• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Atheists Will go to Heaven?

kjw47

kjw47

Well-Known Member
Kellymac said:
No he wasn't. Who told you that? He resigned voluntarily. He was 85 years old and in poor health. If you think that's forced you might want to review your vocabulary.
Click to expand...


I remember it well. you are in error. They may covered it up for the most part, but truth came out.
 
Hermit Philosopher

Hermit Philosopher

Selflessly here for you
Nakosis said:
Was the Pope wrong about atheists getting into heaven?

More recently (April 15th, 2018) Pope Francis claimed that atheists get to Heaven, thus reinforcing the impression that his opinions on the afterlife are somewhat clumsy when compared to standard biblical views. Both statements, in fact, have to do with the eternal destiny of people, the former suggesting the prospect of annihilation (i.e. the waning away of the soul) and the latter implying a form of universalism (i.e. all will ultimately be saved regardless of their faith in Christ).
Do Atheists go to Heaven? Pope Francis says yes
Click to expand...


Pope Francis is a wise soul.

Humbly
Hermit
 
kjw47

kjw47

Well-Known Member
Kellymac said:
Can you provide a link? No offense but you remembering it well really doesn't mean anything.
Click to expand...


How could i. it was years ago and has no bearing on the spreading of Gods good news today. Other Popes in history have done things.1 use to sell salvation for $$$. Where was the Pope when the young men in his religion were killing for a man named Hitler? Killing their own supposed brothers in Christ who stood on the other side. They could clearly see as the world did that Hitler was a power mad murderer. Why didnt he speak up and tell the young men to stop killing for him? Is that the love amongst themselves Jesus said would mark his religion? They threw Jesus away to accomplish that. And all of creation witnessed one of the biggest hipocrosys of all time. The clergys and flock prayed to the same God on both sides of that slaughter.

Here is clear evidence they do not know Jesus-- They make sure men know they give food to the poor, for a pat on the back, a temporary fix. And at the same time fail both Jesus and the one in need because in a single teaching from Jesus gave to all free the permanent fix--Matthew 6:33-- Matthew 6 is all about the permanent fix. So why do they not teach this to those in need at the same time they hand out food, or better yet before they become in need?
 
1

1213

Well-Known Member
Clara Tea said:
Matthew was a human, not God, and may have misunderstood Jesus. Jesus might have said that those who believe in him will have eternal life. But is that life in hell?
...
Click to expand...

I don't think people live in hell, because Bible tells soul and body are destroyed there.

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28
 
1

1213

Well-Known Member
Nakosis said:
What if punishment is eternal until the time they choose to be righteous?
...
Click to expand...

I believe eternal punishment means there is no coming back, one is utterly destroyed in hell, as Bible says in here:

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28
 
1

1213

Well-Known Member
epronovost said:
You are making a post hoc fallacy there. If you are going to use the Bible as sources for the rules surrounding who gets to go into heaven, you must also use the Bible to define what is a righteous person. You can't just assume that righteousness is whatever you believe is good...
Click to expand...

I agree with that. People should use Biblical definition for righteous. And one part of it is these:

...He who does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he can't sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the devil. Whoever doesn't do righteousness is not of God, neither is he who doesn't love his brother.
1 John 3:7-10

"Two men went up into the temple to pray; one was a Pharisee, and the other was a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and prayed to himself like this: 'God, I thank you, that I am not like the rest of men, extortioners, unrighteous, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week. I give tithes of all that I get.' But the tax collector, standing far away, wouldn't even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, a sinner!' I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."
Luke 18:10-14

But the righteous will live by faith. If he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him.
Hebrews 10:38
 
epronovost

epronovost

Well-Known Member
1213 said:
I agree with that. People should use Biblical definition for righteous. And one part of it is these:

...He who does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he can't sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the devil. Whoever doesn't do righteousness is not of God, neither is he who doesn't love his brother.
1 John 3:7-10

"Two men went up into the temple to pray; one was a Pharisee, and the other was a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and prayed to himself like this: 'God, I thank you, that I am not like the rest of men, extortioners, unrighteous, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week. I give tithes of all that I get.' But the tax collector, standing far away, wouldn't even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, a sinner!' I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."
Luke 18:10-14

But the righteous will live by faith. If he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him.
Hebrews 10:38
Click to expand...

The last one seems to clearly exclude atheists and maybe even non-Christian from the righteous. It seems a key component of righteousness is a humble and supplicant faith toward God; something no atheist has.
 
Father Heathen

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
DNB said:
Smarten up, that's no where near analogous to what I said.
If someone offered me a million dollars as long as treat others as myself, and I refused it, then my remorse over the loss is something that i will have to live with - no one is torturing me.
Click to expand...
The resurrection/salvation thing is a protection racket.

Also it requires more than following the golden rule to get into heaven. You have nibble and massage a specific god's ego through praise and worship and backflip through arbitrary hoops with "sins" that have consistent or coherent standards or criteria.
Also, when you give something with the expectation of receiving something in return, it's not really a gift. It's a lot like those creeps who think girls "owe" them after showering them with unsolicited gifts, favors, etc. and then get salty when they don't put out.
 
Last edited:
DNB

DNB

Christian
Father Heathen said:
The resurrection/salvation thing is a protection racket.

Also it requires more than following the golden rule to get into heaven. You have nibble and massage a specific god's ego through praise and worship and backflip through arbitrary hoops with "sins" that have consistent or coherent standards or criteria.
Also, when you give something with the expectation of receiving something in return, it's not really a gift. It's a lot like those creeps who think girls "owe" them after showering them with unsolicited gifts, favors, etc. and then get salty when they don't put out.
Click to expand...
Salvation is by Grace through Faith, no one earned it. You need to read the/your Bible more.
 
1

1213

Well-Known Member
epronovost said:
The last one seems to clearly exclude atheists and maybe even non-Christian from the righteous. It seems a key component of righteousness is a humble and supplicant faith toward God; something no atheist has.
Click to expand...

If one is faithful (loyal) to God, he keeps God’s commandments that are all basically in the commandment to love one’s neighbor as oneself. It may be possible that atheist understands it is good and therefore does so. And if so, I believe the person can be counted righteous.

For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without the law. As many as have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. For it isn't the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law will be justified (for when Gentiles who don't have the law do by nature the things of the law, these, not having the law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience testifying with them, and their thoughts among themselves accusing or else excusing them) in the day when God will judge the secrets of men, according to my gospel, by Jesus Christ.
Romans 2:12-16
 
Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
lostwanderingsoul said:
That is just the way non-believers are. They are about things they do not understand or believe.
Click to expand...
We are analogous to psychiatrists delving into the
dysfunctions of our clients. We seek to understand
their delusions, & to help them recover their sanity.
But in our magnanimity, we do this gratis.
 
P

pearl

Well-Known Member
It is God who saves, not religion. I know Atheists who would put us Christians to shame, following the Beatitudes through their own conscience. However, even the Atheist is saved through Christ as we all are even while not acknowledge him.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top