Atheists: What would be evidence of God’s existence?

[Spirit of Light]

Can you try and give me an example of evidence that atheists are talking about and explain why that is a reasonable or logical requirement?

An example.

As far as my dialog with atheists about the topic of God, they seem to say that if there is no physical evidence as in God showing up and it is clear it is God who stands there, they can not believe there is a god.

Of course, an atheist would be much more suited to answer why they do not believe in God and what evidence they need if they were to believe God exists.

My reason for getting into this discussion was not to attack anyone but to understand why OP starter holds the view she does.

 

[firedragon]

Yes, I do understand the difference But I am glad you took your time to explain it in a different way than the OP starter do Personally, I can disagree a lot with atheists in the topic of if God exists or not, but I also think they are in their right to question me about why and how I believe in a God we can not physically see.

You are absolutely correct.

 

[Trailblazer]

If God did come in person or in other ways show atheists enough evidence that God actually exists.
So their questions is valid since they do not believe in other then what they can see, touch, hear or other ways verify it in a physical existence.
You and I might have a different way of believing in God because we do not need the physical evidence to have faith, but that does not count as evidence for an atheist.

I know all that but I consider it unreasonable for them to expect be able to verify God by physical means.

It does not matter if our evidence does not count as evidence for an atheist, that does not change the fact that they won't be getting the kind of evidence that they want.

 

[firedragon]

As far as my dialog with atheists about the topic of God, they seem to say that if there is no physical evidence as in God showing up and it is clear it is God who stands there, they can not believe there is a god.

Of course, an atheist would be much more suited to answer why they do not believe in God and what evidence they need if they were to believe God exists.

My reason for getting into this discussion was not to attack anyone but to understand why OP starter holds the view she does.

Okay. Just think about it. Is asking for evidence like a God appearing in front of them as evidence reasonable or logical in your thoughts?

 

[firedragon]

I know all that but I consider it unreasonable for them to expect be able to verify God by physical means.
.

Absolutely. It’s illogical to ask for physical evidence to a metaphysical topic. Either not engage in it at all or engage with logic. That’s the whole point of logic.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I know all that but I consider it unreasonable for them to expect be able to verify God by physical means.

It does not matter if our evidence does not count as evidence for an atheist, that does not change the fact that they won't be getting the kind of evidence that they want.

Then the question for me still is. why use 9 years on a forum to discuss with atheists who you know will disagree with you and ask you more questions?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Okay. Just think about it. Is asking for evidence like a God appearing in front of them as evidence reasonable or logical in your thoughts?

I believe God would be able to do it, but what would be the reason for us to develop our spiritual aspects of life, so yes, if atheists want to easy way out, the question of direct proof would be suited for them. But for those of us who see God as something we strive to understand and have faith in even we do not see God, that means our road is bumpy and take times, and to me I believe the reward is much greater in the end

 

[Trailblazer]

Then the question for me still is. why use 9 years on a forum to discuss with atheists who you know will disagree with you and ask you more questions?

I think I told you already but I will explain it again maybe in a different way this time because my mood is a little different.

I do not mind if atheists disagree with me or ask questions because that is how we learn. I learn about how they think and they learn about what I believe. The goal is not to change them, I have no goal, but if they chose to change the way they think I would not be disappointed because I believe that God has created us to know Him and as such , it is a great loss for atheists to miss out on that.

Now, as to the question of why I keep going round and round in circles with the same atheists over and over and over again, that is probably a psychological problem that I have. It is called insanity!

 

[firedragon]

Then the question for me still is. why use 9 years on a forum to discuss with atheists who you know will disagree with you and ask you more questions?

Brother. Dialog is the most important factor in a global village.

once brother in the same thread, four different atheists said that theists like you and I are all stupid and have stunted brains with no scientific or mathematical prowess. The same thread, four different atheists.

10 years ago or 15 years ago it was a different landscape. The missionary atheists have gathered legs. I say specifically, the missionary atheists. So just to test the waters I spoke of an old Muslim Mathematical guru who is deemed the father of algebra and in fact named it algebra by providence. You know what they said? The argument was that “he was not a Muslim, he pretended to be a Muslim because the government forced him”. Lol.

