Bill Gates: "Private Sector [Research and Development] is in General Inept"

[Acim]

It's gotta be real tough doing research when using billions of taxpayer money and spinning results to match your Democrat overlords, so that they'll give you more money.

 

[tytlyf]

It's gotta be real tough doing research when using billions of taxpayer money and spinning results to match your Democrat overlords, so that they'll give you more money.

Surely you have an example of 'spinning results' and getting more money?

 

[esmith]

Surely you have an example of 'spinning results' and getting more money?

Well I'm waiting for your data concerning your lack of data for posts 16,18,and 20. Or is it that you just go away when someone calls you out for making false statements.

 

[tytlyf]

Well I'm waiting for your data concerning your lack of data for posts 16,18,and 20. Or is it that you just go away when someone calls you out for making false statements.

What data? That defense spending is destroying our debt? Ok, I'll play.

https://www.nationalpriorities.org/budget-basics/federal-budget-101/spending/

 

[esmith]

What data? That defense spending is destroying our debt? Ok, I'll play.

https://www.nationalpriorities.org/budget-basics/federal-budget-101/spending/

View attachment 13190

You do know, well maybe you don't, that there is more to the budget than Discretionary spending. Since you do not seem to know, the budget is made up of Discretionary, Mandatory, and Interest on the debt amounts.
However, I will give you high marks in attempting to make your point with partial data.
You did make the false statement "The biggest contributor to the debt is defense spending" didn't you.
Now let's look at the total federal budget for 2016
Source

Maybe you prefer the 2015 data

Seems as usual you are totally wrong. Defense is at 22%, Health Care is at 28% and Pensions are at 26% (percentage rounded since total is 101%). I don't know what school you went to but the last time I checked 22 is less than 28 and 26

Hmmm seems your presented "facts"(?) are a little misleading

Now lets look at your source

Seems you are using the same ploy that most people of your political persuasion use.....Finding incomplete data to support your misinformation.
Seems that your statement, as usual, is misleading. I do believe that $598.5 billion (Military) is less than $1246.6 billion and $985.7 billion and this is using your source.

Why don't you just admit that your statement was wrong and accept the facts?

 

[Mr Spinkles]

As usual making a statement that is not supported by the facts.
Of course we know you don't care about facts, only your agenda.
FACTS

Spending is related to debt, but does not = debt. Non-discretionary programs like Social Security and Medicare have specific taxes in place designed to pay for them. So even though we spend a lot on them, we also raise a lot of revenue to pay for them, which reduces govt. borrowing (debt).

Discretionary military spending OTOH has to be funded by additional borrowing, unless taxes are raised to pay for it. So military spending may have the greatest impact on govt. debt even though it's not the largest expenditure. A particularly striking example of how the GOP thinks about debt was when the Bush administration decided to fight two simultaneous wars and not raise taxes to pay for them (in fact, he lowered taxes).

 

[Revoltingest]

A particularly striking example of how the GOP thinks about debt was when the Bush administration decided to fight two simultaneous wars and not raise taxes to pay for them (in fact, he lowered taxes).

This is not quite accurate.
While Bush (2001-2009) signed a bill which lowered marginal rates slightly, there were other changes which offset this.
Tax revenue actually increased under Bush.

From.....
http://www.usgovernmentrevenue.com/total_chart_gallery

We find the net effect of all changes in the tax code....

One might argue that the increase is due to economic growth,
but the revenue gains exceed this for most years (01-09).
Ref....
http://www.multpl.com/us-gdp-growth-rate/table/by-year

Too few people realize that tax rates are only part of the story about how much we pay.
There are many other factors, eg, what is deductable, audit practices.
More people should be in business.....then they'd know.
To us fans of small government, Bush was a disaster.

 

[tytlyf]

You do know, well maybe you don't, that there is more to the budget than Discretionary spending. Since you do not seem to know, the budget is made up of Discretionary, Mandatory, and Interest on the debt amounts.
However, I will give you high marks in attempting to make your point with partial data.
You did make the false statement "The biggest contributor to the debt is defense spending" didn't you.
Now let's look at the total federal budget for 2016
Source

Maybe you prefer the 2015 data

Seems as usual you are totally wrong. Defense is at 22%, Health Care is at 28% and Pensions are at 26% (percentage rounded since total is 101%). I don't know what school you went to but the last time I checked 22 is less than 28 and 26

Hmmm seems your presented "facts"(?) are a little misleading

Now lets look at your source

Seems you are using the same ploy that most people of your political persuasion use.....Finding incomplete data to support your misinformation.
Seems that your statement, as usual, is misleading. I do believe that $598.5 billion (Military) is less than $1246.6 billion and $985.7 billion and this is using your source.

