Atheism, Autism and Narcissism

[viole]

So this leaves me with another option: Maybe autistic people are not prone to atheism, maybe it is people who are merely narcissistic who are prone to atheism. I can see how the two could get confused. Narcissists are like Jehovah, they see themselves as the center of the universe and there can be no other Gods before them. In fact I think narcissism might be more conducive towards the creation of an atheist than I could see autism doing so.

Your thoughts.

The observable universe consists of hundreds of billions of galaxies, each containing hundreds of billions of stars. Black holes, supernova, planets, life. The amazing world of quantum mechanics and relativity. All that beauty.

I don't believe for a second that all this exists or has been created with us in mind.

I also believe that life arises out of unconscious and natural processes. This includes our mind which, i believe, is nothing but a complicated interconnection of neurons tuned by natural selection to present some behaviors.

I also believe that we are not important for the universe. Nothing is, in a cosmic way. All this is simply mechanical gene selection and evolution with no purpose whatsoever other than creating entropy. Or the same universal purpose of a mountain or a stone.

We will die, the universe will die, all we ever achieved will disappear in a boring and diluted cloud of decaying particles for good.

There are no gods creating universes for me and my cat. No god that listens to what i say. No god that considers me so important to listen to my boring problems and wishes. No god loving me nor dying for my weaknesses. No mystic invisible reality that would give me a chance or a pedestal. Nothing.


Am I narcissistic?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Some scientist and researchers have made a connection between atheism and some forms of autism. A religious belief is thought to be neuro-typical, our natural, normal and healthy mental functions induce these sort of beliefs for our own benefit. Except for the atheist, their brain do not function normally, many do not understand figurative language (which is needed to develop a healthy spirituality), feel a deep inner connection to others or the outside or feel that much empathy, all indications of autism. According to some scientists whom I have read people on the autistic spectrum are more likely to be atheistic.

And know what you are about to read next might sound like an unethical experiment, well because it is. At times I have used figurative language purposely when in discussions with certain atheists and often times they were unable to decode what I was saying. In fact I would do this several times with the same atheists and the results would often be the same, they would either take what I said literally or they seemed to be confused at what I was trying to convey figuratively. So I do believe that some atheists might indeed have some form of autism.

But also, the inability to connect or empathize with others might mean something else in the atheists besides autism. Autistic people might find it hard to form deep connections or empathize with others but they also have a deep seated need to do so. So this leaves me with another option: Maybe autistic people are not prone to atheism, maybe it is people who are merely narcissistic who are prone to atheism. I can see how the two could get confused. Narcissists are like Jehovah, they see themselves as the center of the universe and there can be no other Gods before them. In fact I think narcissism might be more conducive towards the creation of an atheist than I could see autism doing so.

Your thoughts.

I think your transparent attempts to bait atheists through passive-aggressive insults are too clumsy and obvious to be either effective or clever. Additionally, I think these failed forays into trolling non-believers reveals far more about you than it ever would about them.

 

[StarryNightshade]

Some scientist and researchers have made a connection between atheism and some forms of autism. A religious belief is thought to be neuro-typical, our natural, normal and healthy mental functions induce these sort of beliefs for our own benefit. Except for the atheist, their brain do not function normally, many do not understand figurative language (which is needed to develop a healthy spirituality), feel a deep inner connection to others or the outside or feel that much empathy, all indications of autism. According to some scientists whom I have read people on the autistic spectrum are more likely to be atheistic.

And know what you are about to read next might sound like an unethical experiment, well because it is. At times I have used figurative language purposely when in discussions with certain atheists and often times they were unable to decode what I was saying. In fact I would do this several times with the same atheists and the results would often be the same, they would either take what I said literally or they seemed to be confused at what I was trying to convey figuratively. So I do believe that some atheists might indeed have some form of autism.

