Atheists: What would be evidence of God’s existence?

[Trailblazer]

Of course it's not irrelevant what choice we want to make!
That is your whole argument, isn't it?
..that we are not free to choose because we HAVE TO choose what God knows.
Why do we HAVE TO choose what God knows?
Simply, because God knows that we WANT to choose it.

We are free to choose otherwise, if we can choose otherwise if we WANT to choose otherwise.

We choose what we want to choose.
That means our ability to choose is not compromised.
The fact that alternative choices will not be taken is irrelevant.

I thank God that someone who is actually logical showed up on this thread!

 

[Trailblazer]

None of the "prophecies" have been fulfilled (unless you reinterpret them to mean something completely different to what they actually say).

Most of the "prophecies" have been fulfilled (unless you reinterpret them to mean something completely different to what they actually say).

 

[Trailblazer]

This is getting ridiculous now.
God cannot know you will choose 2 different options at the same time for the same event, so there is only ever one possible choice, the one he knows you will make.

That is correct. The choice you will make is the choice that God knows you will make because God knows the choice you will make.

It is irrelevant that he might have known you would make a different choice, because that one would be the only possible choice.

But there is not only one possible choice that you could have made. Faced with choices a and b and c, you could have chosen a or b or c.

Only if there is no free will and God determines all our choices would there be only one possible choice you could have made.

 

[Trailblazer]

Why? Why would you NOT choose the one you want?

I do not think we always do what we WANT to do. Sometimes we do things we do not want to do because we are compelled to do them or out of a sense of duty. Often, that is the only reason I am on this forum.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

That would only be true if a deity didn't know which ONE shirt we will choose before hand.

It also works if God knows your heart and does not change your choices. It means the choice was given and God knew you would always choose the red shirt and that you will wear that shirt in this life. It means God's plan works regardless of your choices, the multicoloured shirt will be chosen and worn by others who will with that choice embrace not only those that choose red, but build a multicoloured humanity, inclusive of all colours.

That is the way it works.

Regards Tony

 

[Tiberius]

If you had done something different God would have foreseen that.

You miss the point. I could not do something different to what God had already foreseen!

 

[TransmutingSoul]

You miss the point. I could not do something different to what God had already foreseen!

In the end it is appears just to be a difference in the way we see the topic.

The choices were available, the knowledge of those choices was not the cause of them, that cause was our free will.

Abdul'baha gave a few talks on this subject and this aspect supports your thoughts.

"....Our meaning is that the choice of good and evil belongs to man, but that under all circumstances he is dependent upon the life-sustaining assistance of Divine Providence. The sovereignty of God is great indeed, and all are held captive in the grasp of His power. The servant can do nothing of his own will alone: God is almighty and all-powerful and bestows His assistance upon all creation..."

It is from this talk, "Free Will and its Limits".

Some Answered Questions | Bahá’í Reference Library

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

You miss the point. I could not do something different to what God had already foreseen!

That's true, but you missed my point.....
If you had done something different God would have foreseen that.

 

[TheBrokenSoul]

Pretty much anything is possible.
The question is, is it probable.

Probable compared to what ?

In a limited observation of existence we are restricted , we do not know the probabilities of what we can't observe . Outside of our visual boundaries could exist multiple life forms and other existences such has humanoid colonies
. If the Universe is infinite then infinite imaginations are possible and any superior existence than ourselves may seem Godly or could be a God compared to ourselves .

 

[Sheldon]

The available evidence that is available is based on localised observations , we do not know what is beyond our observations .

Why is it that whenever a theists says "we don't know", they nearly always follow it up with a claim to know something about what they just said we don't know?

There is possibilities of almost anything outside of our vision in {x^n,y^n,z^n}
space

Hahahhahahahhaa, everytime, pricless. Another thing I've noticed is that people seem to think that not knowing something is impossible, means it must be possible, again priceless.

 

[Sheldon]

Probable compared to what ?

In a limited observation of existence we are restricted , we do not know the probabilities of what we can't observe . Outside of our visual boundaries could exist multiple life forms and other existences such has humanoid colonies
. If the Universe is infinite then infinite imaginations are possible and any superior existence than ourselves may seem Godly or could be a God compared to ourselves .

You don't seem to understand that imagining something, does not mean it is possible.

 

[Sheldon]

Well for your information I have took The Big Theory back a further two stages in history . I have ''Gods'' equation and can explain how the high dense state was formed .

There's nothing on any major news network?

 

[TheBrokenSoul]

You don't seem to understand that imagining something, does not mean it is possible.

Your statement is based on what exactly ? Our own limitations and own observations ?

I think the Star Trek writer(s) have got good imagination of the possibilities out there in uncharted space .

 

[TheBrokenSoul]

There's nothing on any major news network?

Well apparently nobody cares about the truths .

 

[Sheldon]

Well for your information I have took The Big Theory back a further two stages in history . I have ''Gods'' equation and can explain how the high dense state was formed . However , in travelling back two further stages than The Big Bang , I found the scientific possibility of a God , unable to explain energies rudiment of existence any way other than a miracle .
The space-time model is a brilliant '''art'' that works , space-time curvature is equally and proportional to space-time energy curvature . It is actually the field energy that curves and the maths represents the curvature . Electromagnetic fields (space-time energy) , electromagnetic radiation (space-time energy) and space are observably indistinguishable , they are all transparent in nature .
Sorry this may be new information to you .

Will you be claiming the Templeton prize then?

This is just hilarious.

 

[Sheldon]

Templeton Prize - Wikipedia

There's nothing on any major news network?

Well apparently nobody cares about the truths .

That'll be it.

 

[TheBrokenSoul]

Templeton Prize - Wikipedia



That'll be it.

Perhaps I am not too bothered either , would rather just spread my knowledge and thought . To be honest I was disappointed I couldn't go 3 stages before the big bang , an impossible thought . I have to conclude the possible existence of a God based on my findings .

 

[Sheldon]

Sheldon You don't seem to understand that imagining something, does not mean it is possible.

Your statement is based on what exactly ?

Oh I just took a stab in the dark.

I think the Star Trek writer(s) have got good imagination of the possibilities out there in uncharted space .

As do I. You do know it was fictional right? This has to be a windup?

 

[TheBrokenSoul]

Will you be claiming the Templeton prize then?

This is just hilarious.

You have to be nominated I imagine and then face a tough panel of judges . The idea of a prize for normal persons is a great idea but I doubt I'd even make selection even though I seem to understand reality , the science of the Universe and religion .
To be honest all that we are is neurological reference frames programmed by neurological circumstance . Another science though and quite deep .

 

[Sheldon]

Why?

I've explained why multiple times, if you don't understand it by now, repetition isn't going to help.