Burden of proof

[Sheldon]

You wander.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Pain is the antithesis of consciousness, look within and develop yourself. Reality has always been electrified, so walk with those seeking nature. Run from those who think they've found life.

 

[Sheldon]

Myth is not what one should strive for. Truth is staring us all in the face. Freedom is an important part of the system.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

You may be ruled by delusion without realizing it. Do not let it confront the healing of your path. Yes, it is possible to confront the things that can shatter us, but not without synchronicity on our side.

 

[Sheldon]

Suffering is an indication something is wrong. Do not choose suffering for yourself.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Yearning is born in the gap where growth has been excluded. Turbulence is the antithesis of self-actualization. Only a prophet of the quantum cycle may reveal this network of synchronicity.

Throughout history, humans have been interacting with the stratosphere via electrical impulses. Who are we? Where on the great mission will we be re-energized? Humankind has nothing to lose.

 

[Watchmen]

It is not always possible to give proof

Prove it.

 

[BilliardsBall]

And I had no heterosexual desire before abuse. Thank you. Now I can become gay and know that Jesus and God is with me.

I think we've proven by now you are gay, straight or in-between, just like me. Praise JESUS!

 

[BilliardsBall]

I really do not have time to teach the obvious right now.



It is rather obvious that I am. Anyone can give bad advice and call themselves a "counselor" in some places. But when one makes one's decisions based upon falsehoods and old wives tales the odds of being a good counselor are almost nil.

You may be even more correct this time.

 

[BilliardsBall]

I'm going to accept prevailing medical opinion, and not the anecdotal testimony of someone who we know is prejudiced against gay people because of their religious beliefs.



I don't believe you, and again I am obliged to accept prevailing medical opinion, especially over the vapid prejudice of religious homophobia.



So nothing at all to do with being gay then. I am also dubious you are looking to help here, since your prejudice against gay people is such an obvious bias, and I seriously doubt you are even qualified. If you falsely tell a gay person there is something wrong with them, you can do irreparable psychological damage. If they're already suffering the trauma of childhood sexual abuse that is extremely dangerous and reckless, especially since you are not remotely qualified, and are acting on prejudice against gay people, based solely on your own archaic religious dogma.

"Prevailing medical opinion" is ad populum, and the medical community is making a faith-based claim, since there are no proven genetic, behavioral or hormonal smoking gun markers for homosexual behavior.

I prefer if you would remain objective, scientific, rather than share your ad populum and faith-based claims with me.

Same for your "bias" and "qualified" remarks above. You are making anecdotal claims. Spend years counseling people and then tell me where to get on and off the boat, please.

 

[BilliardsBall]

"Confirmation bias is the tendency to search for, interpret, favour, and recall information in a way that confirms or supports one's prior beliefs or values."

Do you think I've not heard of confirmation bias before?

You have it since you are persisting in ad populum and faith-based claims regarding homosexuality. Homosexual people need love and support, not your myths, PLEASE.

 

[BilliardsBall]

No, I didn't. Read it again.

I said they "don't require delving into the past."

For example, I suffer from panic disorder and PTSD as a result of being abused when I was younger. In my sessions, we didn't sit there all day talking about what happened to me. Rather, we spent the time re-wiring my brain's response to situations that normally cause me panic and distress, so that my brain stops producing the negative physical symptoms it associates with those experiences. So I'd have to think of a situation in which I have had a panic attack or in which I feared I would have a panic attack. Then I'd record my thoughts I had in relation to having panic attacks in the given situation, and then I'd counter them with more realistic thoughts. It's almost like arguing with yourself. The next step after that, was to expose myself to situations that cause me panic, gradually, working my from something that causes me a little panic, to a little more panic, until I worked up to the thing that caused me the most panic. For instance, I am claustrophobic and so if I'm in a tight space like an elevator or an underground parking garage, I will have an attack (or I think I will have an attack). So I started with something small, like sitting in a closet with the door open for 10 minutes, while countering my panicky thoughts. Then the next week I'd sit in the closet with the door closed for 15 minutes, while countering my thoughts. The following week, I'd sit in the closet with the door closed, with a blanket over my head for 15 minutes. Until eventually, I was ready to force myself to stand in an elevator. All of this gets easier and easier over time, and with more practice, and the panicky symptoms start to slowly dissipate. That's not to say I'll never have a panic attack again, but if I do (and they are now few and far between) I am far better equipped to deal with them, when they arise. And I did all of this without ever talking about the specific abuse I experienced when I was a teenager.