But also, the inability to connect or empathize with others might mean something else in the atheists besides autism. Autistic people might find it hard to form deep connections or empathize with others but they also have a deep seated need to do so. So this leaves me with another option: Maybe autistic people are not prone to atheism, maybe it is people who are merely narcissistic who are prone to atheism. I can see how the two could get confused. Narcissists are like Jehovah, they see themselves as the center of the universe and there can be no other Gods before them. In fact I think narcissism might be more conducive towards the creation of an atheist than I could see autism doing so.

Your thoughts.

A.) To use me as an anecdotal example, I have symptoms of Aspergers and I believe in God. Most other Autistic people I know believe in God, although not necessarily the God of Classical theism.

B.) By reading what you wrote I can conclude that you seem to believe that A.) most (if not all) atheists are "narcissistic" and B.) since you equate Autism with an increased correlation of being an atheist, that makes them "impaired".

 

[LuisDantas]

From Merriam-Webster Dictionary:

Definition of EGALITARIANISM
1
: a belief in human equality especially with respect to social, political, and economic affairs
2
: a social philosophy advocating the removal of inequalities among people​

Definition of EQUAL:

1
a (1) : of the same measure, quantity, amount, or number as another (2) : identical in mathematical value or logical denotation : equivalent
b : like in quality, nature, or status
c : like for each member of a group, class, or society <provide equal employment opportunities>
2
: regarding or affecting all objects in the same way : impartial​

As you can see from the definition of egalitarianism, it is for equality among people and the removal of inequalities among people. If you look at the definition of equal, you need to recognize the individual members of the group in order to evaluate equality. Therefore, you cannot have egalitarianism (equality of individuals) without the recognition of each individual. Failure to recognize each individual as a unit means that you cannot measure equality. Therefore, one must be an individualist to be an egalitarian--one must recognize and honor the individuality of each person in order for there to be equality.

I guess you are just not seeing the point.

 

[LuisDantas]

I think your transparent attempts to bait atheists through passive-aggressive insults are too clumsy and obvious to be either effective or clever. Additionally, I think these failed forays into trolling non-believers reveals far more about you then it ever would about them.

Ain't that the truth?

 

[Nymphs]

Plz, what I meant by that was I wasn't referring to him.
You really reached hard for that one

BTW, show me in the thread where it was designed to offend him, k?
:yes:

It would be the same thing if I said
"No offense but I could never be polygamist, ewwww"

That means to me, that its yuckie for me, but I realize its ok for you.

What you are referring to is this: (BTW I am not referring to you in these examples)
"No offense but you are the stupidest and smelliest person in the world"
"No offense, but your hairdo looks like it was cut by a blind monkey on LDS"
"No offense but your singing sounds like a dying rat in a blender on high speed"

See the difference?

See here:

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-discussion/163437-what-does-no-offense-but-mean.html

 

[CynthiaCypher]

A.) To use me as an anecdotal example, I have symptoms of Aspergers and I believe in God. Most other Autistic people I know believe in God, although not necessarily the God of Classical theism.

And I addressed that earlier. I read a report stating that those on the spectrum where more likely to be atheists, so I went to a forum for those on the spectrum and they did not seem to be overwhelmingly atheists but split equally and as I stated before the believers don't seem to have a traditional view of God as some abstract entity.

B.) By reading what you wrote I can conclude that you seem to believe that A.) most (if not all) atheists are "narcissistic" and B.) since you equate Autism with an increased correlation of being an atheist, that makes them "impaired".

There is no such thing as a cookie cut atheists or a cookie cut any person for that matter. I am not saying all atheists are narcissists and that is why they are atheists. But some are and it might have definitely informed their atheism. People become atheist for a variety of reasons and motives.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Ain't that the truth?

I am trying to make convo not insult. If I wanted to insult I would have titled the thread "Sociopathy and Atheism:Science Proves Atheists Have No Souls" instead of opening the theory that autistic people are more prone to atheism for question.

