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Can a literal Genesis creation story really hold up?

outhouse

outhouse

Atheistically
allfoak said:
If you want i will try again.
.
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The scriptures were written in the language of the soul.
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I don't have that much a problem with your reading of Genesis as you do not take a literal position.


But you have made claims that do not really stack up with credibility either.

Like above, they were not written in the language of soul per say. They have many different styles that were collected and compiled and redacted over hundreds and hundreds of years. Im not saying that is not part of it, it is. But as a whole no it was not.

Some of the pieces that make up parts of this collection, were partially written for entertainment, some directed at children to keep them happy in classes when whole families would gather. We also see song, poems, and literal history.

Its a hodge podge of different writing styles and collections that there is no need to take so serious, or even argue how to define correctly.
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
allfoak said:
First of all i don't have time to read all of your posts.
Second i don't need to memorize the book to understand one verse.
It is not written that way.
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Yeah, it kind of is. Each verse is set within a relevant context that needs to be taken under consideration. It's a vital part of the exegetical process that allows us to read out of the texts what's there.
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
allfoak said:
i have already answered your questions.
To tell someone what the Bible is supposed to mean to them is heresy.
Paul said it himself.

People are just making things up and calling it truth.
Someone even made up the method in which i am supposed to study the book.

let's just leave it at that.
I have no way of explaining to you on this forum that Christians are being led astray.
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That "someone" is the collective body of scholars, working collaboratively. That method has emerged, because it yields the most honest results. What you're saying here amounts to you being the "people [who] are just making things up and calling it truth." Peer-review is needed to corroborate results. IOW, it's a communal effort.
 
allfoak

allfoak

Alchemist
sojourner said:
That "someone" is the collective body of scholars, working collaboratively. That method has emerged, because it yields the most honest results. What you're saying here amounts to you being the "people [who] are just making things up and calling it truth." Peer-review is needed to corroborate results. IOW, it's a communal effort.
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nevermind

Just answer this:

How is it that you know that you know what you think you know?
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
allfoak said:
nevermind

Just answer this:

How is it that you know that you know what you think you know?
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Because I collaborated with a lot of people -- knowledgeable and simple -- scholars and non-scholars -- in studying the texts, usually through the specified exegetical process. Through that process, I developed a unique take on the texts that is uniquely mine, but that I share with the unique takes of others in order to create a broader context for understanding.
 
allfoak

allfoak

Alchemist
sojourner said:
Because I collaborated with a lot of people -- knowledgeable and simple -- scholars and non-scholars -- in studying the texts, usually through the specified exegetical process. Through that process, I developed a unique take on the texts that is uniquely mine, but that I share with the unique takes of others in order to create a broader context for understanding.
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You don't understand what i am asking.

The only thing you know is what someone else told you.
And they only know what someone else told them.
and they only know what someone else told them.
and on and on ....
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
allfoak said:
You don't understand what i am asking.

The only thing you know is what someone else told you.
And they only know what someone else told them.
and they only know what someone else told them.
and on and on ....
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Well, yeah, that's kind of how learning works. Even you -- someone who has no college education, let alone a graduate education -- you are only able to read the bible because someone else taught you to read. You can only read the bible because someone else translated the Hebrew and Greek texts into English, and because someone else wrote it, and because someone else printed it, and because someone else distributed it and sold it.

There is no "me alone."
 
allfoak

allfoak

Alchemist
sojourner said:
Well, yeah, that's kind of how learning works. Even you -- someone who has no college education, let alone a graduate education -- you are only able to read the bible because someone else taught you to read. You can only read the bible because someone else translated the Hebrew and Greek texts into English, and because someone else wrote it, and because someone else printed it, and because someone else distributed it and sold it.

There is no "me alone."
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Don't need the Bible to learn the truth.
don't even need to know how to read.
 
outhouse

outhouse

Atheistically
allfoak said:
i tried college.
It wasn't for me.
I am better at learning things on my own.
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That's how I was when I was young.

Went back later in life for these topics. It makes all the difference.


All the things you think you know, will probably change with education and knowledge. There is so much to learn here that deals with life in general.

These skills go a long way past the knowledge you think you will get.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
outhouse said:
That's how I was when I was young.

Went back later in life for these topics. It makes all the difference.


All the things you think you know, will probably change with education and knowledge. There is so much to learn here that deals with life in general.

These skills go a long way past the knowledge you think you will get.
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and could go a long way past this life!
oh!....that's right.....you want to be dust.
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
Thief said:
and could go a long way past this life!
oh!....that's right.....you want to be dust.
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So what are you saying? Knowledge is useless? I suppose that's why God gave us cognitive ability -- so we could remain ignorant, because knowledge doesn't matter.
 
gnostic

gnostic

The Lost One
allfoak said:
i have already answered your questions.
To tell someone what the Bible is supposed to mean to them is heresy.
Paul said it himself.

People are just making things up and calling it truth.
Someone even made up the method in which i am supposed to study the book.

let's just leave it at that.
I have no way of explaining to you on this forum that Christians are being led astray.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but being a disciple or apostle writing a gospel or epistle or any other (like Acts or Revelation), doesn't make what he has been writing to be a "truth".

What any religious person (not necessarily a Christian) believe to be the "truth" is not necessarily what is actually "true". The truth in any religion is as subjective as belief or faith. The truth is what a person believe to be true, but a person of another religion will believe in something different to be the truth.

And where are the truths in Revelation?

I have been here long enough to have seen some Christians doing mental contortions in trying to turn one of those revelations into the "truth"; all they succeed in doing, is turning themselves into human pretzels. :eek:
 
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