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Are sexually immoral thoughts considered Sin

1213

Well-Known Member
I am married. My husband and I are on opposites poles with our sexuality. He is of a "vanilla" taste which mine are very much not. Is it considered a sin to have sexual immoral thoughts ...

I have understood sin means actually that person rejects God, or is without God. If you reject God, you have sin. If you don’t reject God, you don’t have sin. But, even if something is not sin, it is not necessarily good for you.

If you think you have something immoral, I would recommend to think, why it is immoral and why it is not good or bad. If it is truly immoral and bad, then I would think, why it is bad. And after that, why would one want something that is bad. Bad is harmful and I think it would be reasonable to try to avoid it.

And how person understands these, tells is person righteous and those who are, will get eternal life, according to the Bible.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
I am married. My husband and I are on opposites poles with our sexuality. He is of a "vanilla" taste which mine are very much not. Is it considered a sin to have sexual immoral thoughts during sex with your husband to obtain sexual pleasure while thinking of a sexual act with a faceless person (the faceless person performing my sexual fantasy on me) to achieve sexual satisfaction?

Yes, everything that can be considered fun is a sin!
 

Bird123

Well-Known Member
I am married. My husband and I are on opposites poles with our sexuality. He is of a "vanilla" taste which mine are very much not. Is it considered a sin to have sexual immoral thoughts during sex with your husband to obtain sexual pleasure while thinking of a sexual act with a faceless person (the faceless person performing my sexual fantasy on me) to achieve sexual satisfaction?


Somehow, isn't the real problem being ignored?? Communication is key in any relationship. Is there any communication about sex?

A relationship should never be one sided. So often a relationship is a meeting in the middle or at least a movement toward the middle.

God places couples together as part of the learning and growing process. Sometimes this takes Drama. On the other hand, most of the learning and growing is centered around Drama. It should not always be avoided. Opposites attract for a very good reason: there is more learning and growing.

One can start walking with baby steps toward the middle. So often Discovery along our journey makes one wonder why the path wasn't taken sooner.

Is sex of any kind a sin? God returns our actions and choices so one will understand all sides. If your actions or choices are those that return well, I would say it is a good choice.

God is not controlling, hating or condemning. God made sex good for reasons. I would not allow mankind to corrupt the goodness God provides.

Like I said before: Communication is key in every relationship. This helps in countless ways than you can imagine. It leads to Happiness for all.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I am married. My husband and I are on opposites poles with our sexuality. He is of a "vanilla" taste which mine are very much not. Is it considered a sin to have sexual immoral thoughts during sex with your husband to obtain sexual pleasure while thinking of a sexual act with a faceless person (the faceless person performing my sexual fantasy on me) to achieve sexual satisfaction?
I don't think so, and I used to have those back in the day.... ;)

According to my religion the only restriction on sex is that it has to be between married people.
So, have fun. :)
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Yes, everything that can be considered fun is a sin!
No, not if it is between a man and a woman who are married. :D

“The proper use of the sex instinct is the natural right of every individual, and it is precisely for this very purpose that the institution of marriage has been established. The Bahá'ís do not believe in the suppression of the sex impulse but in its regulation and control.” Lights of Guidance (second part): A Bahá'í Reference File, pp. 364-365
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
You'd think he'd at least get your name right as he exclaims.

FAIRNESS TEST:

https://www.visitcalifornia.com/experience/how-you-can-support-californias-black-owned-businesses/

Is it fair to advocate supporting Black owned businesses? My fairness test changes color (to White, for example), and I ask if it still seems fair to advocate shopping at only White owned businesses.

However, this reverse discrimination is designed to balance out the inequity caused by bigotry.

Applying this fairness test to marriage, I will change the words from "marriage" to "church," and ask if it still seems fair.

Lets ask the new question: If you were a Christian, and went to church to worship God, would it be fair to attend a Satanic compound, telling God that you are still thinking of Him?

Obviously, fidelity is about thoughts, not just actions.

So, Playboy magazines (which covet someone other than your wife) are contrary to God's laws.

Romans 9:13: God hated Esau because he inherited Adam's hatred of God. We can see that God, without seeing actions, knew what was in Esau's heart.

If you are going to murder a man in cold blood, and steal his money, but, while you take careful aim, a truck runs you over and kills you, will you go to heaven? Obviously, heaven would be filled with murderous people with evil hearts who are also incompetent if such people got into heaven.

