Atheists and their jargon of insults

[Orbit]

I never suggested it did. This makes it even worse that someone can't admit to there being abusive atheists and abusive atheism.

Someone? Who?

 

[1137]

Someone? Who?

Ah you also have her on ignore? If you click "show ignored" you will see

Edit: I'm also not going to ignore someone them talk about them, this is my final comment on the matter

 

[Little Dragon]

What do you mean they cannot be quantified?

Do Ghosts or Gods have mass or volume? Are they composed of matter particles? Are they subject to time? Are they hyperdimensional? Do they absorb or emit photons*?
And so on. Lots of non quantified parameters. Nothing to mathematically reduce.

*Photographs and videos of so called Ghosts, might indicate that the phenomena does interact with electromagnetic radiation, somehow.

 

[Little Dragon]

I agree with you that we shouldn't take someone's word for it or accept a holy book at face value. For instance, I'm agnostic when it comes to believing in deities, but I believe in spirits because of what I've witnessed and documented. If you're interested, you can read my posts here and here to find out what I believe and why. Of course, what I've written reflects my beliefs. I understand that others may disagree and not accept them, and that's fine with me.

I am prepared to believe you, and would trust you when, for example, you say that there is a hostile ghost or spirit, in place X. I will assume that you are not lying or deluded. I will tread cautiously, holy water in hand.

Which is very different from some convoluted narrative about original sin and hell and heaven and so on. That others expect to be just accepted on face value.

 

[1137]

Do Ghosts or Gods have mass or volume? Are they composed of matter particles? Are they subject to time? Are they hyperdimensional? Do they absorb or emit photons*?
And so on. Lots of non quantified parameters. Nothing to mathematically reduce.

*Photographs and videos of so called Ghosts, might indicate that the phenomena does interact with electromagnetic radiation, somehow.

This reveals the problem, the presupposition that exists = made of matter.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

The persecution complex is all yours (post#2).

Can you tell the readers what do you think would be "magic", "miracle", "supernatural"?

Do you think that in the future any of the things you consider that today may be just something normal or natural?
Let's say not just "in the future" ... it could happen just in another place, or circunstances.

There was a time when I didn't know anything about people with photographic memory. When I realize that capacity in some persons my mind just exploded. I'll say it is SUPERNATURAL.

I know there are things that I cannot explain, but my failure to explain is not the definition of miracle. Some things have an explanation that is outside of my ability to know or it could be that my own misunderstanding of an event that I only saw briefly from one perspective or might have just been a statistical aberration with natural explanation.

How do you go from some event to certainty that it is a miracle? What is the process? What is the mechanism? Is it just that a person declares it a miracle? That seems subjective and I could just negate that declaration by stating otherwise.

If a person believes something is a miracle, why is there a need to insists that others do too?

 

[Dan From Smithville]

This reveals the problem, the presupposition that exists = made of matter.

This is a very interesting thread and I'm learning a great deal.

 

[VoidCat]

... @ChristineM saying that she's been abuse by theists then @1137 insisting she condemn all abuse by theists and atheists alike reminds me of the folk saying All lives matter instead of black lives matter... Yeah all lives matter but we are highlighting black lives because currently their lives have not been always treated as well as non black folk...not that it's exactly an equal comparison just am reminded of it. Basically what im saying is Christine pointing out that she's been abused by theists is not her saying that only that abuse is bad she may believe all abuse is bad. She's just highlighting her own experience

Honestly I aint read the whole thread throughly just skimmed through it and it's tiring. Sometimes i see theists on here be mean to atheists. Sometimes I see the reverse. I will say the OP does reek of hate towards athiests

 

[Little Dragon]

This reveals the problem, the presupposition that exists = made of matter.

Everything that is measurable, is composed of matter or interacts with it. Spacetime, dark matter, electrons, light, gravity...

 

[1137]

... @ChristineM saying that she's been abuse by theists then @1137 insisting she condemn all abuse by theists and atheists alike reminds me of the folk saying All lives matter instead of black lives matter... Yeah all lives matter but we are highlighting black lives because currently their lives have not been always treated as well as non black folk...not that it's exactly an equal comparison just am reminded of it. Basically what im saying is Christine pointing out that she's been abused by theists is not her saying that only that abuse is bad she may believe all abuse is bad. She's just highlighting her own experience

Honestly I aint read the whole thread throughly just skimmed through it and it's tiring. Sometimes i see theists on here be mean to atheists. Sometimes I see the reverse. I will say the OP does reek of hate towards athiests

Yes people can be mean, all people. To the apparent disappointment of some atheists, it's not only theists. It's so easy to say you condemn all abuse, so very easy.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Almost all theists believe there is a God.

Given that theist means a belief in a god or gods, I'm not surprised. Of course, I cannot eliminate that you have some secret, personal definition of theist that differs from the common defnition.

And most atheists believe there is no God.

Are their atheists that believe there are gods or a god? That seems counter to the view. Again, I cannot dismiss the possibility of secret, personal definitions that are never revealed.