It’s because of the number of years, you can see the progress and the regression. I’m in the phone so please excuse if any sentence doesn’t make sense.

Peace.

 

[Trailblazer]

I believe God would be able to do it

How?

 

[firedragon]

I believe God would be able to do it, but what would be the reason for us to develop our spiritual aspects of life, so yes, if atheists want to easy way out, the question of direct proof would be suited for them. But for those of us who see God as something we strive to understand and have faith in even we do not see God, that means our road is bumpy and take times, and to me I believe the reward is much greater in the end

Okay. So you’re saying god would be able to appear for atheists to see.

That’s a logical impossibility. Because the topic is metaphysical and the request is physical. Gods ability is not the topic. Do you understand the nature of logic in it?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Brother. Dialog is the most important factor in a global village.

once brother in the same thread, four different atheists said that theists like you and I are all stupid and have stunted brains with no scientific or mathematical prowess. The same thread, four different atheists.

10 years ago or 15 years ago it was a different landscape. The missionary atheists have gathered legs. I say specifically, the missionary atheists. So just to test the waters I spoke of an old Muslim Mathematical guru who is deemed the father of algebra and in fact named it algebra by providence. You know what they said? The argument was that “he was not a Muslim, he pretended to be a Muslim because the government forced him”. Lol.

It’s because of the number of years, you can see the progress and the regression. I’m in the phone so please excuse if any sentence doesn’t make sense.

Peace.

I am 100 % agree that dialog is most important, and this is also why my own dialog with atheists has become more friendly, because I know very well how I threaded atheists in the past, and it was not nice.

 

[firedragon]

I am 100 % agree that dialog is most important, and this is also why my own dialog with atheists has become more friendly, because I know very well how I threaded atheists in the past, and it was not nice.

That’s why we should never ask anyone why they are talking for 9 years. That’s the whole point of my post brotherman.

 

[Spirit of Light]

How?

I can not answer for God and how God would be able to do because I do not know the answer my self, only God knows in what way God works.

 

[Spirit of Light]

That’s why we should never ask anyone why they are talking for 9 years. That’s the whole point of my post brotherman.

I agree I might stepped over the line with that question yes.

 

[firedragon]

I agree I might stepped over the line with that question yes.

Alright. Think about things further. Let’s say you are a Sufi, and you ask Ibn Arabi for physical evidence for god. You tell him God is all powerful, so why can’t he appear in front of an atheist. What do you think he will say?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Alright. Think about things further. Let’s say you are a Sufi, and you ask Ibn Arabi for physical evidence for god. You tell him God is all powerful, so why can’t he appear in front of an atheist. What do you think he will say?

I would think his answer would be something on the line of:

You will see the physical evidence of God if and when you seek deep within your own being, then when you find God within you, God will appear in the physical world no matter where you go.

Of course, my words here could never reach the wisdom of Ibn Arabi So probably his words would sound different than my attempt at what he might have said.

 

[firedragon]

I would think his answer would be something on the line of:

You will see the physical evidence of God if and when you seek deep within your own being, then when you find God within you, God will appear in the physical world no matter where you go.

Of course, my words here could never reach the wisdom of Ibn Arabi So probably his words would sound different than my attempt at what he might have said.

Im on my phone so I cannot quote him verbally so excuse me. Ibn Arabi is an amazing philosopher and I am an ardent reader.

He would say that the tree down the street is God himself.

Do you understand the depth of what he is saying?

 

[ChristineM]

It is not about God's abilities. How can humans verify God if God does not want to be verified?

So hes/she/it is a recluse, If you god does not want to be known then what point in worship? Of course you will have an answer to that question that satisfies you.

There is a book by Terry Pratchett called "small gods" rather interesting and logical even if it is fantasy. I can recommend it to people who are not offended by humour.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Im on my phone so I cannot quote him verbally so excuse me. Ibn Arabi is an amazing philosopher and I am an ardent reader.

He would say that the tree down the street is God himself.

Do you understand the depth of what he is saying?

Yes of course I understand what you saying And the words you used may be closer to an actually Iben Arabi quote than my words