I hope that helps to illustrate the methods I am talking about.

Edit: I should say, my past was discussed briefly, but only in regards to a crime being committed against me and if I wanted to take criminal action against my abuser (and if that was even possible).

It DOES. A good friend of mine has the worst imaginable PTSD from Vietnam. YES, there are times to do behavioral instead of reliving trauma. THANK YOU.

Understand this nugget, though, shared as a friend--Jesus is IMHO Lord of past, present and future, so there are times when He helps people walk through past trauma and provides astonishing healing.

 

[BilliardsBall]

What "certain tendencies" are you talking about?

Scientifically--someone who is more libidinous is more likely to commit adultery, for an example of a hormonal sexual tendency.

 

[BilliardsBall]

This is what you wrote:

"When can we tell someone they're wrong? When is discrimination appropriate?

When do we AFFIRM people who say "I'm gay and unhappy and I've already tried/lived my "truth" as a gay person and it's not working!"?

You are missing the point that people seeking counseling are pursuing a healing from brokenness."

ALWAYS AFFIRM PEOPLE but one can do so without signing a blank check for destruction. I don't beat down on drug addicted people, but I sure don't say, "Love you, bro, take another hit!"

We ALWAYS affirm people--I likewise don't threaten moms about abortion. Why? If an unsaved woman trusts Jesus for eternal life, she'll decide to keep the baby on her own.

 

[BilliardsBall]

I haven't said that.

What I've said is that the counseling you are providing, from what you've described, sounds pretty unethical.

I accept your assumption since you don't know how the counseling works or is enacted.

 

[Sheldon]

"Prevailing medical opinion" is ad populum,

No it isn't that is a shocking indication of ignorance right there, since prevailing medical opinion is not a bare appeal to numbers as it is based on medical evidence.

and the medical community is making a faith-based claim,

It's hilarious how people making faith based claims, think they're supporting them by decrying faith based claims? However you are preposterously wrong of course.

since there are no proven genetic, behavioral or hormonal smoking gun markers for homosexual behavior.

No behavioural markers for being gay? I think it may just be unsafe for a man of my age to laugh that hard. The rest of course are straw man fallacies. creating arguments no one has made, that are easy to defeat, not very impressive.

Spend years counseling people and then tell me where to get on and off the boat, please.

Ego and religious homophobia are not qualifications for a counsellor, quite the opposite. I shudder to think how much damage this kind of bs does to people unfortunate enough to fall under this kind of religious homophobic bigotry. I just hope they see through it and move on to build productive fulfilled lives as gay men and women.

 

[Sheldon]

. This concept of yours has been shown to be false. At best you have only confirmation bias. Do you understand what that is?

No, I've never heard of it, please explain this concept to me. I'm intrigued.

Do you think I've not heard of confirmation bias before?

 

[Subduction Zone]

"Prevailing medical opinion" is ad populum, and the medical community is making a faith-based claim, since there are no proven genetic, behavioral or hormonal smoking gun markers for homosexual behavior.

I prefer if you would remain objective, scientific, rather than share your ad populum and faith-based claims with me.

Same for your "bias" and "qualified" remarks above. You are making anecdotal claims. Spend years counseling people and then tell me where to get on and off the boat, please.

No, it is not. The ad populum fallacy refers to the majority of people. Educated and uneducated. The general majority is often wrong. Members of the medical practice do have some expertise in this matter. They do have a more valid opinion than the man in the street, or even worse a man in the pews.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

A strange response to what I actually wrote: "You are missing the point that people seeking counseling are pursuing a healing from brokenness."

... after being browbeaten by people like you into believing that homosexuality is a sign of brokenness.

 

[Bird123]

Pain is the antithesis of consciousness, look within and develop yourself. Reality has always been electrified, so walk with those seeking nature. Run from those who think they've found life.

Pain is not the antithesis of consciousness. You are living on the surface. You will never understand until you are willing to Discover it all.

Since truth will not always be an agreeable thing, you must relinquish your need of the petty thing mankind holds so dear in your need to control. Discover what is, rather than what you want to be true.