Why don't you just admit that your statement was wrong and accept the facts?

It wasn't wrong. SS and medicare come out of everyones paychecks. Not with defense spending. Defense is bankrupting this nation. Wars, defense, etc have put us where we are. If someone tells you that we need to increase spending, they're lying.

 

[Acim]

Surely you have an example of 'spinning results' and getting more money?

Surely I have dozens, if not hundreds.

 

[Acim]

It wasn't wrong. SS and medicare come out of everyones paychecks. Not with defense spending. Defense is bankrupting this nation. Wars, defense, etc have put us where we are. If someone tells you that we need to increase spending, they're lying.

Shall we rejoice that Obama has become the longest war-time president?
And that Hillary promises to follow in his steps?

 

[tytlyf]

Shall we rejoice that Obama has become the longest war-time president?
And that Hillary promises to follow in his steps?

Still waiting on examples. Wasn't it republicans that wanted the war to continue and blamed Obama for pulling troops out of Iraq when Bush set the date? A lot of profit to be made off war, which is why republicans love it. Ain't capitalism grand?

 

[esmith]

It wasn't wrong. SS and medicare come out of everyones paychecks. Not with defense spending. Defense is bankrupting this nation. Wars, defense, etc have put us where we are. If someone tells you that we need to increase spending, they're lying.

The last time I checked federal income taxes comes out of everyone's paycheck. I am assuming that you are saying that everyone that works pays for SS and medicare which is true; However 45% of Americans pay zero federal income taxes. That means 46% of Americans pay for the defense, and other programs, of the other 45%. I would say that maybe defense spending isn't bankrupting the nation, could it be the 45% that don't pay for dip diddle squat, or very minute amount, is helping to bankrupt the nation.

Just what makes you the all great know-it-all when it comes to defense spending? Listing to your left wing sources I would assume. However, what makes them the experts?
Since your seem to be such an expert on defense spending why don't you put your great, in your own mind, expertise in defense requirements and tell us where they can be cut. Now saying everywhere just isn't a answer.
Of course I don't expect a viable answer from you, just more rhetoric.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The last time I checked federal income taxes comes out of everyone's paycheck. I am assuming that you are saying that everyone that works pays for SS and medicare which is true; However 45% of Americans pay zero federal income taxes. That means 46% of Americans pay for the defense, and other programs, of the other 45%. I would say that maybe defense spending isn't bankrupting the nation, could it be the 45% that don't pay for dip diddle squat, or very minute amount, is helping to bankrupt the nation.

Which is in itself a major problem, because it means almost half the country is too poor to have to pay taxes. And I don't get where you get such a high number, because anyone earning income in the normal ways is paying FICA, Social Security, and other taxes, and you don't get all that money back on your refund.

 

[tytlyf]

The last time I checked federal income taxes comes out of everyone's paycheck. I am assuming that you are saying that everyone that works pays for SS and medicare which is true; However 45% of Americans pay zero federal income taxes. That means 46% of Americans pay for the defense, and other programs, of the other 45%. I would say that maybe defense spending isn't bankrupting the nation, could it be the 45% that don't pay for dip diddle squat, or very minute amount, is helping to bankrupt the nation.

Just what makes you the all great know-it-all when it comes to defense spending? Listing to your left wing sources I would assume. However, what makes them the experts?
Since your seem to be such an expert on defense spending why don't you put your great, in your own mind, expertise in defense requirements and tell us where they can be cut. Now saying everywhere just isn't a answer.
Of course I don't expect a viable answer from you, just more rhetoric.

Do you understand what 'discretionary' means? It's different than SS or MC. If you're in favor of lower the debt, you should be in favor of lowering the ridiculous over-spending on defense. But republicans are bought and paid for by special interests that rely on the government to receive their MIC paychecks.

Everyone pays taxes, this isn't news.

 

[esmith]

Do you understand what 'discretionary' means? It's different than SS or MC.

Discretionary means it is my discretion to do something, say like trying to have a discussion with those that misuse data and make up data. However, you seem to be asking about the difference between discretionary and mandatory spending within the federal budget.
So let see if I have it right "mandatory" spending is not a "budgeted" item, it does not require Congressional approval; whereas "discretionary" is spending that has to be approved by Congress.

