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Are u going to leave USA now?

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Thorbjorn asked me what specific reasons people might have for being against homosexuality and I gave him some examples. I'm not just randomly throwing it out there or going on a rant.
Aye, but do these failings serve to justify any public policy regarding civil rights?

I ask because I don't know where you stand on it.
And I might've missed it if you stated it earlier.
(My brain is malfunctioning more than usual today.)
 
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Saint Frankenstein

Here for the ride
Premium Member
Aye, but do these failings serve to justify any public policy regarding civil rights?
Personally? I think that civil marriage should just stay between a man and a woman and that we shouldn't fiddle around with it. Supporting otherwise is contrary to my religion anyway and I'm trying to get deeper into it and stop my dissenting ways, which just lead to confusion.
 

Nietzsche

The Last Prussian
Premium Member
Personally? I think that civil marriage should just stay between a man and a woman and that we shouldn't fiddle around with it. Supporting otherwise is contrary to my religion anyway and I'm trying to get deeper into it and stop my dissenting ways, which just lead to confusion.
But that's contrary to how laws are made in the United States. Your reasoning is solely religious. That isn't(and shouldn't) be enough to deprive people of basic decency.
 

Saint Frankenstein

Here for the ride
Premium Member
But that's contrary to how laws are made in the United States. Your reasoning is solely religious. That isn't(and shouldn't) be enough to deprive people of basic decency.
Well, that's my opinion and people have the right to support things or not based on religious beliefs or any other reason.
 

Nietzsche

The Last Prussian
Premium Member
I don't call myself that and I hate that word. I have transsexualism, which is a medical condition.
****. Sorry. Legitimately forgot the difference. Goddamn it. I was going to make a point about how I could be against transsexual rights because of X reason, and that it would be as valid(and as damaging to other people) as your view on gay marriage.

Sigh. Sorry, I mean that.
 

Saint Frankenstein

Here for the ride
Premium Member
****. Sorry. Legitimately forgot the difference. Goddamn it. I was going to make a point about how I could be against transsexual rights because of X reason, and that it would be as valid(and as damaging to other people) as your view on gay marriage.

Sigh. Sorry, I mean that.
No worries.

I don't really care if people are against it. I'm not in your face "destroy the binary! tear down the cissies!" about it. The only rights that are relevant to it, in my opinion, are the right to access to cross-sex hormonal therapy and surgeries and the right to change my legal documents, including my birth certificate. Other than that, I want the right to be able to fully assimilate into the male sex, so that includes things like signing up for the Selective Service and such. I don't ask for anything more than that. I don't ask for society to undergo huge changes because I have a condition. I just want to be a normal male as much as I can. It's kind of similar to people who have intersex conditions. We've been getting along just fine for decades without it being politicized.
 

Nietzsche

The Last Prussian
Premium Member
No worries.

I don't really care if people are against it. I'm not in your face "destroy the binary! tear down the cissies!" about it. The only rights that are relevant to it, in my opinion, are the right to access to cross-sex hormonal therapy and surgeries and the right to change my legal documents, including my birth certificate. Other than that, I want the right to be able to fully assimilate into the male sex, so that includes things like signing up for the Selective Service and such. I don't ask for anything more than that. I don't ask for society to undergo huge changes because I have a condition. I just want to be a normal male as much as I can.
And I agree. But there will always be people who will say that you were born physically as a woman, and thus you are a deviant for wanting to change, and most of them will use religious reasons for it. Many will likely also want laws to keep you(transsexuals as a whole) away from children & the like, especially MtF. And that is my point.
 

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
Supporting otherwise is contrary to my religion anyway and I'm trying to get deeper into it and stop my dissenting ways, which just lead to confusion.

So why should the rest of us be subject to your personal feelings and beliefs? I don't need any support of anything, except that of the law, which we now have. The Pope has no say here.
 

Saint Frankenstein

Here for the ride
Premium Member
And I agree. But there will always be people who will say that you were born physically as a woman, and thus you are a deviant for wanting to change, and most of them will use religious reasons for it. Many will likely also want laws to keep you(transsexuals as a whole) away from children & the like, especially MtF. And that is my point.
I understand. There's also racists and I'm a mixed person. There's always going to be dumb people. In regards to trans issues, I think the political movement is hurting us all and that framing it as a matter of social theory has been a huge mistake. It should be presented to the public as a medical condition only and leave the leftist radicalism out of it. I look at the "trans icons" they uphold in the media and a lot of them are like circus freaks who make us look crazy. So I try to distance myself from them and I don't want to be lumped in with them, because they embarrass me. I dropped out of being involved with the trans community in real life, too, because there were too many weirdos involved. Most people who actually have the medical condition are quite quiet about it. (A lot of people calling themselves "transgender" aren't transsexuals and there's a lot of paraphilias and fetishes involved.) They tend to just transition and integrate into their reassigned sex quietly. That's been going on for decades. Billy Tipton is an example of that.

Having transsexualism isn't something I'm proud of or happy about. I hate it and wish I were just a normal male or even a normal female. It's hellish. It's like, I want to get married one day and be a father, but I understand if a straight woman turns me down because of my anatomy and because I can't father children. That's fair and I don't see it as bigoted.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I don't call myself that and I hate that word. I have transsexualism, which is a medical condition.
That's why I like the term, "trans".
It's a good catch all so that I needn't fully understand all the manifestations.
And since I approve of them all, I've no reason to differentiate.
 

leibowde84

Veteran Member
Sexual Orientation and Mental and Physical Health Status: Findings From a Dutch Population Survey



As I said, since this deals with sexual orientation, it's a sex issue. Most of these issues are with the gay and bisexual male community. I think the simplest explanation for them is that males are more likely to partake in risky behaviors but, among heterosexuals, that's curtailed to a certain extent by hetero females. Since gay male sexuality is oriented towards males, it's just more testosterone and so that leads to what you see here. That's my conclusion and it's the one that seems the most obvious and makes the most sense to me.

As for race issues, that's another topic and I'd prefer not to drag that into this discussion and derail the topic. I have a thread about the issues in the black community called "black people, stop embarrassing yourselves".
This study was only of the Dutch population, and was conducted more than 14 years ago. The amount that our culture has changed in that time is astounding, and Dutch culture is very different than American culture, so, even if it was a recent study, I would argue that it would still be irrelevant.
 
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