 

[crossfire]

I guess you are just not seeing the point.

What would you call not recognizing and honoring the individual then?

Perhaps you are not seeing the point of what individualism really is?

Here's the first line of the article on individualism from Wiki:

Individualism is the moral stance, political philosophy, ideology, or social outlook that emphasizes the moral worth of the individual.​

I gave an example of how narcissists are not individualists in that they do not recognize and honor the individual personal boundaries.
Here's the Wiki entry of Hotchkiss' Seven Deadly Sins of Narcissism

Hotchkiss identified what she called the seven deadly sins of narcissism:[8]

Shamelessness: Shame is the feeling that lurks beneath all unhealthy narcissism, and the inability to process shame in healthy ways.
Magical thinking: Narcissists see themselves as perfect, using distortion and illusion known as magical thinking. They also use projection to dump shame onto others.
Arrogance: A narcissist who is feeling deflated may reinflate by diminishing, debasing, or degrading somebody else.
Envy: A narcissist may secure a sense of superiority in the face of another person's ability by using contempt to minimize the other person.
Entitlement: Narcissists hold unreasonable expectations of particularly favorable treatment and automatic compliance because they consider themselves special. Failure to comply is considered an attack on their superiority, and the perpetrator is considered an "awkward" or "difficult" person. Defiance of their will is a narcissistic injury that can trigger narcissistic rage.
Exploitation: Can take many forms but always involves the exploitation of others without regard for their feelings or interests. Often the other is in a subservient position where resistance would be difficult or even impossible. Sometimes the subservience is not so much real as assumed.
Bad boundaries: Narcissists do not recognize that they have boundaries and that others are separate and are not extensions of themselves. Others either exist to meet their needs or may as well not exist at all. Those who provide narcissistic supply to the narcissist are treated as if they are part of the narcissist and are expected to live up to those expectations. In the mind of a narcissist there is no boundary between self and other.​

 

[CynthiaCypher]

The observable universe consists of hundreds of billions of galaxies, each containing hundreds of billions of stars. Black holes, supernova, planets, life. The amazing world of quantum mechanics and relativity. All that beauty.

I don't believe for a second that all this exists or has been created with us in mind.

I also believe that life arises out of unconscious and natural processes. This includes our mind which, i believe, is nothing but a complicated interconnection of neurons tuned by natural selection to present some behaviors.

I also believe that we are not important for the universe. Nothing is, in a cosmic way. All this is simply mechanical gene selection and evolution with no purpose whatsoever other than creating entropy. Or the same universal purpose of a mountain or a stone.

We will die, the universe will die, all we ever achieved will disappear in a boring and diluted cloud of decaying particles for good.

There are no gods creating universes for me and my cat. No god that listens to what i say. No god that considers me so important to listen to my boring problems and wishes. No god loving me nor dying for my weaknesses. No mystic invisible reality that would give me a chance or a pedestal. Nothing.


Am I narcissistic?

Ciao

- viole

I don't know. You don't seem like one. And your beliefs wouldn't indicate whether you are one or not. It is a matter of behavior. Do you exhibit any of the following?:

An obvious self-focus in interpersonal exchanges

Problems in sustaining satisfying relationships

A lack of psychological awareness (see insight in psychology and psychiatry, egosyntonic)

Difficulty with empathy

Problems distinguishing the self from others (see narcissism and boundaries)

Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults (see criticism and narcissists, narcissistic rage and narcissistic injury)

Vulnerability to shame rather than guilt

Haughty body language

Flattery towards people who admire and affirm them (narcissistic supply)

Detesting those who do not admire them (narcissistic abuse)

Using other people without considering the cost of doing so

Pretending to be more important than they really are

Bragging (subtly but persistently) and exaggerating their achievements

Claiming to be an "expert" at many things

Inability to view the world from the perspective of other people

Denial of remorse and gratitude

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I am trying to make convo not insult. If I wanted to insult I would have titled the thread "Sociopathy and Atheism:Science Proves Atheists Have No Souls" instead of opening the theory that autistic people are more prone to atheism for question.

