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Baha'i and Islamic concepts of Prophets - Similar or irreconcilably different?

Are Islamic and Baha'i concepts of Prophethood reconcilable?

  • Yes

    Votes: 4 26.7%
  • No

    Votes: 4 26.7%
  • Mostly reconcilable

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • Mostly irreconcilable

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • I don't know

    Votes: 5 33.3%
  • This poll doesn't reflect my thinking

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    15

Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
Islam and the Baha'i Faith are two independent religions. Islam emerged from the Arabian Peninsula during the seventh century and was founded by Muhammad. Both Muslims and Baha'is believe Muhammad to be a Messenger of God and the Quran to be the authenticated Word of God. The Quran refers to Prophets and Messengers throughout multiple passages. According to wikipedia:

Prophets in Islam are individuals to serve as examples of ideal human behavior and to spread God's message on Earth. Some prophets are categorized as messengers, those who transmit divine revelation, most of them through the interaction of an angel. Muslims believe that many prophets existed, including many not mentioned in the Quran. The Quran states: "There is a Messenger for every community". Belief in the Islamic prophets is one of the six articles of the Islamic faith.

Prophets and messengers in Islam - Wikipedia

There is much that could be said about the nature of Prophethood in Islam. It is a huge topic.

During the nineteenth century within Shi'a Islamic Persia (now Iran) the Baha'i Faith emerged. During a time of Messianic expectation in regards a redeemer of Islam known as the Mahdi, hundreds of thousands accepted the Bab as being this redeemer and followed His Cause. The conservative and fanatical government and clergy regarded this new movement with disdain and eventually thousands of the early Babis were put to death including the Bab Himself.

The Central Purpose of the Bab's message was to prepare His followers for One whose cause was even greater than His own. That Promised One was widely recognized as being Baha'u'llah by the vast majority of the Babis who became Baha'is. Baha'u'llah elaborated on the concept of Prophethood in one of His early and most important works, the Kitab-i-Iqan. There are many other works through Baha'u'llah's forty year mission between receiving His summons to His Divine Mission while imprisoned in the Siyah Chal, in Tehran 1852 (The Message Baha’u’llah Received in the Black Pit) until His passing in a mansion in Bahji 1892. In His Will and Testament Baha'u'llah appointed His eldest Son, 'Abdu'l-Baha as successor and His elaborations on His Father's works are considered authoritative.

'Abdu'l-Baha elaborates on the concept of Prophets and Messengers of God as follows:

"The Prophets and Messengers of God have been sent down for the sole purpose of guiding mankind to the straight Path of Truth. The purpose underlying their revelation hath been to educate all men, that they may, at the hour of death, ascend, in the utmost purity and sanctity and with absolute detachment, to the throne of the Most High. The light which these souls radiate is responsible for the progress of the world and the advancement of its peoples. They are like unto leaven which leaveneth the world of being, and constitute the animating force through which the arts and wonders of the world are made manifest. Through them the clouds rain their bounty upon men, and the earth bringeth forth its fruits. All things must needs have a cause, a motive power, an animating principle. These souls and symbols of detachment have provided, and will continue to provide, the supreme moving impulse in the world of being."

"God sent all His Prophets into the world with one aim, to sow in the hearts of men love and goodwill, and for this great purpose, they were willing to suffer and to die. All the sacred Books were written to lead and direct man into the ways of love and unity; and yet, in spite of all this, we have the sad spectacle of war and bloodshed in our midst."


Manifestation of God (Baháʼí Faith) - Wikipedia

Of course there is much that could be said about the concept of Prophethood in the Baha'i Faith. Like Islam, it is a huge topic. However my question is a simple one. Is the concept of Prophethood in the Baha'i Faith compatible with that in Islam? Are the concepts of Prophethood within the two religions so fundamentally different as to irreconcilable?

Thanks for dropping by.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
@adrian009
As far as i am aware of the Quran mention 25 different prophets, in sufi teaching it is said that total amount of prophets in human history, has been 124.000 prophets.