You wander looking for others to bring the answers to you, yet I have found no religion or holy book that understands at all. Perhaps, it's time to venture into the unknown to see what's waiting just beyond your grasp that you choose to limit so much.

As always, it has always been in your hands. You will not move forward until you are ready. Look for the knowledge God has around us all. It stares us all in the face yet so many are blind because they are wanting it their way. Indeed, everyone wants to rule the world. Exception, of course, of those who really understand.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Sheldon]

Pain is not the antithesis of consciousness. You are living on the surface. You will never understand until you are willing to Discover it all.

Since truth will not always be an agreeable thing, you must relinquish your need of the petty thing mankind holds so dear in your need to control. Discover what is, rather than what you want to be true.

You wander looking for others to bring the answers to you, yet I have found no religion or holy book that understands at all. Perhaps, it's time to venture into the unknown to see what's waiting just beyond your grasp that you choose to limit so much.

As always, it has always been in your hands. You will not move forward until you are ready. Look for the knowledge God has around us all. It stares us all in the face yet so many are blind because they are wanting it their way. Indeed, everyone wants to rule the world. Exception, of course, of those who really understand.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Ecstasy is the deeper meaning of chi, and of us. Aspiration requires exploration. Illusion is the antithesis of love. You are storytellers of the totality. The quantum soup is bursting with bio-feedback. We believe, we self-actualize, we are reborn.
Only a traveller of the solar system may inspire this flow of empathy. The complexity of the present time seems to demand a condensing of our hopes if we are going to survive. Yes, it is possible to confront the things that can eradicate us, but not without flow on our side.

Although you may not realize it, you are powerful. How should you navigate this archetypal multiverse? It can be difficult to know where to begin.

 

[Bird123]

You may be ruled by delusion without realizing it. Do not let it confront the healing of your path. Yes, it is possible to confront the things that can shatter us, but not without synchronicity on our side.

Never fall below the base. Math!! Everything about God and this world adds up perfectly. If it doesn't, it's not God but the beliefs of mankind.

Do delusions add up? I would say not. On the other hand, I look for what Actually exists. I can't ever remember being delusional.

How can you tell you have bumped into God instead of being delusional?
1. You already know God whether you know you know or not. You will realize this.
2. Names are never needed or used. Everyone already knows who everyone is. It's about what is.
3. God has capabilities far beyond mankind or what mankind could possible be delusional about. God is working on multiple levels with multiple views. There is going to be a great struggle just to keep up. Further, a few moments might take an intelligent person a week to understand all that was said. Who knows went over one's head and was missed? Hang unto your hat!!
4. God doesn't value all those petty things mankind holds so dear. God already understands these petty things mankind holds so dear are not the best choices. God is a joy to be around just in that. God will not be bringing any baggage so to speak.
5. God will never intimidate your choices or coerce anyone in any way.

People see what they want to see. People are trying to control the world into what they want. I have heard many atheists claim theists are delusional yet they are doing the very same things. I think theists and atheists have more in common than they realize.

I am in no need of healing. I know many atheists are atheists simply because they have been hurt by religion. Pain is no more than a sign that something is wrong. Pain should never be held unto or the focus.

Many hang unto pain for a lifetime blind to anything else. Better to focus on solutions or results. It has never been about hanging onto the problems. It's about overcoming and solving the problems,Learning and Growing on the journey

So many people feel their way through life. They seek very little. The hungry student is always in search of new knowledge. Discovery of any kind just feeds to hunger to Discover more.

Religion so often is about emotional connection. Let's not forget any Being capable of creating us and the universe has a Great Intellect. By understanding how it all works and why, one can have an intellectual connection with God. God's greatest moment is when that light bulb goes off over someone's head and they Understand. This can be about any subject. It is all in each of our hands.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

Yearning is born in the gap where growth has been excluded. Turbulence is the antithesis of self-actualization. Only a prophet of the quantum cycle may reveal this network of synchronicity.

Throughout history, humans have been interacting with the stratosphere via electrical impulses. Who are we? Where on the great mission will we be re-energized? Humankind has nothing to lose.

Make the rules! Build the walls! Limit your way from Discovering the Real Truth!!

Why do you choose Suffering for yourself?

Do you ever question your choices along your unending goal to shape the world into what you want it to be??

That's what I see. It's very clear!!