Atheism

[jarofthoughts]

When you feel thankful, though, who do you thank?

Thankful for what specifically?

 

[ButTheCatCameBack]

I'm just funnin' y'all.

Quotes! "And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God." Luke 18:19

I officially call shenanigans.

 

[dust1n]

When you feel thankful, though, who do you thank?

Circumstance.

 

[tumbleweed41]

When you feel thankful, though, who do you thank?

The person responsible. Why, who do you thank?

 

[dust1n]

I also don't think your thankfulness has to be directed at anything in specifically. No need for a 'you're welcome'.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

What is it that ATHEISM brings to the table of humanity?

pax

I don't think "atheism" brings much to the table of humanity. I think the philosophies of humanism and naturalism, however, bring much to the table. They bring to the table the basic ideas of free and exhaustive inquiry, democratic government, human rights, equality, and nonviolence.

Arguably, we wouldn't have things like the Universal Declaration of Human Rights or the cures to many diseases if it were not for the growth of humanism and naturalism (and I mean growth on their own, and also growth as they have been incorporated into other religions and philosophies). We overcame the horrors of such things as witch-hunts and discrimination against religious minorities, in part, because of the inroads of humanistic and naturalistic thinking, which are the antidotes to fanatical bigotry and fearful superstition.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

The death of millions in the past century at the hands of atheist, communist dictators.

I wouldn't start that competition if I were you, javajo, you're doomed to defeat.

Before I read how the rest of this conversation turned out, I wanted to say that at one time I would have agreed with you, Auto. The theists lose that competition. However, lately I feel inclined to think if we are going to play this admittedly pointless historical game, actually, the atheists look no better than the theists, and maybe worse.

I guess if we are going to put all of history's atrocities into an "atheist" and a "theist" column, we have to make decisions about how we count things ... what about a religious nation that commits atrocities for both "secular" and "religious" reasons (i.e. God promised us land, commerce, slaves, victory)? Do we chalk those atrocities up to "atheism" or "theism"? What about atrocities committed by religious followers who were whipped into religious frenzy and duped into serving the interests of their two-faced, atheist leaders? What about religious people who commit atrocities for secular reasons and who contradict their own religious beliefs? Is that a "theist" atrocity (since it was committed by theists) or an "atheist" atrocity (since they chose secular motives instead of religious ones)?

In the "atheist" column I think it's fair to place the Marxists and communists, with atrocities committed by North Korea, Cambodia, the Soviet Union, China.

Then there were secular revolutions/civil wars in France, Mexico, Spain and I believe in Cuba too, where churches were burned, clergy prosecuted, etc. There were secular junta death squads throughout Central and South America who oppressed the Marxist/Catholic opposition.

Then we have Western imperialist ventures .... I don't know how many of these can fairly be called "atheist" vs. "theist". But I have read that, for example, the elites of the British empire and her fighting sailors were extremely skeptical of religion. I don't think considerations about God were the main considerations of Henry Kissinger and the Pentagon when carrying out atrocities against the people of Indochina, or that WWI or WWII could be thrown in the same category of "religious war" as the Crusades. The rulers and elites of Europe and Russia throughout the centuries -- the Caesars, the Popes, Henry VIII and many despots of the British monarchy, the Tsars, Napoleon (?) -- were in many cases so well-educated, and their actions so independent of or even contrary to their supposed religious beliefs, yet so predictable according to the motives of wealth and power, that it seems to me a lot of them must have been secret atheists, or at least uninterested in "the next world" apart from keeping pretenses and the utility of this concept for controlling people in this world.

So I guess from my limited knowledge of history, I don't see theism OR atheism as particularly helpful in preventing atrocities. I see certain philosophical values as antidotes to atrocities, namely: free inquiry and expression, democracy, human rights, equality of all people. These values are not incompatible with theism and, sadly, not embraced by many atheists in history.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

With atheism, anything goes. Survival of the fittest. If it feels good, do it. Man can do anything he can get away with. No moral absolutes. It is a downward spiral into chaos. Hopelessness, despair...utter madness.

You're describing/criticizing particular philosophies which are atheistic. Many atheists do not share the philosophical outlook of "survival of the fittest, no moral absolutes" etc.

E.g. communists/Marxists and others do not believe in "survival of the fittest" in the human social sphere, if anything this describes the capitalist view, which many theists embrace. Ayn Rand was an atheist but her philosophy of Objectivism held that there are moral absolutes. Sam Harris is an atheist and popular author and he also argues there are moral truths.

Many, perhaps most, atheists are not / were not moral relativists, and in fact claimed the moral high-ground over the godly on matters of the equality of women, slavery, toleration, etc. Many "far-left" activists in the movements for blacks, labor, women, the poor, for pacifism and nonviolence, were accused of being atheists or at least anti-religion in their day, but they expressed moral views which are today accepted and uncontroversial.

 

[dogsgod]

HP Sauce.

 

[Tiapan]

Atheism brings a resolution of many of the questions that religion has falsely simplistically attempted to guess.

cheers

 

[monta]

Geesh. I'm just sayin. Anyway, I did come across an interesting revision of the Lord's Prayer. I'm trying to be a little lighter here, so here goes...

Our brethren, who art on earth,
Hallowed be our name,
Our kingdom come, our will be done
On earth, for there is no heaven,
We must get this day our daily bread;
We neither forgive nor are forgiven,
We fear not temptation,
For we deliver ourselves from evil,
For ours is the kingdom and the power
And there is no glory and no forever,
Amen

Makes no sense, isn't funny and doesn't scan. Can you contact the person who wrote this and tell them they should stick to their day job, if they have one.

 

[LuisDantas]

When you feel thankful, though, who do you thank?

It depends on the cause of that feeling, of course. But if you are asking if I miss the idea of a creator to thank for existence - no, I don't. Atheism is very natural for me.

 

[LuisDantas]

For a Religious Forum there sure are a lot of atheists here...

Do you find that surprising? Atheists are slightly more likely to have an interest in religion, and a lot more likely to have learned to appreaciate the variety of religious perspectives than the average person.

 

[LuisDantas]

Ravi Zacharias said:

"There is nothing in history to match the dire ends to which humanity can be led by following a political and social philosophy that consciously and absolutely excludes God."

"I am thoroughly convinced that when the lasts chapter of humanity is written, we will find that the implications of atheism, i.e., living without God, if consistently carried through, will have made life plainly unlivable within the limits of reason or even of common sense."

It is sad that there are (were?) still those who believe in such obvious falsehoods.

 

[DallasApple]

How about medical cures, knowledge for technology that has shown us what's within our solar system (and beyond), pushing the limits beyond what some religious deem as "messing with god's creative work" (stem cell research, genetics)?

I'll disagree with this one..Many religious(non ahtiest ) push medical and science as well.

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Makes no sense, isn't funny and doesn't scan. Can you contact the person who wrote this and tell them they should stick to their day job, if they have one.

I also thought that was kind of rude..O Lots of anger coming through that one..(not you the one you quoted)...

Love

Dallas

 

[gnomon]

For a Religious Forum there sure are a lot of atheists here...

The same usually holds true for churches as well.

 

[DallasApple]

Im full good and angry now..Like really a bad word off..I dont like it..

Maybe I'll take an entire canteloup..or some sort of fruit and smash it.

Or maybe I will just SPIT!

But thats O>K..

Its a war apparently..So I will spit and smash fruit..(Oh and I can wack down a tree the banana tree with an AX!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Smash!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[gnomon]

Aarrggghhhh!!!!!!