But the 25 mention in the Quran is (Prophets-in-Quran.pdf (wilmetteinstitute.org) )

Adam Idris (Enoch) Nuh (Noah) Hud (Heber) Salih (Methusaleh) Lut (Lot) Ibrahim (Abraham) Ismail (Ishmael) Ishaq (Isaac) Yaqub (Jacob) Yusuf (Joseph) Shu’aib (Jethro) Ayyub (Job) Dhulkifl (Ezekiel) Musa (Moses) Harun (Aaron) Dawud (David) Sulayman (Solomon) Ilias (Elias) Alyasa (Elisha) Yunus (Jonah) Zakariya (Zachariah) Yahya (John the Baptist) Isa (Jesus) Muhammad Peace Be Upon Them All

So from this i can not find anything within Islam that say the Baha`u`lla is a prophet in Maintream islam or suffism. But does that mean he could not be a prophet of some sort? No in my understanding it does not.
 

Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
@adrian009
As far as i am aware of the Quran mention 25 different prophets, in sufi teaching it is said that total amount of prophets in human history, has been 124.000 prophets.

But the 25 mention in the Quran is (Prophets-in-Quran.pdf (wilmetteinstitute.org) )

Adam Idris (Enoch) Nuh (Noah) Hud (Heber) Salih (Methusaleh) Lut (Lot) Ibrahim (Abraham) Ismail (Ishmael) Ishaq (Isaac) Yaqub (Jacob) Yusuf (Joseph) Shu’aib (Jethro) Ayyub (Job) Dhulkifl (Ezekiel) Musa (Moses) Harun (Aaron) Dawud (David) Sulayman (Solomon) Ilias (Elias) Alyasa (Elisha) Yunus (Jonah) Zakariya (Zachariah) Yahya (John the Baptist) Isa (Jesus) Muhammad Peace Be Upon Them All

So from this i can not find anything within Islam that say the Baha`u`lla is a prophet in Maintream islam or suffism. But does that mean he could not be a prophet of some sort? No in my understanding it does not.

The issue of whether or not Bahá’u’lláh is a Prophet is an entirely different one from what is being asked. The question is about comparing conceptions of Prophethood within Islam and the Baha’i Faith.

Naturally as the Baha’i Faith emerged more than 1,200 years after the Quran was revealed, there is no mention of the Bab or Bahá’u’lláh. Most Muslims view Muhammad as being the final Prophet of all time so the Baha’i Faith making claims that the Bab and Bahá’u’lláh were Prophets is considered apostasy by many.

The focus of the OP should be Baha’i and Islamic conceptions of Prophethood based on their respective scriptures. It is most likely too difficult a question for many on this forum as both the Quran and Baha’i scriptures are not well understood among the generality of RF members.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
The issue of whether or not Bahá’u’lláh is a Prophet is an entirely different one from what is being asked. The question about comparing conceptions of Prophethood within Islam and the Baha’i Faith.

Naturally as the Baha’i Faith emerged more than 1,200 years after the Quran was revealed, there is no mention of the Bab or Bahá’u’lláh. Most Muslims view Muhammad as being the final Prophet of all time so the Baha’i Faith making claims that the Bab and Bahá’u’lláh were Prophets is considered apostasy by many.

The focus of the OP should be Baha’i and Islamic conceptions of Prophethood based on their respective scriptures. It is most likely too difficult a question for many on this forum as both the Quran and Baha’i scriptures are not well understood among the generality of RF members.
Honestly i know the Baha`i teaching (and probably the Quran) to shallow to give a good answer to your OP @adrian009 :) So comparing them is not something i can do very well.
 

Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
Interesting verse.
Seems to me 'not 1 Messenger/Religion for all'
(Unless you count Love as a Religion)

Here's the verse from the Quran.

“And We certainly sent into every nation a messenger, [saying], “Worship Allah and avoid Taghut.” And among them were those whom Allah guided, and among them were those upon whom error was [deservedly] decreed.
(Quran, 16:36).