Thoughts are far more important than actions.
 

PruePhillip

Well-Known Member
I am married. My husband and I are on opposites poles with our sexuality. He is of a "vanilla" taste which mine are very much not. Is it considered a sin to have sexual immoral thoughts during sex with your husband to obtain sexual pleasure while thinking of a sexual act with a faceless person (the faceless person performing my sexual fantasy on me) to achieve sexual satisfaction?

There's an old joke about a woman asking her husband to hurry up. He said he's trying
but he "can't think of anybody."
Is that what you mean?
If so I guess that's just a part of life, and male psychology. In Christianity it's a 'sin' to
think lustful thoughts, but two points - EVERYONE thinks lustful thoughts (and about
any topic BTW) and secondly, it's different if the person DOESN'T ACT OUT THOSE
THOUGHTS.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I am married. My husband and I are on opposites poles with our sexuality. He is of a "vanilla" taste which mine are very much not. Is it considered a sin to have sexual immoral thoughts during sex with your husband to obtain sexual pleasure while thinking of a sexual act with a faceless person (the faceless person performing my sexual fantasy on me) to achieve sexual satisfaction?
I just noticed you are a Catholic. From what I know Catholics have many rules in their rule-book. Isn't that covered?
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
But, even if something is not sin, it is not necessarily good for you.
Good point.

John 3:5-7 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

1 John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Matthew 16:23-26 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

 

fallenangel

New Member
I just noticed you are a Catholic. From what I know Catholics have many rules in their rule-book. Isn't that covered?
Yes, I just read something today. I was always told growing up that you have to think it, say it and do it for "it" to be a sin. Today I read an article that if you own the desire of that thought and think on that thought and draw pleasure from that thought, then that thought has now become a sin. So, having lustful "thoughts" other than what I'm sharing with my husband I'm now questioning whether that is a sin. I've always thought that as long as I didn't act on that thought I was fine. I guess I had a moment of panic. I think that after hearing so many different thoughts on this from other people, that I need to think on whether I'm hurting anyone in the process of these thoughts I'm having.
 
WOW, I'm going to be honest, never met a man who had this opinion. It's blowing me away. May I ask your age?
Maybe you and him could have an affair, and you could marry Hellbound Serpiente and help them to immigrate out of the place where they live and can have lots of fantasy sex with each other and leave your husband in the tub of vanilla ice-cream? I haven't read all the posts here, but have you discussed your fantasy with your husband and tested it out with him, or he flatly refuses?

Hellbound Serpiente and fallenangel sound like a good, juicy, match for a fornicating or adulterous, or even married couple of libertines. Why suffer? You two should start emailing each other, then exchange pictures, then start prepping for the divorce situation, then marry him to get him his immigration or whatever, even if you divorce him later for someone who will satisfy your lusts better, he will be appreciative because you helped him finally get out of the place he is living which he dislikes. Thus, callous sinfulness can end up being beneficial in a great many ways! Making things right, by doing what is wrong and naughty!
 

Eyes to See

Well-Known Member
I am married. My husband and I are on opposites poles with our sexuality. He is of a "vanilla" taste which mine are very much not. Is it considered a sin to have sexual immoral thoughts during sex with your husband to obtain sexual pleasure while thinking of a sexual act with a faceless person (the faceless person performing my sexual fantasy on me) to achieve sexual satisfaction?

Greets. There are several key scriptures that come to mind with this question. What does God think about the matter?

A Christian is told not to let a rotten saying come out of their mouth. But really where does speech start? In the mind, and what is in the mind is usually dominated by the heart.

Jesus said this truth:

"For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks."-Matthew 12:34.

Do you want to know what is on a person's heart? Listen to their speech. They can't hide it. Even now for example you are on a website asking strangers about something that is in your heart.

Jesus also said this:

“You heard that it was said: ‘You must not commit adultery.’ But I say to you that everyone who keeps on looking at a woman so as to have a passion for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart."-Matthew 5:27, 28.

In the Mosaic Law adultery was forbidden. The last of the original "10 commandments" went further than forbidding the act. It forbid the thought of covetousness. Now that law could never be enforced by a human. For only God can read hearts. Of course, covetousness can lead to a wrong course of action.

