Yerda
Veteran Member
Cheers, man.
Steve Pinker's Blank Slate was a good read that touched issues close to this one.
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Are People Born Good, Evil, or Indifferent?
- Thread starter Rainbow Mage
- Start date
Steve Pinker's Blank Slate was a good read that touched issues close to this one.
Thanks! That was the book I couldn't recall. Much more on topic, I think, than Marc Hauser might be.
Nadia Faiazova
Member
Bible says we all are born with the sin.-Romans 3:23. Although we can reflect on good qualities,because we were created in God's image,(Genesis 1:27) which means we can have the same good qualities as God Almighty has- love, wisdom, mercy, justice and so on.
Primordial Annihilator
Well-Known Member
Some people are born without a concience...this is natural...we have always needed ruthless and reckless people to do the things we cannot stomach doing ourselves.
Others have their conciences eroded...or become apathetic to the concience...as millions of germans once demonstrated.
But the aforementioned people (natural born psychopaths) must also be recognised as such and monitored as they are potentially very dangerous.
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waitasec
Veteran Member
waitasec
Veteran Member
the bible also says, every inclination of the human heart is evil from childhood
a statement that comes from ignorance...wait, is god ignorant?
or is god contradicting himself...
Numinous
Philosopher
First you have the problem of defining good and evil.
Next you have the problem of understanding the brain and DNA.
If you ever get all those variables in sync, be sure to let me know so I can go the the Nobel Prize award ceremony when it is handed to you.
PolyHedral
Superabacus Mystic
Everyone is born greedy. Whether this qualifies as "evil" depends on the context.
Numinous
Philosopher
"mama feed me"
Gaura Priya
IRL
I believe that everyone is born in a neutral state... that we have complete innocence until five years old, when we begin to establish for our own selves what is good and what is bad. No child is born evil, as if sin or sinful natures is something inborn or successively genetic.
I am a child of God,
and He has sent me here;
has given me and earthly home
with parents kind and dear.
Lead me, guide me, walk beside me,
Help me find the way.
Teach me all that I must do
To live with Him some day.
[youtube]jW5bKEc8hQg[/youtube]
YouTube - Mormon Children sing "I Am a Child of God"
Now how can you say that they are necessarily evil? Besides the occasional annoyances and botherations...
I am a child of God,
and He has sent me here;
has given me and earthly home
with parents kind and dear.
Lead me, guide me, walk beside me,
Help me find the way.
Teach me all that I must do
To live with Him some day.
[youtube]jW5bKEc8hQg[/youtube]
YouTube - Mormon Children sing "I Am a Child of God"
Now how can you say that they are necessarily evil? Besides the occasional annoyances and botherations...
BruceDLimber
Well-Known Member
We're all born good!
As the Baha'i scriptures put it,
"O SON OF SPIRIT!
"Noble I created thee, yet thou hast abased thyself. Rise then unto that for which thou wast created."
­The Hidden Words, Part One, #22
Best!
Bruce
Alex_G
Enlightner of the Senses
I think the question drives you towards the wrong way of thinking about it.
I personally believe the words 'good' and 'bad', can only be meaningfully attributed to a person who has the capacity, and responsibility to be one or the other. One must be a rational and conscious being, mature of mind and able to hold responsibility for their actions. Then they can be deemed good or bad. What a new born baby is, is a mind that has capacity to become either good or bad. It is pre game as it were, and not sensibly good or bad at such an early stage of life.
Of course i imagine genes will play somewhat of a role in the development of behavioural characteristics, just as early environmental factors will. I would not be surprised if early childhood factors heavily influence what sort of adult emerges, and to what degree ones moral designation is predetermined, and not completely under the control of the individual. The question then becomes, to what degree are these people responsible?
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Primordial Annihilator
Well-Known Member
We're all born good!
As the Baha'i scriptures put it,
"O SON OF SPIRIT!
"Noble I created thee, yet thou hast abased thyself. Rise then unto that for which thou wast created."
*The Hidden Words, Part One, #22
Best!
Bruce
I really dont think so...
I was born evil and I will die evil...if by evil you mean a clinically diagnosed sociopath with scant regard for any human being alive.
However I know that one must strive to do the right thing and ignore the ego if one chooses to live in a functioning society be that within a family or a community or a nation...so I choose to do the right thing not because of my concience, because I don't actually have one...because I WILL it to be.
Now..dont tell me I am a good person really because trust me on this, I am not...I just know I have to act is if I was...for my own benefit ultimately....as well as everyone elses.
It took me a long time and a lot of court appearences to realise this....
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Primordial Annihilator
Well-Known Member
However as I have gotten older I have gotten far more...sentimental.
Perhaps I am growing a concience.....
Perhaps I am growing a concience.....
I haven't read the whole thread, but is it being taken into account here that humans are born "scarce half made up"? That we are not nearly complete in our development at birth?
For instance: We are not born with altruism. But in the normal course of development, altruistic behavior will begin to emerge around age 7 or so. That's true of nearly everyone except sociopaths and such. So, of what use or importance is it to discuss this issue without taking into account all that occurs during normal human development?
For instance: We are not born with altruism. But in the normal course of development, altruistic behavior will begin to emerge around age 7 or so. That's true of nearly everyone except sociopaths and such. So, of what use or importance is it to discuss this issue without taking into account all that occurs during normal human development?
Primordial Annihilator
Well-Known Member
The post I responded to annoyed me...I had tried to strangle my baby brother with a toy telephone when I was a tender 2...they found him a deep blue colour...
Kids eh?
St Giordano Bruno
Well-Known Member
People are born totally innocent as they are so incapable of any moral reasoning which I guess that makes them good if you equate innocence with good. I very much despise the doctrine that we are all born as little sinners which can be magically pardoned and excused with just the simple ritual of splashing a cup of water over their heads with Baptism.
Primordial Annihilator
Well-Known Member
Innocence does not equate good...good is an ideal.
BruceDLimber
Well-Known Member
Nope: that had to happen later. As the saying goes,
"As the twig is bent, so grows the tree!
Not to mention:
CCXXII "Man is the supreme Talisman. Lack of a proper education hath, however, deprived him of that which he doth inherently possess.... Regard man as a mine rich in gems of inestimable value. Education can, alone, cause it to reveal its treasures, and enable mankind to benefit therefrom."
Gleanings, pp. 259-260
Bruce
Primordial Annihilator
Well-Known Member
I utterly disagree...I know myself...I have never had any feelings of guilt...ever.
I dont feel pity or mercy unless I want to...I can compartamentalise my actions.
I have always been so.
No amount of fanciful wishfull thinking will change that.
You are ignorant of the facts...psycopaths and sociopaths like myself are not born with the ability to feel guilt or remorse...all we have is a fear of being reprimanded.
Your view here is very dangerous...for you....you do not understand.
I dont feel pity or mercy unless I want to...I can compartamentalise my actions.
I have always been so.
No amount of fanciful wishfull thinking will change that.
You are ignorant of the facts...psycopaths and sociopaths like myself are not born with the ability to feel guilt or remorse...all we have is a fear of being reprimanded.
Your view here is very dangerous...for you....you do not understand.