It makes sense that God in His love for all humanity sent a Prophet to every people. It would be unjust to guide some people while leaving others bereft of guidance. It of course raises the important question as to whether or not Buddha, Krishna and the like should be considered Prophets. This is a matter early Islamic scholars devoted considerable attention as Islam rapidly expanded and significant contact with Buddhism and Hinduism was experienced. The question was whether or not such religions should be considered Dhimmi as were Judaism and Christianity.

Dhimmi - Wikipedia.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
Do Bahais have prophets????? I thought they only had "manifestations".
If they only had "manifestations", then of course, their view differs from that in Judaism, Christianity, and the various denominations of Islam.
Bahaollah was not a prophet, he was the sender of prophets (mursil al-rasul).
 

stvdv

Veteran Member
Here's the verse from the Quran.

“And We certainly sent into every nation a messenger, [saying], “Worship Allah and avoid Taghut.” And among them were those whom Allah guided, and among them were those upon whom error was [deservedly] decreed.
(Quran, 16:36).


It makes sense that God in His love for all humanity sent a Prophet to every people. It would be unjust to guide some people while leaving others bereft of guidance. It of course raises the important question as to whether or not Buddha, Krishna and the like should be considered Prophets. This is a matter early Islamic scholars devoted considerable attention as Islam rapidly expanded and significant contact with Buddhism and Hinduism was experienced. The question was whether or not such religions should be considered Dhimmi as were Judaism and Christianity.

Dhimmi - Wikipedia.
Thanks for the extra information. Interesting addition, I need to contemplate on that to get it more palatable:D I let you know end of the day
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
No. It would be valid to use the term Prophet as well as Manifestation.
In His Writings, Baha'u'llah uses the words Manifestation, Messenger and Prophet interchangeably. For example, in this section of Gleanings where Baha'u'llah wrote about Prophets He was referring to the Prophets who are also Messengers and Manifestations of God.

Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 77-82

There are other kinds of Prophets who are not Messengers or Manifestations of God; they are followers and promoters of the Messengers and Manifestations of God such as Solomon, David, Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel.
 

Niblo

Active Member
Premium Member
Hi Adrian,

I trust you are well.

It is necessary to clarify the use of the word ‘prophet’; an alien word when applied to the Arabic language; and especially so when it is used within the context of Islam. The correct words to use in this context are ‘Nabī’ and ‘Rasūl’.

A Nabī is a man sent by Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) to provide guidance, or give warning, to those who are already under the Law; whereas a Rasūl (‘Messenger’) is charged with delivering the Law in the first place – in the form of scripture (he is also required to provide guidance and give warning, of course). All Rasūl are considered to be Nabī; but not all Nabī were Rasūl.

Muhammad (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) was a Rasūl.

Incidentally, Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) confirms that David was also a Rasūl: ‘We have sent revelation to you (Muhammad) as We did to Noah and the prophets after him, to Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, to Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and Solomon – to David We gave the Scripture (Zabur).’ (Al-Nisa: 163).

Bahá'u'lláh writes: ‘None of the many Prophets sent down, since Moses was made manifest, as Messengers of the Word of God; such as David, Jesus, and others among the more exalted Manifestations who have appeared during the intervening period between the Revelations of Moses and Muhammad……….’ (Kitáb-i-Íqán; Article 55).

Abdu’l-Bahá, on the other hand, contradicts both Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) and Bahá'u'lláh when he states that:

‘The Manifestations of universal Prophethood who appeared independently are, for example, Abraham, Moses, Christ, Muhammad, the Báb and Bahá’u’lláh. But the others who are followers and promoters are like Solomon, David, Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel…………(of) themselves they have no power and might, except what they receive from the independent Prophets. (Some Answered Questions, p. 164-165).

Baha’is have to decide who to believe: Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) or Abdu’l-Bahá!

Have a great week, and very best regards.
 
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shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Do Bahais have prophets????? I thought they only had "manifestations".
If they only had "manifestations", then of course, their view differs from that in Judaism, Christianity, and the various denominations of Islam.
Bahaollah was not a prophet, he was the sender of prophets (mursil al-rasul).