So that is really the point. The wrong desire starts in the heart, and then when that thought is fertile it gives birth to sin, and then sin to death:

"But each one is tried by being drawn out and enticed by his own desire.  Then the desire, when it has become fertile, gives birth to sin; in turn sin, when it has been carried out, brings forth death."-James 1:14, 15.

Do you see the danger in harboring wrong desires? Although Jesus said the act of adultery is in your heart, he didn't say you committed adultery, the fact is the defect is in your heart. And God warns us not to trust our heart because it is more treacherous than we can understand, and to safeguard our heart for out of it are the sources of life:

"The heart is more treacherous than anything else and is desperate. Who can know it?"-Jeremiah 17:9.

"Above all the things that you guard, safeguard your heart,
For out of it are the sources of life
."
-Proverbs 4:23.

The craving for sexual immorality is actually an insatiable desire. It is greediness and considered idolatry. And it is on account of this sort of thinking and conduct that the wrath of God is coming. God's word commands a Christian to deaden the immoral desire in their hearts:

"Deaden, therefore, your body members that are on the earth as respects sexual immorality, uncleanness, uncontrolled sexual passion, hurtful desire, and greediness, which is idolatry. 6 On account of those things the wrath of God is coming."-Colossians 3:5, 6.


So, is craving sexual relations with someone other than your marriage mate wrong in God's eyes? Yes. He commands us to not covet what does not belong to us. Jesus tells us that a person that looks with passion on another (that is already married) has already committed adultery with that person in their heart. (he is referring to a man but the same goes for the woman). God's word warns us that the heart is not to be trusted, to safeguard it. To deaden your body members as respects sexual immorality and uncontrolled sexual passion, which is greediness. This is idolatry. A person who acts in this way has an insatiable craving. That is, it will never be satisfied. It is like a person looking for more money, or more power. More is never enough just as the Proverb goes:

"A lover of silver will never be satisfied with silver, nor a lover of wealth with income. This too is futility."-Ecclesiastes 5:10.

That is why you can see very wealthy and rich people who crave more never become satisfied with what they already have. Or the same with a person looking for power. It is a mental disease that eats away at a person and controls their actions and thoughts. And as we were told the minding of the selfish fleshly desires lead to death.

When you marry you enter into a covenant relationship with your spouse. You make a vow, a promise to cherish the other person and make that person special in your life. Your marriage mate is your exclusive mate you will enjoy sexual relationship with. You have made that contract. And God expects you to keep your oath. And your spouse can rightfully expect you keep your oath to them as well. This idea is neither archaic or wrong. It is right and proper:

"Whenever you make a vow to God, do not delay to pay it, for he finds no pleasure in the stupid ones. What you vow, pay."-Ecclesiastes 5:4.

Sexual immorality should not even be mentioned:

"Let sexual immorality and every sort of uncleanness or greediness not even be mentioned among you, just as is proper for holy people; neither shameful conduct nor foolish talking nor obscene jesting—things that are not befitting—but rather the giving of thanks.  For you know this, recognizing it for yourselves, that no sexually immoral person or unclean person or greedy person, which means being an idolater, has any inheritance in the Kingdom of the Christ and of God."-Ephesians 5:3-5.


ETA: Just a couple of scriptures that may help you do what is right:

"Finally, brothers, whatever things are true, whatever things are of serious concern, whatever things are righteous, whatever things are chaste, whatever things are lovable, whatever things are well-spoken-of, whatever things are virtuous, and whatever things are praiseworthy, continue considering these things."-Philippians 4:8.

Keep your mind focused on what is true, righteous, chaste, lovable, virtuous, and praiseworthy.


"Instruct me, O Jehovah, about your way.
I will walk in your truth.
Unify my heart to fear your name
."
-Psalm 86:11.

To unify your heart means to make it complete. A heart my love Jehovah but it may be divided. It may also love badness. Have the same mind as did the Psalmist here. Pray that God "unifies," that is makes complete, your heart to serve him. If it is complete, there will be no room for wickedness or immorality:

"O you who love Jehovah, hate what is bad.
He is guarding the lives of his loyal ones;
He rescues them from the hand of the wicked
."
-Psalm 97:10.

God detests a perfidious, unloyal, unfaithful person. Make it your prayer to do as the Psalmist here says, to love Jehovah, you have to hate what is bad.

