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Biblical Salvation

Mickey Mouse

Mickey Mouse

Member
thedictator said:
Baptism is not a work that I do it is someting that is done to me by man and God. The Greek word is a passive Verb, That means I'm not doing work. Baptism is a form of Faith. Five Greek words make up the English word Faith.

Peitho-Primary Verb-The root word to all of the faith words.
Definition: 1. to persuade 2. to be induced to believe 3. to have faith 4. to trust 5. to listen to 6. to obey ( this is physical action ) 7. to yield to ( what baptism is ) 8. to comply with


Elpis-Noun Feminine
Definition: 1. expectation 2. hope 3. cofident 4. having faith


Oligopistos-Noun
Definition: little faith


Pisteuo-Verb
Definition: 1. to think to be true 2. to be persuaded of 3. to credit 4. obtaining or doing something ( this is physical action ) 5. entrusted


Pistis-Noun
Definition: 1. Conviction of the truth 2. religious beliefs 3. faithfulness 4 Fidelity 5. assurance 6. a pledge to ( this is Baptism 1 Peter 3:21 ) 7. Proof of

Strong's Hebrew and Greek lexicon and Regent University Official Greek Lexicon

The fact is Faith is more than just belief. So Repent a part of Pisteuo and peitho (faith) confession a part of Pisteuo (faith) Baptism a part of Peitho, Pesteuo, and pistis (faith).

In the Greek faith can be and is physical action. Hebrews 11 gives us a long list of active Faith.

No one in the Church of Christ that I know believe that we are saved by works and I know 1000's of them.
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I believe anything that you are required to be saved (in a Christian sense) is considered a work. If you must generate a personal faith or are required to be baptized in water, this is something that man must do to be saved. Therefore, I believe you are requiring a work of faith and obdiedence work of water baptism. Please give me your definition of grace.
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
Baptism is not a work that I do it is someting that is done to me by man and God.
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A wonderful statement with the following small change: "Baptism is not a work that I do, it is something that is done to me by God through human agents."
 
R

Ronald

Well-Known Member
Mickey Mouse said:
I see your religion is "The Way". What kind of religion is "The Way". Please share your religion.
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Ac 24:14 But this I admit to you, that according to the Way, which they call a sect, I worship the God of our fathers, believing everything laid down by the law or written in the prophets,
Joh 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me.
Ps 25:5 Lead me in thy truth, and teach me, for thou art the God of my salvation; for thee I wait all the day long.
Ps 27:1 ¶ A Psalm of David. The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The LORD is the stronghold of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?
De 6:4 ¶ "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one.
Quoted in Mt.4:4; De 8:3 And he humbled you and let you hunger and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know; that he might make you know that man does not live by bread alone, but that man lives by everything that proceeds out of the mouth of the LORD.
Joh 1:1 ¶ In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

The Torah is "Truth"/Word of God/ the word made flesh.

Shalom
 
Mickey Mouse

Mickey Mouse

Member
Ronald said:
Ac 24:14 But this I admit to you, that according to the Way, which they call a sect, I worship the God of our fathers, believing everything laid down by the law or written in the prophets,
Joh 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me.
Ps 25:5 Lead me in thy truth, and teach me, for thou art the God of my salvation; for thee I wait all the day long.
Ps 27:1 ¶ A Psalm of David. The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The LORD is the stronghold of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?
De 6:4 ¶ "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one.
Quoted in Mt.4:4; De 8:3 And he humbled you and let you hunger and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know; that he might make you know that man does not live by bread alone, but that man lives by everything that proceeds out of the mouth of the LORD.
Joh 1:1 ¶ In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

The Torah is "Truth"/Word of God/ the word made flesh.

Shalom
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Are you saying the way is traditional Christianity?
 
T

thedictator

A Dictator of a Coach
Mickey Mouse said:
I believe anything that you are required to be saved (in a Christian sense) is considered a work. If you must generate a personal faith or are required to be baptized in water, this is something that man must do to be saved. Therefore, I believe you are requiring a work of faith and obdiedence work of water baptism. Please give me your definition of grace.
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Is Belief in Jesus Christ a work?
 
R

Ronald

Well-Known Member
Mickey Mouse said:
Are you saying the way is traditional Christianity?
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No! The Way was predominately Jewish, pre-dating Christianity.
Read Acts 2, how many Gentiles can you find mentioned?
Peter addressed them "Men of Judea" no mention of the Nations!

Shalom
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
thedictator said:
How do you know that the thief on the cross was not baptized. Did you ask him? He could have been baptized by John years before the cross.
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But the Bible doesn't say that he was Baptised, and according to the "rules of the movement:" "Where the scriptures speak, we speak, where the scriptures are silent, we are silent." Therefore, your argument is moot.
 
T

thedictator

A Dictator of a Coach
sojourner said:
But the Bible doesn't say that he was Baptised, and according to the "rules of the movement:" "Where the scriptures speak, we speak, where the scriptures are silent, we are silent." Therefore, your argument is moot.
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The fact is we do not know, the thief on the cross, can not be used as an argument against baptism.
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
thedictator said:
The fact is we do not know, the thief on the cross, can not be used as an argument against baptism.
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The fact is that baptism is not mentioned in conjunction with Jesus' pardoning of the thief. What we do know from the Biblical record is that Jesus pardoned the thief based solely upon the thief's defense of Jesus and his subsequent appeal for mercy. Therefore, it can reasonably be argued that baptism is unnecessary.
 
R

Ronald

Well-Known Member
sojourner said:
But the Bible doesn't say that he was Baptised, and according to the "rules of the movement:" "Where the scriptures speak, we speak, where the scriptures are silent, we are silent." Therefore, your argument is moot.
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Wow! A slap with the words of the movement! Go, man go!
 
T

thedictator

A Dictator of a Coach
Thief On the Cross

1. We do not know that he was or that he was not Baptized, he may have been baptized by John who knows. The New Covenant had not come as of this time.

2. When Jesus Christ was on Earth he had been given the right to forgive sins. ( Matthew 9:6 )

3. Today Jesus Christ is not Physically on the Earth, we now have the New Covenant authority for salvation.
 
Mickey Mouse

Mickey Mouse

Member
thedictator said:
How do you know that the thief on the cross was not baptized. Did you ask him? He could have been baptized by John years before the cross.
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Well, I read the Bible too. Read the gospel accounts of the two thiefs on the cross.

Luke 23:39-43

One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"
But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."
Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom." Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."
 
Mickey Mouse

Mickey Mouse

Member
thedictator said:
Is Belief in Jesus Christ ( a work that we do. ) required to be saved.
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Jesus called belief a work in the Bible.

John 6:26-29
Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, you are looking for me, not because you saw miraculous signs but because you ate the loaves and had your fill. Do not work for food that spoils, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you. On him God the Father has placed his seal of approval."

Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?" Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."
 
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