I can understand the former but the latter is inexplicable.

I have the latter view of much of what you post.

How can anyone who fancies himself a scientist conclude there is no God?

How can anyone that doesn't understand science, know what the current state of knowledge is or have ever conducted experiments outside of their head fancy themselves to be scientists or have any basis to reject what is found using science?

People often overlook the magic that is life and the anomalies that show massive holes in their knowledge but how do they overlook the fact that reality is so complex?

I agree. I have seen some people that have massive holes in what they know while retaining all appearances that they believe they are omniscient. It is perplexing how someone could come to that belief about what they know and not be able to support it at all.

 

[VoidCat]

Yes people can be mean, all people. To the apparent disappointment of some atheists, it's not only theists. It's so easy to say you condemn all abuse, so very easy.

And whats that got to do with what @ChristineM is talking about regarding her being abused?

 

[LuisDantas]

"Magic", they say.
They say "miracles", "supernatural", etc etc etc ... they even say "spaghettis" and in their minds is an insult. So they are.

What is really "miracle" or "magic" or "supernatural" in an atheist mind?
IMHO, they are just things they cann't explain with their current personal knowledge ... and there is soooo much happening in the world right now that most people cann't explain, that I would say miracles are happening all the time and atheists cann't negate it. Insulting is the way their brains deal with it.

Myself, I find lending significance to so-called miracles way too misguided to be taken into consideration.

 

[1137]

Everything that is measurable, is composed of matter or interacts with it. Spacetime, dark matter, electrons, light, gravity...

Ah well we have the interacts part, such as with divine experiences. I'm actually just finishing a class on comparative mysticism that discusses a ton of the measurable effects of mystical states, I'll have to get the text titles when I get home

 

[Little Dragon]

This is a very interesting thread and I'm learning a great deal.

I love a good discussion about the esoteric.

As for the OP and thread title. I try to be polite and civil. I tend to respond in kind. If people are sweet and self aware, then I treat them like crystal glass, if they're offensive and judgemental, then I am not so sensitive to their feelings.
I don't assume that because they are christian or satanists or whatever, that I am not going to warm to them. There are a number of theists on this forum I have considerable respect for. I think all generalization is inadvisable, including this thread premise.

 

[1137]

And whats that got to do with what @ChristineM is talking about regarding her being abused?

See my above posts, I'm not going to speak about other users.

 

[Little Dragon]

Ah well we have the interacts part, such as with divine experiences. I'm actually just finishing a class on comparative mysticism that discusses a ton of the measurable effects of mystical states, I'll have to get the text titles when I get home

It's the measurable part that counts. We can measure the mass of dark matter by inference of it's effect upon rotational velocities of galaxies, even if we can't directly observe it. It's all about the measuring. That's 99.999% of science.

 

[Alien826]

Legally speaking sure, the assumption is practical. I'm a polytheists who believes in evil gods, so I think we're talking a bit past each other. I have no problem putting the murderer away, but I find it totally possible her god told her to do it. People used to do way crazier stuff for their gods.

Well, there goes another false supposition (by me).

I'll have a go at what you are asking (in other posts).

Atheists, like all people come in differing flavors. Some have well developed justifications for their atheism, some just parrot what they've heard from others (as do theists). Some put their arguments in polite ways, some can be rude (just like theists). Some understand the difference between "your ideas are incorrect" and "you are stupid" (just like theists).

I'll add that there is a way of being offensive that many people that are probably trying to be polite may not realize they are using. That is where the words used imply a superiority on the part of the writer. I'll not use exact examples as I don't want to make this personal, but essentially it puts the writer in the position of "instructor" to the person addressed. There's a fine line as it's OK when the writer genuinely has a better knowledge of the subject, and I personally welcome that approach, but when it's essentially saying "if you were as wonderful as I am you'd agree with me", which pisses me off when I receive it. Once again it applies to both "sides", but yes, to atheists too.

 

[icehorse]

"Magic", they say.
They say "miracles", "supernatural", etc etc etc ... they even say "spaghettis" and in their minds is an insult. So they are.

What is really "miracle" or "magic" or "supernatural" in an atheist mind?
IMHO, they are just things they cann't explain with their current personal knowledge ... and there is soooo much happening in the world right now that most people cann't explain, that I would say miracles are happening all the time and atheists cann't negate it. Insulting is the way their brains deal with it.

It seems you're lumping atheists in with science fans? I think that's fairly reasonable.

To me, fans of science are quite humble and honest. We are honest about what we do not know. We do not pretend to have answers to questions we do not have answers to. When new evidence is presented, we're willing to change our minds. This is just honesty.

The problem I have with religion is when it claims to have answers to questions it does not have answers to. No one knows what happens when we die. No one knows if there are gods. So when someone says they do know these things, that is an example of magical or supernatural thinking. It just is what it is. It doesn't have be an insult, it just is what it is.

 

[ChristineM]

All she had to do was condemn abusive atheists, I can't see how that was too much or unfair to ask.

And all you had to do is condemn abusive theists but you bias prevents you...