I don't know whether you're being dishonest, or whether you really don't know how transparent your passive-aggressiveness is.

 

[kashmir]

See here:

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-discussion/163437-what-does-no-offense-but-mean.html

do you think I care what that says?
show me where in that post that it was even referring to him.
Obviously you could not or you would have, so you reached even further

You are too much.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I don't know whether you're being dishonest, or whether you really don't know how transparent your passive-aggressiveness is.

Did this thread cause you a narcissistic injury or something? So people can go the **** on all day calling religious people insane but when the tables are turned all of a sudden it's passive-aggressiveness? Is that how this works?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Did this thread cause you a narcissistic injury or something? So people can go the **** on all day calling religious people insane but when the tables are turned all of a sudden it's passive-aggressiveness? Is that how this works?

I'm only commenting on the obvious, transparent nature of this specific thread. If you somehow perceive my comments as related to other threads or issues, that's telling in itself.

 

[viole]

I don't know. You don't seem like one. And your beliefs wouldn't indicate whether you are one or not. It is a matter of behavior. Do you exhibit any of the following?:

An obvious self-focus in interpersonal exchanges

Problems in sustaining satisfying relationships

A lack of psychological awareness (see insight in psychology and psychiatry, egosyntonic)

Difficulty with empathy

Problems distinguishing the self from others (see narcissism and boundaries)

Hypersensitivity to any insults or imagined insults (see criticism and narcissists, narcissistic rage and narcissistic injury)

Vulnerability to shame rather than guilt

Haughty body language

Flattery towards people who admire and affirm them (narcissistic supply)

Detesting those who do not admire them (narcissistic abuse)

Using other people without considering the cost of doing so

Pretending to be more important than they really are

Bragging (subtly but persistently) and exaggerating their achievements

Claiming to be an "expert" at many things

Inability to view the world from the perspective of other people

Denial of remorse and gratitude

Oh CynthiaCypher.... Do you think you can dissect me with this blunt little tool?

Ciao

- viole

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I'm only commenting on the obvious, transparent nature of this specific thread. If you somehow perceive my comments as related to other threads or issues, that's telling in itself.

It is obvious that I left it open to question and unlike some other thread I am not making a blanket statement regarding a certain group of people. In no way have I said that all atheist are either autistic or narcissistic. If you take that as passive-aggressiveness then so be it.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Oh CynthiaCypher.... Do you think you can dissect me with this blunt little tool?

Ciao

- viole

You ask me if you were narcissistic and I said "I don't know. Are you?"

 

[viole]

You ask me if you were narcissistic and I said "I don't know. Are you?"

Obviously not. Everybody else is

Ciao

- viole

 

[Kilgore Trout]

It is obvious that I left it open to question and unlike some other thread I am not making a blanket statement regarding a certain group of people. In no way have I said that all atheist are either autistic or narcissistic. If you take that as passive-aggressiveness then so be it.

Combined with previous patterns of behavior and attitudes you have expressed, it seems to me that there is an obvious element of passive-aggressiveness against atheists communicated in your OP, that in fact, seems quite transparent. If you are unaware of this attitude, then so be it.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

It is obvious that I left it open to question and unlike some other thread I am not making a blanket statement regarding a certain group of people.

Like you did in many other threads?

I'm sorry, but it really is clear that you have a kind of pathological hatred of atheists and atheism, and the general tenor of the OP (which I have yet to see any actual scientific sources for) was obviously intended to paint atheists in a negative light by implying that atheism can be the result of a form of mental instability and narcissism. There was no balance whatsoever, and no real thinking about the subject from your point of view, just "Here are some statements linking autism and atheism - discuss". Do you not see how that can be seen as aggressive?

Honestly, why all the hate? Why are atheists such a sore spot for you?