(Psalm 34:14) Turn away from what is bad and do what is good; Seek peace and pursue it.

(Psalm 101:3) I will not set anything worthless before my eyes. I hate the deeds of those who deviate from what is right; I will have nothing to do with them.

(Psalm 119:104) By your orders I act with understanding. That is why I hate every false path.

(Romans 12:9) Let your love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is wicked; cling to what is good.
 
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Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Yes, I just read something today. I was always told growing up that you have to think it, say it and do it for "it" to be a sin. Today I read an article that if you own the desire of that thought and think on that thought and draw pleasure from that thought, then that thought has now become a sin. So, having lustful "thoughts" other than what I'm sharing with my husband I'm now questioning whether that is a sin. I've always thought that as long as I didn't act on that thought I was fine. I guess I had a moment of panic. I think that after hearing so many different thoughts on this from other people, that I need to think on whether I'm hurting anyone in the process of these thoughts I'm having.
Below is an excerpt from a longer quote from the Baha'i Writings regarding thoughts and actions. You can read more about our beliefs on what we consider proper sexual behavior on that link below.

“Bahá’u’lláh, in the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, has exhorted us not to indulge our passions and in one of His well-known Tablets ‘Abdu'l-Bahá encourages us to keep our 'secret thoughts pure'. Of course many wayward thoughts come involuntarily to the mind and these are merely a result of weakness and are not blameworthy unless they become fixed or even worse, are expressed in improper acts.”
Lights of Guidance/Chastity and Sex Education - Bahaiworks, a library of works about the Bahá’í Faith
 
What will she gain by being unhappy? Maybe her husband is also unhappy? Maybe he wants something else but hasn't dared to admit it? Is she headed to Heaven as it is? There is no guarantee, so why shouldn't she abandon all the things that displease her and make her life better, not knowing what she will get for certain in return for any of this? Perhaps she is failing in numerous regards, and could instead be happy and make someone else much happier? Maybe that would even be better for her? She is already coming online and disturbed by it, almost trying to call out for help. Its probably best that she separates from her husband while she still can and start a new life altogether where she can finally have her obsession made manifest.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Greets. There are several key scriptures that come to mind with this question. What does God think about the matter?
What the Bible says is not all that different from what the Baha'i Writings say on sexual desire and attachment to other things of the earth.

“Say: He is not to be numbered with the people of Bahá who followeth his mundane desires, or fixeth his heart on things of the earth. He is My true follower who, if he come to a valley of pure gold, will pass straight through it aloof as a cloud, and will neither turn back, nor pause. Such a man is, assuredly, of Me. From his garment the Concourse on high can inhale the fragrance of sanctity…. And if he met the fairest and most comely of women, he would not feel his heart seduced by the least shadow of desire for her beauty. Such an one, indeed, is the creation of spotless chastity. Thus instructeth you the Pen of the Ancient of Days, as bidden by your Lord, the Almighty, the All-Bountiful.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 118

That just reminded me of what Jesus said about things of this world.

John 12:24-26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.
 

Glaurung

Denizen of Niflheim
Since you are Catholic I will respond. Yes, you can sin by thought alone.

You sin when the will consents to an immoral object. It is not a sin if the mind is simply presented with an immoral thought. You do sin if you consent to that thought and dwell upon it.
 

Eyes to See

Well-Known Member
Yes, you can sin by thought alone.

And yet the last of the ten commandments is not to covet.

What does covet mean?

"To feel strong or immoderate desire for (that which is another's)."

Is coveting something an action? No. It is a desire in the heart. It is a thought. Jehovah condemns improper thoughts.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Since you are Catholic I will respond. Yes, you can sin by thought alone.

You sin when the will consents to an immoral object. It is not a sin if the mind is simply presented with an immoral thought. You do sin if you consent to that thought and dwell upon it.
Interesting, that is very similar to my Baha'i beliefs.

“Bahá’u’lláh, in the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, has exhorted us not to indulge our passions and in one of His well-known Tablets ‘Abdu'l-Bahá encourages us to keep our 'secret thoughts pure'. Of course many wayward thoughts come involuntarily to the mind and these are merely a result of weakness and are not blameworthy unless they become fixed or even worse, are expressed in improper acts.”

Lights of Guidance/Chastity and Sex Education - Bahaiworks, a library of works about the Bahá’í Faith
 
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