Manifestations are prophets throughout the history of humanity.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Most ancient religions believe and interpret their scripture as the last and only religion for now and the future of humanity. or the promise of some future revelation the fully justifies everything they believe. If humanity can get over this barrier there can be reconcilation of beliefs between religions and the realization that the spiritual relationship with God is universal and constantly evolving and changing for humanity to come closer to God.
 

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
HI Adrian,

I trust you are well.

It is necessary to clarify the use of the word ‘prophet’; an alien word when applied to the Arabic language; and especially so when it is used within the context of Islam. The correct words to use in this context are ‘Nabī’ and ‘Rasūl’.

A Nabī is a man sent by Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) to provide guidance, or give warning, to those who are already under the Law; whereas a Rasūl (‘Messenger’) is charged with delivering the Law in the first place – in the form of scripture (he is also required to provide guidance and give warning, of course). All Rasūl are considered to be Nabī; but not all Nabī were Rasūl.

Muhammad (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) was a Rasūl.

Incidentally, Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) confirms that David was also a Rasūl: ‘We have sent revelation to you (Muhammad) as We did to Noah and the prophets after him, to Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, to Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and Solomon – to David We gave the Scripture (Zabur).’ (Al-Nisa: 163).

Bahá'u'lláh writes: ‘None of the many Prophets sent down, since Moses was made manifest, as Messengers of the Word of God; such as David, Jesus, and others among the more exalted Manifestations who have appeared during the intervening period between the Revelations of Moses and Muhammad……….’ (Kitáb-i-Íqán; Article 55).

Abdu’l-Bahá, on the other hand, contradicts both Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) and Bahá'u'lláh when he states that:

‘The Manifestations of universal Prophethood who appeared independently are, for example, Abraham, Moses, Christ, Muhammad, the Báb and Bahá’u’lláh. But the others who are followers and promoters are like Solomon, David, Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel…………(of) themselves they have no power and might, except what they receive from the independent Prophets. (Some Answered Questions, p. 164-165).

Baha’is have to decide who to believe: Allāh (subḥānahu ūta'āla) or Abdu’l-Bahá!

Have a great week, and very best regards.
In Bahai view there were two David. One David who revealed Zabour, and He was before Moses and another was king David who authored Psalms, who was a promoter like Solomon.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Then why just nine? There are scores of prophets mentioned in Torah, Bible and Quran.

Manifestations are prophets, but not all prophets are manifestations of God. The Baha'i view is there are nine major Manifestation of God in the Progressive Revelation, and ages in the Adamic cycle. There are minor prophets within each age of the history of humanity The Adamic cycle is not the only cycle of progressive Revelation in the history of humanity.
 

Niblo

Active Member
Premium Member
In Bahai view there were two David. One David who revealed Zabour, and He was before Moses and another was king David who authored Psalms, who was a promoter like Solomon.

The Bible and Qur'an know only one David, and that is King David. It is he, and he alone, that the Qur'an is referring to. The 'Zabur' given to him by his Lord is the Book of Psalms.

And how come neither Bahá'u'lláh nor Abdu’l-Bahá mention two Davids in their respective writings: The one given the 'Zabur' and the one who was not?
 
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Saint Frankenstein

Here for the ride
Premium Member
I would say they're not the same as Baha'i's view their prophets as basically on the level of demigods and that's not allowed in Islam. There are no "manifestations of God" in Islam.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
No. It would be valid to use the term Prophet as well as Manifestation.

I've nothing else to add, but wanted to question.

Isn't a prophet someone who speaks in the name of god (from an imperfect person) and a manifestation someone who is god incarnate/however defined (perfect person)?

For example, Moses would be a prophet as he had flaws but did things god told him but jesus, according to christianity, would be likened to a manifestation or incarnation as his place in major christian text is equal to and/or god himself. I thought manifestation fall into the latter line of thinking?
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
The Old Testament mentions only one David, and that is King David. It is he, and he alone, that the Qur'an is referring to. The 'Zabur' given to him by his Lord is the Book of Psalms.

And how come neither Bahá'u'lláh nor Abdu’l-Bahá mention two Davids in their respective writings: The one given the 'Zabur' and the one who was not?

I believe there is only one David.
 
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