since you ''promote'' freedom let us follow our Religion as we want.
If you really want to ask why the limitation or why can woman's not marry more then one husband i am willing to give my version of but i advice you to post it on the Islam Dir since its going to be a question.
F0uad
Well-Known Member
What has this to do with the Title or the Subject?Since the Christian scriptures do not limit how many woman's you can have i would say that Christianity does the same thing heck the prophets/messengers and sons of god who are the ''perfect'' examples had more then 2 according to your own scripture and some even 600.
Its funny talking about a fear-concept while you aren't a Muslim how can you speak for ''Us'' ? Its not Fear that we have its Love towards god and its creations the Quran is not to be read as a fearing book but as a moral book, miss-use of the laws are a way to ''fear'' people.
The Bible itself keeps ramping on the subject to follow the commandments or else we are going to hell i really don't think you have anything to say here.
A-ManESL
Well-Known Member
I feel the spirit of the Quran is against polygamy. It doesn't outright reject it (and sanctions it in precisely 1 verse) because of the context of its time. The verses of the Quran have to be understood at various levels, some have historical context and should not be applied arbitrarily at all times to suit one's desires. The purpose is to have a balanced life in harmony with God's will, and if the situation today (which in many places it is) is that some ruling comes into conflict with that, then that is happening because the real intention of the Quran is being overlooked for a superficial/incorrect understanding.
The verse sanctioning polygamy In was revealed in the context of a time when warfare was seen as a part and parcel of life. It had a necessary after-effect of leaving many widows with children with no means of sustenance. Specially after the battle of Uhud, when the Muslims had suffered a terrible defeat with the death of nearly one tenth of the population (and an even greater percentage of men) there was a dire need of looking after the orphan girls and widows. Hence the the verse in the Quran sanctioning polygamy was revealed. It started with "If you deem it best for orphans..." (How many Muslims marry again to look after orphans?)
So the Quran permitted men to take upto 4 wives in the existing situation (in fact before this verse there was no limit on the number of wives a man could take), while stressing upon the fair dealing that each wife was supposed to get. That all wives should be treated fairly and equally was important aspect of this permission. In fact, Hazrat Ali(RA) was denied permission to take another wife by the Prophet on the basis that he “shall not be able to deal justly” with two women. (Sharia Law And Society—Tradition And Change in South Asia, by Alamgir Muhammad Serajuddin. Oxford University Press: 2001, p.160.)
Moreover, in the seventh year of the Hijra, long after the Battle of Uhud had passed and thus the ratio of men to women in Muslim society stabilized, Verse 52 of Sura 33 of the Quran was revealed. The verse stated:
I have read somewhere that after the revelation of the verse above, even the Prophet refrained from marrying again.
The Egyptian scholar Muhammad Abduh has professed the opinion that polygamy is unlawful and prohibited. Moreover Abduh also opinioned that since the conditions in which polygamy was allowed have ceased to exist, and now the practice is being used by uncommitted people not for any sake of God (as was originally intentioned), but for personal interest, it would be appropriate to withhold or ban the practice.
Regards
The verse sanctioning polygamy In was revealed in the context of a time when warfare was seen as a part and parcel of life. It had a necessary after-effect of leaving many widows with children with no means of sustenance. Specially after the battle of Uhud, when the Muslims had suffered a terrible defeat with the death of nearly one tenth of the population (and an even greater percentage of men) there was a dire need of looking after the orphan girls and widows. Hence the the verse in the Quran sanctioning polygamy was revealed. It started with "If you deem it best for orphans..." (How many Muslims marry again to look after orphans?)
So the Quran permitted men to take upto 4 wives in the existing situation (in fact before this verse there was no limit on the number of wives a man could take), while stressing upon the fair dealing that each wife was supposed to get. That all wives should be treated fairly and equally was important aspect of this permission. In fact, Hazrat Ali(RA) was denied permission to take another wife by the Prophet on the basis that he “shall not be able to deal justly” with two women. (Sharia Law And Society—Tradition And Change in South Asia, by Alamgir Muhammad Serajuddin. Oxford University Press: 2001, p.160.)
Moreover, in the seventh year of the Hijra, long after the Battle of Uhud had passed and thus the ratio of men to women in Muslim society stabilized, Verse 52 of Sura 33 of the Quran was revealed. The verse stated:
I have read somewhere that after the revelation of the verse above, even the Prophet refrained from marrying again.
The Egyptian scholar Muhammad Abduh has professed the opinion that polygamy is unlawful and prohibited. Moreover Abduh also opinioned that since the conditions in which polygamy was allowed have ceased to exist, and now the practice is being used by uncommitted people not for any sake of God (as was originally intentioned), but for personal interest, it would be appropriate to withhold or ban the practice.
Regards
People can choose to believe whatever they want; again, if a woman wants to marry multiple men, she doesn't need scriptural approval to do so. Islam (or any other Abrahamic religion) is not made to conform to human desires; if this religion doesn't fit your needs, pick another one.
I don't know why women aren't allowed more than one husband. Maybe the needs of four husbands for one woman is too much to handle. Perhaps even the day-to-day interaction of four husbands to one wife would be too difficult. Maybe God thinks men would be too jealous of each other and their machismo would get in the way. I don't know anymore than you, so I'm not sure what you expect.
I'm moderate because I think for myself.
A Troubled Man
Active Member
I think statements like that undermine what gods expect from their followers. It seems like the expectation is which gods can offer a system of belief that coincides with the individuals wants and needs, instead.
It appears more as if the individual should choose between a bowling league and a chess club.
So much for gods.
A Troubled Man
Active Member
I have often heard such explanations regarding context and circumstance in regards to questionable verses in the Quran. If what you say is true, then anything regarding polygamy in the Quran is irrelevant today.
If that were the case, and there were more verses in the Quran that follow the same logic of context and circumstance, they too are irrelevant today.
And, as we find more and more irrelevancies in the Quran because of context and circumstance, we can begin to deconstruct the Quran as mostly irrelevant in today's world.
And, isn't that what some Muslims and many non Muslims are asking, that Islam take a good hard look at itself, remove the irrelevancies and grab hold of the modern world rather than living in the past medieval world?
FearGod
Freedom Of Mind
Why you're saying that woman is as sexual as men,do you mean that you marry man just to satisfy your sexual needs.
i thought women are more concerned about their children and their family than just
need the body of man for only sexual relationship.
So honestly,if you're allowed to marry as much as you want of men,then how many you'll choose.
Marble
Rolling Marble
7 - one for ech day of the week. :yes:
No, God has expectations (much like parents do) and we can either follow them or not.
For what it's worth, I agree with you that there are aspects of Islam that could stand a more modern looking at; there are some scholars who are trying to do just that, and I hope they are successful.