If you're in favor of lower the debt, you should be in favor of lowering the ridiculous over-spending on defense. But republicans are bought and paid for by special interests that rely on the government to receive their MIC paychecks.

You still have failed to say what defense items must be cut. All I hear is defense must be cut. Gets kind of tiring reading the same tired comment over and over and over.

Everyone pays taxes, this isn't news.

No, not everyone pays federal income tax , only those that work. Of those, 45% get back all they paid in(not counting FICA taxes) and in some instance more than they paid in. Also there is a percentage that get a federal tax refund even if they do not work.

 

[esmith]

Which is in itself a major problem, because it means almost half the country is too poor to have to pay taxes. And I don't get where you get such a high number, because anyone earning income in the normal ways is paying FICA, Social Security, and other taxes, and you don't get all that money back on your refund.

I get it from facts not supposition. Yes I agree that you can not get FICA taxes back in a refund. But you do get it back at some point in your life, unless you die before you become eligible for SSI and Medicare. Yes the facts are over 45% of American households (approximately 77.5 million people) will pay no income tax and some will get a larger refund than they paid in and some will get a refund even if they didn't work.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/45-of-americans-pay-no-federal-income-tax-2016-02-24

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I get it from facts not supposition. Yes I agree that you can not get FICA taxes back in a refund. But you do get it back at some point in your life, unless you die before you become eligible for SSI and Medicare. Yes the facts are over 45% of American households (approximately 77.5 million people) will pay no income tax and some will get a larger refund than they paid in and some will get a refund even if they didn't work.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/45-of-americans-pay-no-federal-income-tax-2016-02-24

From your source:
On average, those in the bottom 40% of the income spectrum end up getting money from the government. Meanwhile, the richest 20% of Americans, by far, pay the most in income taxes, forking over nearly 87% of all the income tax collected by Uncle Sam.
The richest 20% control most of the money so why wouldn't they be paying a disproportionate amount of taxes given they have a disproportionate amount of wealth?

 

[Acim]

Still waiting on examples.

Pretty much anything related to anti-smoking would be good example.
Almost everything related to vaping would be best (current) examples I could provide and provide counter scientific studies that debunk what is currently being promoted by likes of FDA and CDC as 'science.'
I'm sure I could cite many (many) more examples in other fields, but would fare better in whatever ensuing discussion might arise if we stuck to these two.

Care to dance?

Wasn't it republicans that wanted the war to continue and blamed Obama for pulling troops out of Iraq when Bush set the date? A lot of profit to be made off war, which is why republicans love it. Ain't capitalism grand?

I'm not sure if any of this is true. But I like having not voted for Bush. I wonder what it's like to be an anti-war Democrat who voted for the POTUS who ended up being the longest war time POTUS in US history? That's gotta be some kind of badge of honor, or shame. Take your pick.

 

[Acim]

If you're in favor of lower the debt, you should be in favor of lowering the ridiculous over-spending on defense.

The fiscally conservative part of me favors lowering the debt by lowering ALL spending currently occurring in government.
I always like when the government shuts down and MSM goes directly into panic mode / appealing to emotions, then literally weeks later and for sure by now, we realize that shutdown was a teeny tiny blip on the overall radar. IOW, did nothing to impact our lives, collectively. Not that I'm advocating for complete ongoing shut-down, but putting into perspective that all of it could be lessened (greatly) and while there would certainly be a whole lot of deceitful propaganda floating about, I'm guessing we'd adapt. And the fiscally conservative amongst us would rejoice that debt isn't going to a (political) problem forever and a day.

 

[esmith]

From your source:
On average, those in the bottom 40% of the income spectrum end up getting money from the government. Meanwhile, the richest 20% of Americans, by far, pay the most in income taxes, forking over nearly 87% of all the income tax collected by Uncle Sam.
The richest 20% control most of the money so why wouldn't they be paying a disproportionate amount of taxes given they have a disproportionate amount of wealth?

So, you have decided to change the subject since you can't argue with the facts. Very typical for those that use opinion vice facts for their argument. Remember I was answering your statement "

And I don't get where you get such a high number, because anyone earning income in the normal ways is paying FICA, Social Security, and other taxes, and you don't get all that money back on your refund.

Now I provided you with the answer to that question. But since it seems to fly in opposition to your "opinion"(?) you have decided to attempt to take the discussion in a different direction. I'm not playing.